JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Weird, some people keep saying the WH has it in for Tesla.
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
It always seemed the requirement of POS payment device per charger was a major issue. While simultaneously cutting the most prolific charging network in existence from the program, it also built into the other player's sites an unnecessary failure point.
Happy to see some semblance of rational decision making happening in D.C. regarding how to most effectively promote an electrified future.
Better yet look at all the ingredients
TrendTrader007
Active Member
Very powerful V shaped rally
Excellent time to sell TSLA and lock in profits
(You can always buy it back over $1000 later)
Excellent time to sell TSLA and lock in profits
(You can always buy it back over $1000 later)
That could be because people saw president Biden announcing that ford was leading the way in EV adoption. I believe he even added at the end that he was not kidding
They did, until their hand got forced (I think mainly by Twitter) because the WH was starting to look really stupid by not acknowledging the number one BEV maker and the number of jobs Tesla created.
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
7M share volume in the Pre-Market hours, +2M at the opening minute
all systems Norminal
all systems Norminal
Headline I saw on this yesterday: "Tesla Autopilot workers vote to uninize"
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Pandering to union supporters is not the same as having it in for Tesla, not even close. Actual legislation has benefited Tesla.
The White House announcement provides some numbers of expected non-Tesla charging spots:
Tesla, for the first time, will open a portion of its U.S. Supercharger and Destination Charger network to non-Tesla EVs, making at least 7,500 chargers available for all EVs by the end of 2024. The open chargers will be distributed across the United States. They will include at least 3,500 new and existing 250 kW Superchargers along highway corridors to expand freedom of travel for all EVs, and Level 2 Destination Charging at locations like hotels and restaurants in urban and rural locations. All EV drivers will be able to access these stations using the Tesla app or website. Additionally, Tesla will more than double its full nationwide network of Superchargers, manufactured in Buffalo, New York.
Tesla currently has around 17.5k Supercharger stalls (at 1.7k US locations), so doubling that is around 35k chargers. So roughly 10% of Superchargers will be open to non-Teslas. Does this suggest that Tesla can access billions of government funding by providing 1 CCS adapter for every 10 Supercharger stalls? Supercharger V3 are built in sets of 4 stalls, so maybe having a CCS adapter in each set could have federal funding cover a lot of general Supercharger buildout costs that are still all providing value to Tesla owners?
TesslaBull
Member
Curious about the details of opening superchargers to all EV's:
1) Is Tesla getting incentives for making current stations accessible?
2) Will all chargers at each location be available for all EV's?
3) Will there still be any dedicated Tesla only plugs?
This could potentially be an enormous benefit to all EV's other than Tesla, while being of significant detriment to Tesla owners.
1) Is Tesla getting incentives for making current stations accessible?
2) Will all chargers at each location be available for all EV's?
3) Will there still be any dedicated Tesla only plugs?
This could potentially be an enormous benefit to all EV's other than Tesla, while being of significant detriment to Tesla owners.
Musskiah
DisGruntled
Hertz ended 2022 with about 50k Telsas in their 428.7k fleet, and fell short of the 100k Teslas by 2022 goal they headlined in Oct 2021. So by saying 25% of their fleet will be EVs by EOY 2024, it seems they are simply reiterating 100k Teslas, but 2 years late.
Lot of speculation on Tesla's next price hike so I'll add my own...especially as today's charging network announcement (from Washington vs. Tesla no less), makes me think that Tesla already knows they will retain the full $7500 rebate come March (no doubt it "came up" in Musk's discussion with the administration).
If the $7500 rebate is a given for them (minimally for the next several months) then the only hurdle is the $80K price cap. Today, if you fully option a Model Y long range (red, white interior, 20" rims, 7 seat, tow hook and FSD) - the price is like $79,900 or so....a hair beneath the $80K cap. Any raise in price would push it over the top. I am assuming Tesla does not want to torpedo the already small FSD take rate so what do they do. I think they "sacrifice" the 7 seat option and possibly the tow hook. The take rate on the 7 seat has to be pretty low too and it is pricey at $4k. The tow hook ($1k) can be added after-the-fact. In short, I think the next price hike (or perhaps couple of price hikes) is in the $4K to $5K range. Now, they may not get that aggressive, but I think that is the runway. Operating Margin Secured! Oh, and I think we get the IRS announcement early in March (maybe even on the 1st).
One other "wild card" is whether the IRS will cut the Hyundai/Kia/Genesis/etc guys any slack and let them qualify for some of the rebate (making them more price competitive). Given the focus on 'Murica! for the IRA that seems less likely, but it is possible....still, it is in the noise given the relatively low volumes they are able to produce...
We'll see...
If the $7500 rebate is a given for them (minimally for the next several months) then the only hurdle is the $80K price cap. Today, if you fully option a Model Y long range (red, white interior, 20" rims, 7 seat, tow hook and FSD) - the price is like $79,900 or so....a hair beneath the $80K cap. Any raise in price would push it over the top. I am assuming Tesla does not want to torpedo the already small FSD take rate so what do they do. I think they "sacrifice" the 7 seat option and possibly the tow hook. The take rate on the 7 seat has to be pretty low too and it is pricey at $4k. The tow hook ($1k) can be added after-the-fact. In short, I think the next price hike (or perhaps couple of price hikes) is in the $4K to $5K range. Now, they may not get that aggressive, but I think that is the runway. Operating Margin Secured! Oh, and I think we get the IRS announcement early in March (maybe even on the 1st).
One other "wild card" is whether the IRS will cut the Hyundai/Kia/Genesis/etc guys any slack and let them qualify for some of the rebate (making them more price competitive). Given the focus on 'Murica! for the IRA that seems less likely, but it is possible....still, it is in the noise given the relatively low volumes they are able to produce...
We'll see...
BrownOuttaSpec
Active Member
Did anyone get a chance to see what the other companies are doing from the FACT SHEET: Biden-Harris Administration Announces New Standards and Major Progress for a Made-in-America National Network of Electric Vehicle Chargers? Legacy Auto just doesn't have a clue. (Read the full article to see what Tesla and everyone else is doing)
That's like signing up to bring napkins to the team potluck party.
- General Motors, in partnership with FLO, has announced a collaborative effort with dealers to install up to 40,000 public Level 2 EV chargers in local communities by 2026 through GM’s Dealer Community Charging Program [Announced in Oct 2021]. The new charging stations will join the GM’s Ultium Charge 360 network, and will be available to all EV drivers.
- Ford has committed to installing at least one public-facing DC Fast charger with two ports at 1,920 Ford dealerships by January 2024.
That's like signing up to bring napkins to the team potluck party.
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You Sir are a record holder in my book!
I say it again - as long as we lock the TESLA PLUG to be THE STANDARD I am good with opening the chargers. No need for another several iterations. Remember USB nightmare?
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
Didn't someone post that software options (FSD, AP, entertainment, etc.) are not counted in the price for the purpose of the tax credit?
StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
The cost of software features is not included in the $80K cap. A Tesla customer can buy a $79K Model Y and add a $15K FSD option on top of that and still qualify for the full $7,500 tax credit.
Pandering is the right word here, good call. Maybe it is difficult inside Lobby Central to do what's right, but I think a few here got the sense that Washington was openly against Tesla by falsely promoting competitors (GM and Ford both). It sure fooled me (pandering part) along with all the folks who bought those other brands and now waiting for some miracle to happen... like charging.
Tech issues aside, it appears the industry wants to get between your wallet and their receivables. Presumably for taxes and "delivery" charges...
bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
This is correct.
It's also not something many have considered, but before the IRS updated guidance to include all Model Y's at the 80k cap, one thing Tesla could have done was unbundle basic autopilot from the sale (currently included with all Teslas). That would have helped push more cars below the threshold, but it is not needed now.
I know many have reported the addition of CCS facilities to some superchargers but thought I would put the link to the Washington post article.
Keep in mind that this is only in the US. Canada and Mexico will continue as per normal.
Keep in mind that this is only in the US. Canada and Mexico will continue as per normal.
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