Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[UkNorthampton]

"Godfather of the Electric Car" and "First Gigafactory" (Nissan Sunderland) - Andy Palmer interview. Covers a wide range of areas which relate to Tesla/EVs (but rarely if ever mentioning Tesla)

1. Battery talk/affordable EVs - something like 24 minutes in.
2. City smells improved (tailpipe emissions/particulates from buses/taxis) 27+ minutes
3. Hydrogen not in cars, but uses in industrial processes - 31+ minutes
4. Ridicule of EVs & FUD from bad journalists - ridicule of ignorant journalists 32+ minutes
5. Batterirs - energy density & cost changes + range/charger anxiety, right size of battery 24-30 kWh for B Segment car (Leaf)- 37+ minutes
6. Bladder range of 150 miles / 800 volt / fast charging batteries (E33 cell from Andy's new company) - 39+ minutes
7. Micromobility/integrated transport/autonomy/car sharing - 41+ minutes
8. Trends with younger generation - 44 minutes
9. Charging Networks (PodPoint mostly) - 46 minutes

 

[Mengy]

NKLA, WKHS, and GOEV are popping today but TSLA is barely breaking even. Sounds reasonable!

 

[StarFoxisDown!]

NKLA, WKHS, and GOEV are popping today but TSLA is barely breaking even. Sounds reasonable!

Nothing like a well time Rueters “source” to pop up. The amount of these types of “source” articles combined with anything related to Autopilot and the letter’s NHSTA that come out anytime after the market sells off TSLA for whatever reason is remarkably consistent. Happens every time

 

[mad474]

Maybe there is a little bit more information about the Tesla acquisition "Wiferion" according to

Neue deutsche Tesla-Tochter: Drahtlos-Startup Wiferion kostete bis zu 76 Millionen Dollar

Tesla hat das deutsche Startup Wiferion übernommen und könnte es für seine Energie-Sparte nutzen. Der Preis betrug offenbar 76 Mio. Dollar.

teslamag.de

New German Tesla subsidiary: wireless startup Wiferion cost up to $76 million

Blue Inductive, founded in 2016 as a specialist in power electronics and energy storage, has been given a new name for the second time: A good three years after its founding, it was renamed Wiferion - and at the end of June, Tesla Engineering Germany, meaning it now belongs to the electric car manufacturer. And Tesla apparently paid quite a bit for the purchase: a figure in the financial report for the second quarter suggests a price of up to $76 million.

German startup now a Tesla subsidiary

The imminent purchase of Wiferion by Tesla had already been reported in June. According to a commercial register entry, the shareholders had their intention to sell the startup to Tesla International B.V., the European subsidiary of the U.S. company, notarized at a notary public in the middle of the month. A little over a week later, the time had actually come: the company's name was changed to Tesla Enginering GmbH in the commercial register.

At the end of last week, the old logo was still visible on the Wiferion website, but the new company was already listed in the imprint. The new Tesla subsidiary lists charging and battery systems as well as "smart robot charging" without cables as its products and describes itself as "the leading provider of automated, contactless energy transfer in the industry."

So far, the company has mainly been looking after industrial customers. As part of Tesla, it could thus help to make electric car production there more efficient. In addition, the planned Optimus robot could also benefit from new possibilities for wireless charging, and of course an electric car charging solution with Wiferion technology would also be conceivable. There was a hint of a Tesla wallbox without cables in the form of a photo (see above) at Investors Day in early March.

Inverter as new focus?

However, Wiferion's business purpose was changed at the same time as the name. The company is now intended to provide products and services "in power electronics and other engineering disciplines" in support of the development of electric cars and stationary energy storage and generation, including photovoltaics. That sounds like a new or additional focus: technical support for inverters that Tesla needs for cars, battery systems like solar.

The price for the acquisition is not clear from the commercial register entries. But it may be possible to glean it from Tesla's second-quarter financial report. The cash flow statement mentions a $76 million outflow for "business combinations," or mergers of companies. Because there are otherwise no known acquisitions by Tesla in the second quarter, the entire amount may have gone to former Wiferion shareholders. One of the largest of these was the High-Tech Gründerfonds set up by the German government.


Teslamag is in some ways comparable to Electrek, so please treat accordingly

 

[Cobbler]

This is why Tesla Vision is superior:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1686038395229769728

 

[M|S|M MYP]

NKLA, WKHS, and GOEV are popping today but TSLA is barely breaking even. Sounds reasonable!

Tesla Rival Scores Important EV Truck Deal With Supply Chain Giant

Nikola shares moved firmly higher Monday after the electric truckmaker confirmed a thirteen unit order from transport group J.B. Hunt . Nikola said J.B. Hunt Transport, a subsidiary of the transport and logistics group, will buy thirteen of its Class 8 zer0-emissions trucks, including ten...

finance.yahoo.com

 

[bkp_duke]

2024 Chevy Blazer EV prices and range revealed, starting at $57K with as much as 320 miles range

The newest electric SUV is about to hit the streets. Chevrolet confirmed on Monday that the Blazer EV is leaving...

electrek.co

HA HA HA HA HA


Wasn't this supposed to be a $30k SUV?

EDIT - apparently it was the Equinox that was supposed to drop at 30k.

 

[JupiterMan]

Tesla Rival Scores Important EV Truck Deal With Supply Chain Giant

Nikola shares moved firmly higher Monday after the electric truckmaker confirmed a thirteen unit order from transport group J.B. Hunt . Nikola said J.B. Hunt Transport, a subsidiary of the transport and logistics group, will buy thirteen of its Class 8 zer0-emissions trucks, including ten...

finance.yahoo.com

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with a 1.9bn market cap and +17% return in stock price today, for 13 trucks, by my math each individual truck sale has added about 24 million to NKLAs valuation.

Are we certain markets are rational?

 

[Cosmacelf]

with a 1.9bn market cap and +17% return in stock price today, for 13 trucks, by my math each individual truck sale has added about 24 million to NKLAs valuation.

Are we certain markets are rational?

No, we are not. The person who said that about financial markets probably also said that prediction markets are worth anything at all. Always do your own research. Everyone else is looking for shortcuts, so the person that puts in the real work of research will win.

I'm realizing this with medicine too. Doctors prescribe pills, which is a shortcut. The hard work of diet, exercise/workouts is what really makes you healthy, not the pill shortcut. This goes for many surgeries too! Rehab and other therapies are often the better choice than a surgery, which again, is a quick "fix". Of course rehab is slow and painful, but the outcome may be dramatically better (speaking from experience).

And yes, of course, there are always exceptions, but most people don't fall into that bucket.

 

[cliff harris]

with a 1.9bn market cap and +17% return in stock price today, for 13 trucks, by my math each individual truck sale has added about 24 million to NKLAs valuation.

Are we certain markets are rational?

Markets WOULD be rational if there was actual serious analysis of facts done by finances news sites, and they were not just full of paid propaganda and rage-bait click-fests designed to stuff whatever keywords generated the most ad revenue.
Eventually though, it becomes impossible to ignore the facts. The concentrated FUD tsunami aimed at TSLA means you wont see common sense reflected in the stock price until the numbers become ridiculous, at which point we enjoy a *correction* upwards.

The media loves to convey the idea that there are rivals to the semi, for example, which is true, but those companies seem uninterested in mass-adoption and mass production. Elon doesn't do anything half-heartedly. I would love to know the internal targets for Tesla semi production once they are ramped up. I suspect 'analysts' will be caught like rabbits in semi-headlights.

 

[Singuy]

with a 1.9bn market cap and +17% return in stock price today, for 13 trucks, by my math each individual truck sale has added about 24 million to NKLAs valuation.

Are we certain markets are rational?

Only in the long term. With options, shorts, puts and calls..in the short term is all about taking lunch money from those who are lease suspected. They don't call it a casino for nothing.

 

[MP3Mike]

with a 1.9bn market cap and +17% return in stock price today, for 13 trucks, by my math each individual truck sale has added about 24 million to NKLAs valuation.

Are we certain markets are rational?

What do you think will happen when Nikola recalls all of their BEVs because of faulty battery packs? I am guessing that they will have to, they've had at least one truck/pack catch fire on its own twice, and they stopped using those packs and sold off the battery division that they bought, Romeo, to create the packs. (It seems like a real mess over there, I don't understand how anyone can stay invested in them.)

Probably only because Tesla hasn't started producing/selling the Tesla Semi in any numbers.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

What do you think will happen when Nikola recalls all of their BEVs because of faulty battery packs? I am guessing that they will have to, they've had at least one truck/pack catch fire on its own twice, and they stopped using those packs and sold off the battery division that they bought, Romeo, to create the packs. (It seems like a real mess over there, I don't understand how anyone can stay invested in them.)

Probably only because Tesla hasn't started producing/selling the Tesla Semi in any numbers.

NKLA stock will probably go up when they announce the 'recall', that is how the stock market works with everything that does not pertain to Tesla right?

 

[GrandEnigma]

Just took delivery of our R1S, can confirm there are many little quality of life differences that make Teslas continue to stand out for me from an overall UX/UI experience. Some can be fixed over time with software updates, but others are just fundamental to the Tesla ecosystem and design mentality. Just thought I would share a data-point I found for myself that reinforces my position.

 

[Patrick66]

While it is hard to tell what’s inside a cube, I would estimate these buildings are as tall as gigaTexas. Plenty of room for multi stories. Also, they have about 1,000 more acres to build on.

Ford is going for a clear-span space frame roof structure that is about 12' deep and structure height looks to be 60'. I haven't been in Ford factory since the 80's, but more recent photos I have seen focus on the same general arrangement: assembly on the ground and logistics/conveyors high above.

(Tesla's Texas roof is ~75' high and beam depth is about 4' with a 45' clear span.)

 

[unk45]

Markets WOULD be rational if there was actual serious analysis of facts done by finances news sites, and they were not just full of paid propaganda and rage-bait click-fests designed to stuff whatever keywords generated the most ad revenue.
Eventually though, it becomes impossible to ignore the facts. The concentrated FUD tsunami aimed at TSLA means you wont see common sense reflected in the stock price until the numbers become ridiculous, at which point we enjoy a *correction* upwards.

The media loves to convey the idea that there are rivals to the semi, for example, which is true, but those companies seem uninterested in mass-adoption and mass production. Elon doesn't do anything half-heartedly. I would love to know the internal targets for Tesla semi production once they are ramped up. I suspect 'analysts' will be caught like rabbits in semi-headlights.

If we lived in a rational world. Were there a rational species only Darwinian simplicity might suffice.
Human beings are not rational beings. Most of us might live to think we are, but that is untrue.
Markets reflect emotions, rational characteristics and superficial inferences. Even the very existence of Tesla, the object of our devotion, would never have happened with purely rational decisions.

An old, perhaps even true, Albert Einstein allegedly said :
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

How can anyone imagine rational markets can exist?

 

[unk45]

Fair point.

Fair, I write: not Good, and definitely not Excellent. To earn those accolades, I should think you would want to show:

1. Examples of car carriers catching on fire before the era of EV transport by same, and

2. A synopsis of carrier fires that have happened at and since that point, and which of them conclusively have been shown to be EV-generated.

But I have edited the original post to include your point, and given you the deserved nod.

"There were 209 ship fires reported during 2022, the highest number in a decade and 17% more than in 2021, according to an insurance report. Of that, 13 occurred on car carriers, but how many involved EVs was not available."

EV technology could be a risk to under-prepared maritime shippers

There were 209 ship fires reported during 2022, the highest number in a decade and 17% more than in 2021, according to an insurance report. Of that, 13 occurred on car carriers, but how many involved EVs was not available.

www.autonews.com

Articles such as this are increasing. The growing presumption is that BEV's are the primary culprit. At least Automotive News presents the issue of inadequate RORO fire protection, which predates BEV profusion.
Tesla appears to have had little incidence.

 

[Electroman]

I don’t recall all 3 indices being so flat most of the day.

 

[StarFoxisDown!]

US rent prices finally showing signs of cooling down

Asking rents in the U.S. fell to 7.1% in August, down from 8.4% at the end of July.

abcnews.go.com

Yeah so about that inflation...

Some of us have been pointing out for 6 months now that discrepancy between what's been counted as rent inflation (delayed data and flawed data gathering by asking what renters "expect" to get presently and going forward) and what real-time rent data has shown. Not only have real time rent rates and lease renewal increases been slowing dramatically for the past 6 months, but they're actually going negative now.

In Seattle alone, the number of high-rise apt and condo buildings that have completed construction and officially opened over the past 6 months is nuts. You're talking 5-6 high rises...all with 500+ units in them.

 

[Electroman]

An hour to go and still flat as a pancake.