Tow Hitch Waiting Room

[MrBadger]

At least 3 references I have found saying that nose and tongue weights are the same thing

This is from the UK site Guide to Noseweight -

The terms Noseweight, S Value, Vertical Load Limit and Tongue Load are all different terms for the same thing.

Basically, nose weight is lesser of

1. Towball
2. Vehicle
3. Towbar

The bike rack will also have maximum load - in my case, 60kg.

So hoping that manual is stating least capable of the items too. Bit pointless stating 91kg and only supplying a towball with 54kg capacity.

Noseweight
Nose Weight
Static Vertical Coupling Load
Towball Down Load
Hitch Limit
Tongue Load
Tongue Weight
‘S’ Value

All alternative names for the same thing – your car handbook may use any of these

 

[davidmc]

Seen this photo below regards bikes on back? Not sure if it helps?

 

[MrBadger]

Nice bit of ground clearance below rack - our driveway starts on a slope up - I know its going to be bike rack specific, but images I've seen of my Thule rack look to be sitting quite high on the hitch.

I'm feeling less concerned now. But even if it was 54kg limit, I've probably still got significant weight capacity to spare.

 

[Peteski]

Second reference I have found saying that nose and tongue weights are the same thing

This is from the UK site Guide to Noseweight -



Basically, nose weight is lesser of

1. Towball
2. Vehicle
3. Towbar

The bike rack will also have maximum load - in my case, 60kg.

So hoping that manual is stating least capable of the items too.

In your link they are merely substituting the word "noseweight" directly in place of "tongue weight". This is all about towing trailers and caravans and not unsupported loads like a bike rack.

From the Model X user manual:-

"The hitch receiver is designed to support vertical loads of up to 120 lbs (54 kg). When carrying bicycles or other items on the Model X hitch, always check to ensure that the maximum weight is not exceeded. When calculating weight, remember to include the weight of the accessory carrier. For example, assuming the carrier weighs 40 lbs, the weight threshold is sufficient for carrying two bicycles weighing approximately 40 lbs each, or four bicycles weighing approximately 20 lbs each."

Then on the following page it talks about trailers/caravans:-

Maximum trailer towing capacity 2250 kg
Maximum trailer tongue weight 227 kg

So they are not the same thing. Being a professional mechanical engineer I understand why there is a difference, but that would be a longer post!

 

[Peteski]

I'm feeling less concerned now. But even if it was 54kg limit, I've probably still got significant weight capacity to spare.

I have a feeling it will be 54 kg, but very unlikely to be any higher. But it could well be lower too and that's what I'm trying to warn people about.

 

[MrBadger]

I get turning moments and all that but likes of Thule state in their manual that if hitch had a vertical load capacity, then the bike rack plus bikes must not exceed that. Without doing the maths, I assume that Thule do not feel the weight of bikes cantilevered within 50cm of the pivot point to have significant impact on things. They could easily have given different limits in their manual to compensate for this, but they do not.

I appreciate what you are trying to say, but if it was felt to be an issue, I would have thought that it would be pretty obviously stated in manuals and not be subject to a google search to find the info. Different thing altogether if Tesla stated different tongue load for bike racks in their manual, but they don't - although this may come as an addendum to their tow hitch!

But I will contact Thule and Tesla to double check. Yes, Tesla may well come back with a different limit for bike racks, but by quick schoolboy maths, I cannot see it being a huge amount.

 

[Peteski]

I get turning moments and all that but likes of Thule state in their manual that if hitch had a vertical load capacity, then the bike rack plus bikes must not exceed that. Without doing the maths, I assume that Thule do not feel the weight of bikes cantilevered within 50cm of the pivot point to have significant impact on things. They could easily have given different limits in their manual to compensate for this, but they do not.

I appreciate what you are trying to say, but if it was felt to be an issue, I would have thought that it would be pretty obviously stated in manuals and not be subject to a google search to find the info. Different thing altogether if Tesla stated different tongue load for bike racks in their manual, but they don't - although this may come as an addendum to their tow hitch!

But I will contact Thule and Tesla to double check. Yes, Tesla may well come back with a different limit for bike racks, but by quick schoolboy maths, I cannot see it being a huge amount.


View attachment 436080

The problem is that Tesla have not yet stated a max load for accessory racks on the M3. I've already told you that the max load limit for wheeled trailers is much higher than for bike racks on the Model X (227 vs 54 kg). So you certainly can't rely on the trailer tongue weight figure for this. It makes sense because the dynamic loading on the tow bar from a 50 kg bike rack when you go over bumps will be far higher than a trailer with a 50 kg tongue weight.

Thule don't have a clue what the max load rating is for an M3 tow bar so their guide depends on you actually knowing that figure. It's easy for a Model X because they state a clear figure of 54 kg in the user manual. So from the Thule chart I could safely carry 32 kg of bikes. But for the Model 3 we only know the trailer tongue weight, which is likely to be far higher. The manual appears to say nothing about accessory racks (yet)

 

[pmg102]

Still no one in the forum with a tow bar, and a delivery date?!

 

[Avendit]

Nope. Keep an eye on the spread sheet. There are less than 10 of us, including someone with an order in the 600's I think, and none of us even got the prep for delivery text.

I'm sitting on a 'deliveries continue' message, but nothing specific to me. I think end of Sept now at the earliest.

 

[Rooster6655]

Still no one in the forum with a tow bar, and a delivery date?!

If you ordered in May then you have the best chance of getting it early but if you ordered after the price change I can't see it being on the first batch of deliveries incoming

 

[pmg102]

If you ordered in May then you have the best chance of getting it early but if you ordered after the price change I can't see it being on the first batch of deliveries incoming

Order number ~225 (7:50 on 1st May), with a 2018 reservation... But I only added the towbar mid-July when the price drops meant it only effectveily cost me £500, not the full £1k.

I'm also a bit torn... as I'm currently down as a cash buyer... but I'd rather get it as a company car through LeasePlan. But LeasePlan haven't updated their prices since the price-drop... ideally LP would release prices, I'd order, give them my reservation slot, and get it the start of September. But I'm hoping for a lot.

The other problem is when LP do release their prices - then the LR AWD price will be right next to the LR AWD Perf price. And I'll go back round the circle of whether I actually need a tow-bar, and whether I could just put the bikes in the boot.

** First ** World ** Problems **

 

[electricspace]

Does anyone know if you can power a cooler from the towing harness?

 

[Fullerene]

I believe towbar electrics operate from the 12V battery, don’t think it has too much output, plus I’d be nervous about draining the 12V. Would like to know if 12V is charged from main pack or only from main charge time. Will try and put a current meter on the 12V when it arrives.

 

[Peteski]

I believe towbar electrics operate from the 12V battery, don’t think it has too much output, plus I’d be nervous about draining the 12V. Would like to know if 12V is charged from main pack or only from main charge time. Will try and put a current meter on the 12V when it arrives.

It is charged from the main pack. The 12V battery has proven to be a weakness on S/X models over the years, typically only lasting 2-3 years.

 

[electricspace]

It is charged from the main pack. The 12V battery has proven to be a weakness on S/X models over the years, typically only lasting 2-3 years.

Damn. They will no doubt add this feature at some point. Seems crazy not to be able to use that huge battery for your caravan/cooler/electric jet ski etc.

Thanks for (both) your replies.

 

[Moonman]

Order number ~225 (7:50 on 1st May), with a 2018 reservation... But I only added the towbar mid-July when the price drops meant it only effectveily cost me £500, not the full £1k.

I'm also a bit torn... as I'm currently down as a cash buyer... but I'd rather get it as a company car through LeasePlan. But LeasePlan haven't updated their prices since the price-drop... ideally LP would release prices, I'd order, give them my reservation slot, and get it the start of September. But I'm hoping for a lot.

The other problem is when LP do release their prices - then the LR AWD price will be right next to the LR AWD Perf price. And I'll go back round the circle of whether I actually need a tow-bar, and whether I could just put the bikes in the boot.

** First ** World ** Problems **

Reserved July '17, ordered 1 May '19 (order number 0797), added tow hitch on 25 June which I believe was the first day it was available. I called them up and asked "will it affect my delivery date?" Tesla said "no" but seem to have changed their tune. Given all of us waiting for a Tow Hitch, that it is not longer available as an option, it's pretty bloomin' obvious that tow hitch orders are being pushed down the delivery line.

I don't mind the the delivery date shifting. I am buying this car for the next 10 years, as a cash buyer, to replace the last 10 year car that will be caught by ULEZ. What this whole saga has demonstrated, however, is that as a consumer I have absolutely no leverage and should not expect any customer service - it is the Tesla way, like it or lump it. The other thread on short notice/inflexible collection windows goes to show this further - pick it up when we say or get to the back of the queue.

For this reason, I will probably return it within the first 14 days unless I can get my confidence back that this isn't going be the customer experience if anything were to go wrong with the car.

 

[Avendit]

Given all of us waiting for a Tow Hitch, that it is not longer available as an option, it's pretty bloomin' obvious that tow hitch orders are being pushed down the delivery line.

Still available on the configurator for SR+ and AWD cars as far as I can see?

 

[Moonman]

Still available on the configurator for SR+ and AWD cars as far as I can see?

My bad.

I remember there being a period when it was withdrawn. It then came back.

 

[Peteski]

Damn. They will no doubt add this feature at some point. Seems crazy not to be able to use that huge battery for your caravan/cooler/electric jet ski etc.

Thanks for (both) your replies.

The problem is that the main pack is HV, so not really suitable for directly powering 12V items.

 

[Fullerene]

My bad.

I remember there being a period when it was withdrawn. It then came back.

Spits out tea - panic over - back to work. All under 4.4 seconds.