Ugh. Another Model S fire - 2013-11-06

[bareyb]

Don't feed the Troll. Please. Let's let this thread die. People like him are here to keep these fires near the top of the forum list. It's really too bad we have to put up with this crap. Unfortunately we are championing a great cause that will change the World for the better and that's a huge threat to many in the long term. In the short term we have people with nothing better to do than argue. Stock shorters, and hired shills who come here to discredit Tesla. In the end, these cars are the future, and nothing will stop it. The people who had the fires all still believe in Tesla and the PEOPLE want this to succeed. As long as we have the PEOPLE on our side this is going to happen. It's just too superior not to. This is just more noise that will die off. The good news is, the more they talk about Fires the more people are getting sick of hearing about it. In a very short time, this will no longer be news.

 

[Merrill]

I agree with bareyb, let's move on from this. In another thread Rocco said it best in a video, there are factions in this country that do not want a company like Tesla to survive. It has happened before and somehow we need to make sure that it does not happen again. The product speaks for itself, when companies see a threat to their bottom line, ie: power companies, petroleum they want to squeeze the new company out of business. I refuse to let that happen, the wonderful thing about this country is the freedom to make your own decisions. Hopefully we will see that these new products are good for everyone as well as the environment and the sustainable future.

 

[ABVA]

Don't feed the Troll. Please. Let's let this thread die. People like him are here to keep these fires near the top of the forum list.

Who is "HIM"?

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I agree with bareyb, let's move on from this. In another thread Rocco said it best in a video, there are factions in this country that do not want a company like Tesla to survive. It has happened before and somehow we need to make sure that it does not happen again. The product speaks for itself, when companies see a threat to their bottom line, ie: power companies, petroleum they want to squeeze the new company out of business. I refuse to let that happen, the wonderful thing about this country is the freedom to make your own decisions. Hopefully we will see that these new products are good for everyone as well as the environment and the sustainable future.

If we do not wan't this to happen again, let us not kill the thread.

 

[bareyb]

Who is "HIM"?

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If we do not wan't this to happen again, let us not kill the thread.

I read all your posts and you don't appear to be a Troll, so I will post one more time in this thread to say: Have WHAT happen again? Somebody hit something on the Freeway and puncture the battery case? I hate to break it to you but chances are, it will indeed happen again. And if it does, so what? Can we get back to reality here and realize we are talking about what basically comes down to a collision that has to be repaired? Nobody has come close to being hurt and NOW your Insurance carrier doesn't even have to pay for it! Tesla will GIVE you a new battery for free! The amount of paranoia over this would be understandable if these cars were spontaneously BURSTING into flames and killing the passengers, but they simply aren't. It's much ado about nothing. Can we PLEASE move on? It's tedious and depressing…

 

[JRP3]

True, but you can't bury your head in the sand and pretend that more events in the near term will not hurt the stock or potentially hurt demand, and the company.

 

[MikeL]

In defense of Merrill (because my sentences often don't properly get into a pretty line either . . . ) what he is saying we need to "make not happen again" is the "not surviving" of another "company like Tesla" . See?!

 

[ABVA]

True, but you can't bury your head in the sand and pretend that more events in the near term will not hurt the stock or potentially hurt demand, and the company.

You said it right. Only thing I would like to add on is:

"There are two ways of dealing with ones own fears. 1) Try to better oneself and advance or, 2) Launch an intensive campaign to severely damage the reputation of organization that is better." It is clear that there are groups out there who have chosen option 2.

 

[BillHamp]

You said it right. Only thing I would like to add on is:

"There are two ways of dealing with ones own fears. 1) Try to better oneself and advance or, 2) Launch an intensive campaign to severely damage the reputation of organization that is better." It is clear that there are groups out there who have chosen option 2.

I think there are more than two options. You can 1. Do nothing, 2. face the problem head on, 3. deny the problem exists, 4. embellish it. All four have been chosen by diffent groups. Unfortunately, Elon gives the impression that he has chosen the first option. Honestly, I don't think that is the option he has chosen. I think he will investigate and fix a problem if one exists. However, his natural demeanor lends itself more toward the first option, which probably isn't the best thing to project for the company.

 

[BillHamp]

Apparently USAToday thinks the Model S is a hybrid. Tesla CEO expects feds to clear Model S in fires. At least they get it right in certain parts of the article.

 

[bareyb]

Apparently USAToday thinks the Model S is a hybrid. Tesla CEO expects feds to clear Model S in fires. At least they get it right in certain parts of the article.

Wow. Enjoy your passive aggressive bumping of these threads "Bill". That's a repost that has been posted many times. Perhaps the Mods can move that to a more appropriate thread?

 

[JRP3]

Unfortunately, Elon gives the impression that he has chosen the first option. Honestly, I don't think that is the option he has chosen. I think he will investigate and fix a problem if one exists.

What people don't understand is that Elon knows there is no problem and knows that nothing need be done. He's rational and logical and knows they built the car to handle reasonable situations likely to be encountered in statistically relevant numbers. He knows these incidents are outliers and that conventional vehicles would not fare much better, and possibly worse in similar incidents. Unfortunately the rest of the world is not as rational, so that's where he and Tesla may run into problems.

 

[BillHamp]

Wow. Enjoy your passive aggressive bumping of these threads "Bill". That's a repost that has been posted many times. Perhaps the Mods can move that to a more appropriate thread?

What are you talking about? I thought it was funny that USAToday reported that the Model S was a "hybrid" in an article regarding the fires. It seems they don't know the difference between hybrids and EVs. The Mods can certainly move it if there is a more appropriate place.

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What people don't understand is that Elon knows there is no problem and knows that nothing need be done. He's rational and logical and knows they built the car to handle reasonable situations likely to be encountered in statistically relevant numbers. He knows these incidents are outliers and that conventional vehicles would not fare much better, and possibly worse in similar incidents. Unfortunately the rest of the world is not as rational, so that's where he and Tesla may run into problems.

As I said, I think he will be thorough and objective in reviewing the MS. In the short term though, it doesn't look great and, as you say, it may reate problems for Tesla is that is how people perceive it. I'm not sure that these situations are outliers. There seems to be something to it, but only a thorough investigation will determine if there really is or not. As to whether "nothing need be done," I would disagree. An investigation needs to be done. Even if Elon is 100% certain these are flukes, the investigation would still serve the company's interests by showing it to be committed and objective.

 

[JRP3]

By "nothing needs to be done" I meant actual changes to the vehicle. The investigation by NHTSA is obviously happening and he expects them to find no issue. However NHTSA may be in cover their ass mode and recommend some superfluous changes to the pack shielding.

 

[FluxCap]

BillHamp, do you have a short position in TSLA?

 

[stopcrazypp]

By "nothing needs to be done" I meant actual changes to the vehicle. The investigation by NHTSA is obviously happening and he expects them to find no issue. However NHTSA may be in cover their ass mode and recommend some superfluous changes to the pack shielding.

I agree that in reality probably no changes will be needed to the vehicle. People here are mainly considering preventing fire at all costs, but I think the NHTSA will look more holistic than that (consider risk to passengers and any steps taken to prevent that).

 

[BillHamp]

By "nothing needs to be done" I meant actual changes to the vehicle. The investigation by NHTSA is obviously happening and he expects them to find no issue. However NHTSA may be in cover their ass mode and recommend some superfluous changes to the pack shielding.

What would NHTSA need to cover their butt for? I think they'll be as objective with Tesla as with any other manufacturer.

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BillHamp, do you have a short position in TSLA?

You already asked a similar question, to which I replied I am not invested in Tesla at all.

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I agree that in reality probably no changes will be needed to the vehicle. People here are mainly considering preventing fire at all costs, but I think the NHTSA will look more holistic than that (consider risk to passengers and any steps taken to prevent that).

I think you are right that the feed will take a broad view.

 

[bareyb]

What is your goal with all this BillHamp? Are you simply going to post anything negative you can find about Tesla like you have been since you joined the site? I checked all your posts and almost all of them are negative comments taking shots at Tesla. Are you the resident thorn in everyone's side now? You and luv2b show up in every negative thread there is. I'm serious here. What do you guys hope to accomplish? More importantly, WHY? WHY are you doing this???

 

[omgwtfbyobbq]

By "nothing needs to be done" I meant actual changes to the vehicle. The investigation by NHTSA is obviously happening and he expects them to find no issue. However NHTSA may be in cover their ass mode and recommend some superfluous changes to the pack shielding.

I don't think NHTSA will recommend superfluous changes. They'll either conclude that the fires were due to collisions with objects that were very unlikely, or if collisions with road debris like the two pieces that caused the two fires are probable enough, conclude that Tesla needs to update their module design so that future collisions won't risk a module catching fire.

Besides, I don't see how stating that Tesla should revise the module design wouldn't be covering their ass. It would be to insure that the pack in the MS was as safe as other packs in other EVs/PHEVs. And yes, of course any EV is far safer than the gas powered equivalent.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

They'll either conclude that the fires were due to collisions with objects that were very unlikely, or if collisions with road debris like the two pieces that caused the two fires are probable enough, conclude that Tesla needs to update their module design so that future collisions won't risk a module catching fire

I don't believe NHTSA's goal is eliminating battery pack fires. The entry at NHTSA says that they are assessing the risks of undercarriage damage. That's all. Even if the pack catches fire, as long as the occupants are safe then there is no need for modifications. Most likely, the NHTSA will link the damage with the low ride height, which can be easily changed via software.

 

[Beavis]

What is your goal with all this BillHamp? Are you simply going to post anything negative you can find about Tesla like you have been since you joined the site? I checked all your posts and almost all of them are negative comments taking shots at Tesla. Are you the resident thorn in everyone's side now? You and luv2b show up in every negative thread there is. I'm serious here. What do you guys hope to accomplish? More importantly, WHY? WHY are you doing this???

One of the nice things about this forum, as opposed to the official Tesla Motors forum, is that everyone here isn't accusing everyone who doesn't agree with them of being a troll or a fanboy. The reason this forum is so much more civil is because it is well moderated.
Let them do what they do.