This place is dead as a doornail - are we all just waiting for Highland?

[scoob1]

Good post this one - and thanks for the add to the forums admin.

I’ve been reading through some stuff while I almost literally sit on the fence (UK) on whether to wait (could be a while here for the new model with what I understand is “hardware 4” incl significant upgrade to camera capability and refined suspension, or whether to go for existing inventory here in the UK. And good to hear all this chat about what works/doesn’t work (can only get so much from a test drive).

Are there people who now have that new ‘Highland’ Model 3 that had the previous one and have experience of the differences in real life now?

 

[robertchow]

Hello, my first post. I ordered a RWD Model 3 on the lot and will take delivery on Friday (if I can get the money transferred by then). Then I found out that Tesla introduced a new RWD MY variant. Oh well, the RWD M3 is fine for my needs and Tesla has knocked $2K off for an inventory vehicle. I suspect blue is not the most popular color. I normally go with a blend into the background white color but the deal was too good to pass up. I've already got a new pair of Tesla roof racks & an Adams graphene/ceramic coating kit arriving. I've used the Adams product on my Kia Niro EV and it's very good.

 

[Mayer]

Price dropped on special Order M3s today.
RWD now $38,990 from $40,240
Small drop.
Could price drop more ahead of Highland release?

 

[ucmndd]

Price dropped on special Order M3s today.
RWD now $38,990 from $40,240
Small drop.
Could price drop more ahead of Highland release?

As you’ve seen for the last couple months, anyone paying attention was already paying lower prices than these new MSRPs. So yeah, expect more discounts before the end of the year.

 

[Mayer]

As you’ve seen for the last couple months, anyone paying attention was already paying lower prices than these new MSRPs. So yeah, expect more discounts before the end of the year.

Yes, previous inventory RWD pricing dipped to $36,220, never lower.
Given $1,250 price drop on MSRP, perhaps RWD inventory pricING will drop proportionally to $34,970.
And anyone paying attention knows some people scoffed at idea the full $7,500 tax credit would be made available to people earning less than $50k.
And yet, not only is the credit available, it will be made available at the point of sale.
Will inventory prices drop further in 2023?
Hopefully.
Will these prices remain available in January when the full, POS, $7,500 tax credit is available to everyone earning less than $50k? It pays, to pay attention.

 

[clerks]

Once we accept that Tesla is not a luxury brand the interior makes sense.

Interesting take to me and probably true. I was debating this in the M3P thread. If Tesla is not aiming to be a luxury brand but rather a car for the masses, why bother with a Performance variant? Why bother with the Model X or S? Why bother with the Plaid? I'm genuinely interested in seeing how this plays out. I enjoyed my M3P but the poor build quality and subpar interior left me cold. I wish Tesla would head in the other direction and try to compete on some level with the Germans but it appears that is not the plan. Time will tell if it's the right move.

 

[Kairide]

Interesting take to me and probably true. I was debating this in the M3P thread. If Tesla is not aiming to be a luxury brand but rather a car for the masses, why bother with a Performance variant? Why bother with the Model X or S? Why bother with the Plaid? I'm genuinely interested in seeing how this plays out. I enjoyed my M3P but the poor build quality and subpar interior left me cold. I wish Tesla would head in the other direction and try to compete on some level with the Germans but it appears that is not the plan. Time will tell if it's the right move.

Speed doesn’t equal luxury.

 

[clerks]

Speed doesn’t equal luxury.

No but they do tend to hand in hand. I think the world of buyers that value paying a premium for pure speed but without luxury is a fairly small one. So if Tesla is truly aiming to be a producer of low cost EVs to the masses, I would expect the Performance/Plaid variants to just die off.

 

[T3SLAROD]

Interesting take to me and probably true. I was debating this in the M3P thread. If Tesla is not aiming to be a luxury brand but rather a car for the masses, why bother with a Performance variant? Why bother with the Model X or S? Why bother with the Plaid? I'm genuinely interested in seeing how this plays out. I enjoyed my M3P but the poor build quality and subpar interior left me cold. I wish Tesla would head in the other direction and try to compete on some level with the Germans but it appears that is not the plan. Time will tell if it's the right move.

Not necessarily. The GTR is not about luxury. Neither were the EVO, Mustang, Camaro, WRX, etc. etc. etc.

 

[clerks]

Not necessarily. The GTR is not about luxury. Neither were the EVO, Mustang, Camaro, WRX, etc. etc. etc.

Sure, there are stripped down performance cars, but not stripped down to the level of a Tesla TBH. Maybe Tesla will keep making really fast cars with cheap interiors. Just seems like a collision of concepts to me. The cars you listed offer more in terms of a visceral driving experience and traditional enthusiasts do value those qualities whereas a Tesla is mostly a one pedal, noiseless experience. Not judging that negatively - the M3P is plenty of fun to drive minus the crap suspension.

 

[NCDAG's M3P]

True, however then why would the CEO try and compare a M3P to a BMW M3? That would insinuate that the car competes in that league ,no? It’s one of the reasons I purchased a M3P and not another C63S from Mercedes-Benz. So I have to tend to agree with @clerks , that they kinda need to pick a lane for what they want to be. Are you a mass brand that wants to compete with Toyota or are you a Premium brand that wants to compete with BMW. I paid 70k for my car back in June of ‘22 (no FSD) for a car that now is being sold for a lot less and then people are getting a 7500 rebate back on top of that already reduced price ? Doesn’t show any integrity in the brand or that it’s a premium or luxury brand by any means.

 

[jjrandorin]

No but they do tend to hand in hand. I think the world of buyers that value paying a premium for pure speed but without luxury is a fairly small one. So if Tesla is truly aiming to be a producer of low cost EVs to the masses, I would expect the Performance/Plaid variants to just die off.

They have them because they are profitable (more profitable than the "car for the masses" version). Unlike the German cars, that have numerous differences in "M" / "AMG" / "RS" trim, on a Tesla 3/ Y its the same battery as the Long Range, the version of the motor they tested can support the output, and some extraneous stuff like tires and a spoiler.

Its much much more profitable for them, but none of that = luxury.

Thats why the performance variants look just like the regular ones, its just more profitable, not more luxurious, so its basically free money from Teslas point of view (but none of that has anything to do with "luxury").

 

[jjrandorin]

True, however then why would the CEO try and compare a M3P to a BMW M3? That would insinuate that the car competes in that league ,no? It’s one of the reasons I purchased a M3P and not another C63S from Mercedes-Benz. So I have to tend to agree with @clerks , that they kinda need to pick a lane for what they want to be. Are you a mass brand that wants to compete with Toyota or are you a Premium brand that wants to compete with BMW. I paid 70k for my car back in June of ‘22 (no FSD) for a car that now is being sold for a lot less and then people are getting a 7500 rebate back on top of that already reduced price ? Doesn’t show any integrity in the brand or that it’s a premium or luxury brand by any means.

All of the complaints about the price drops boil down to the fact that, for a Tesla, everyone knows what everyone else paid, while for a normal transaction, you have no idea what your neighbor paid.. because even if they tell you, they are probably not telling the entire truth about what they paid.

 

[Kairide]

No but they do tend to hand in hand.

It’s actually the opposite, true performance cars are not luxurious. They are stripped down to save on weight.

 

[NCDAG's M3P]

All of the complaints about the price drops boil down to the fact that, for a Tesla, everyone knows what everyone else paid, while for a normal transaction, you have no idea what your neighbor paid.. because even if they tell you, they are probably not telling the entire truth about what they paid.

I’ll agree to disagree, I’ve never seen a manufacturer discount their top selling models $15k. Whether sticker price or not, a lot of German cars at least, still have mark ups here in LA

 

[jjrandorin]

I’ll agree to disagree, I’ve never seen a manufacturer discount their top selling models $15k. Whether sticker price or not, a lot of German cars at least, still have mark ups here in LA

They absolutely do, in front line and backline incentives. My BMW X3 M40I that I leased in 2019 had a MSRP of like 68k and I paid 54k for it. This was also for a custom ordered by me, fully loaded, brand new not "sitting on the lot" vehicle. If you want to talk about "Since Covid" as a qualifier, then it would depend on models, but yes, People get thousands and sometimes 10s of thousands off German cars.

A forum member here, this year, leased a Merc EQS that has a sticker price of 120k for 660 a month. The difference is, the car MSRP didnt change, but those cars depreciate 50% in like a year.

The difference is, Everytime Tesla changes price at all, everyone knows (and wants to talk about) it.

 

[Kairide]

I’ll agree to disagree, I’ve never seen a manufacturer discount their top selling models $15k. Whether sticker price or not, a lot of German cars at least, still have mark ups here in LA

They do, just with different names and tactics. Tesla isn’t knocking $15k off their cars. They jacked up their prices during the pandemic and are now lowering them based on the market. It’s the same as a dealership marking up a car $15k and then selling it for MSRP or lower to move it.

 

[NCDAG's M3P]

They do, just with different names and tactics. Tesla isn’t knocking $15k off their cars. They jacked up their prices during the pandemic and are now lowering them based on the market. It’s the same as a dealership marking up a car $15k and then selling it for MSRP or lower to move it.

Totally and agree with what you’re saying. Guess it’s just the way it’s presented that doesn’t sit right. Tesla moves the actual msrp around whereas legacy lists the markup as such.

 

[NCDAG's M3P]

They absolutely do, in front line and backline incentives. My BMW X3 M40I that I leased in 2019 had a MSRP of like 68k and I paid 54k for it. This was also for a custom ordered by me, fully loaded, brand new not "sitting on the lot" vehicle. If you want to talk about "Since Covid" as a qualifier, then it would depend on models, but yes, People get thousands and sometimes 10s of thousands off German cars.

A forum member here, this year, leased a Merc EQS that has a sticker price of 120k for 660 a month. The difference is, the car MSRP didnt change, but those cars depreciate 50% in like a year.

The difference is, Everytime Tesla changes price at all, everyone knows (and wants to talk about) it.

My Tesla lost 50% of its value in a year too so not sure why that matters in the price paid but good to know. I’ll definitely ask the dealer I work with about that , didn’t realize MB was giving such big discounts on their EV lineup. Thanks for the info

 

[Kairide]

I’ll definitely ask the dealer I work with about that , didn’t realize MB was giving such big discounts on their EV lineup.

Before I got my inventory M3 in August we were looking for a Prius, but all had $3k - $12k markups. Pretty much all of the legacy dealerships with EVs in their lineups are having trouble moving them and are heavily discounting them. The ID4 which was hard to get, and had markups a year ago are piling up. The dealer down the street has around 10 sitting up front. The Toyota dealership next door has a handful of BZ4Xs sitting there as well.