Universal Mobile Connector (UMC) in Australia

[JonDarian]

Well you can pull 7KW out of them with the right tail single phase in a residential setting so for the price it's not too bad. Especially for renters whod rather just do a industrial GPO over a wall mount. Looking at general reliability and robustness its not that great and there is other competitors around who are proven to be more reliable when used outdoors etc

Id rather not do a harsher DC charge and a slower charge if I can as long as the cars sitting there for enough time like a dedicated 15A circuit for a 3KW session.

You can pull 32 Amps (about 7kW) on a single phase (with the correct aftermarket tail), but in Qld you can only do that on a controlled (off-peak) tariff. To use a continuous tariff (available 24 hours a day) in Qld, the limit is 20A (about 4.8kW). I don't know how the 32A tails work in UMCs that don't have upgraded firmware. Are they restricted to 80% of 32A?

I agree that slower AC charging seems better for the long term battery health than rapid DC charging. I thought I read somewhere that DC charging rates up to about 50kW don't really age the battery much, but I can't remember where I read it.

 

[bcarp]

I agree that slower AC charging seems better for the long term battery health than rapid DC charging. I thought I read somewhere that DC charging rates up to about 50kW don't really age the battery much, but I can't remember where I read it.

That would make sense. Traditionally, charging lithium batteries up to the rate of 1C is considered safe & good for longer term battery life. 1C charge rate is the equivalent of charging a full battery over one hour. For a 50kWh battery, that would be a rate of 50kW. It's not the AC vs DC method, since AC is converted to DC anyway when the electricity is fed into the battery. It's the rate of charge. There's wouldn't be much difference between 11kW AC & 11kW DC as far as the battery is concerned. What we don't know yet is whether the newer lithium batteries have better tolerance for faster charging rates than the older more-studied lithium batteries.

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

You can pull 32 Amps (about 7kW) on a single phase (with the correct aftermarket tail), but in Qld you can only do that on a controlled (off-peak) tariff. To use a continuous tariff (available 24 hours a day) in Qld, the limit is 20A (about 4.8kW). I don't know how the 32A tails work in UMCs that don't have upgraded firmware. Are they restricted to 80% of 32A?

Here is the Australian manual from Tesla for their Gen 2 UMC:

If a given state has some sort of codes about peak vs off peak on different loads than isnt the universal to the context? I mean isnt it then irrelevant if its a UMC on 3 pin single phase 32A GPO cos thats just an industrial socket, as opposed to a directly wired 7KW wall mount. It seems all irrelevant to me isnt it about the load in this case not the colour of the magical unicorns doing happy state government rain dances around it Am I missing something?

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

It's not the AC vs DC method

Yes mate, my apologies I was trying to be brief. In this context AC means to me 22KW or under cos were all in Australia and we all do 32AMP 3 phase over the same infrastructure while noting that certain vehicles are limited in their specific internal invertor such as modern Teslas on 11KW with the older S's and so on higher but still not 22KW AC invertors like we see in the electric Porsche etcetc

Generally when I say AC the meaningful thing to me is Im not doing 250kw 150kw when I think DC etcetc.

I like how your precise over the battery bank size with the charge rate C value. Thats good I should use that to avoid confusion thanks

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

Also I want to share how Tesla's approach on the 15A Australian plug upsets me. I get their thinking in making the 10A domestic circuit limited to 8A with comes to (8X240) / 1000 = 1.92 which after losses no doubt is on the money to charging at 1.8KW. None of the cabling in that residential 10A stuff is rated for continous use at 10 amps when the residences are built to the minimum code specified. This is why also with extension cords Tesla say dont. They arent designed to continously transfer the energy - the thickness of the conductor wiring is not enough to carry it.

Also another practicality domestic GPOs arent dedicated so I get also Tesla dont want tripping breakers all the time as soon as someone plugs in something as innocent as a 5watt night light also on the same overall circuit as the UMC gets plugged into.

But, most 15A setups are dedicated circuits. Garage circuit for example in a residence scenario with say two GPOs only. I'm missing out on 720 watts by Tesla's decision there. And if I had dramas with breakers triipping well manually reduce the charge current.

Tesla went the full hog on commando euro stye 16 and 32 amps so why not our 15 amps. I feel gipped lol outta it

 

[Quickst]

With a Novated lease expenses are deducted pre salary

You mean expenses are deducted pre tax - before tax is taken out in fortnightly pay.
Can be done. its just the novated lease companies dont want to do it.

In any case, ATO says either the 4.2c/km method or the commercial paid chargers where you keep invoices. One or the other.
For those with ABN and do BAS, just work out the business % and apply that to km done at FBT tax day.
Likely the amount is very small

15000 km x 0.042 = $630
Assuming business use 50% = reportable FB is $315. Not a biggie.
For many who got the Tesla at EOFY23 for their employees via direct purchase /loan/novated lease, the business use is possibly zero - say a secretary.
so nothing to claim. (Not to be confused by the vehicle being exempt from FBT - even though the vehicle is still a reportable FB)

 

[Quickst]

why not our 15 amps

Because a lot of 15 amp circuits are not dedicated. Caravan park 15 amp circuits are notorious in this regard. And its so easy to get 15 amp extension cords.....

But yes overall I agree. Tesla nerfed it.

 

[Vostok]

But, most 15A setups are dedicated circuits. Garage circuit for example in a residence scenario with say two GPOs only. I'm missing out on 720 watts by Tesla's decision there. And if I had dramas with breakers triipping well manually reduce the charge current.

Tesla went the full hog on commando euro stye 16 and 32 amps so why not our 15 amps. I feel gipped lol outta it

The newer 10/10A and 15/15A UMC tails do the full current on Gen 2 UMCs. Or have I misunderstood what your issue is? See this post…

Charging Adaptors 101

Hi all, I have a 2022 Model 3 Long Range (which is fantastic) and have been using the included charger once or twice per week only for a few hours at a time, mainly for battery health reasons and minor convenience. My sister just bought a new standard Model 3 (existing stock arriving this...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[bcarp]

Also I want to share how Tesla's approach on the 15A Australian plug upsets me. I get their thinking in making the 10A domestic circuit limited to 8A

Can you explain what you mean here? I get 10A on the 10A tail. I'm assuming I get 15A on the 15A tail too (as reported by others) but I've not had an opportunity to test this. Do you have the latest UMC or the older ones that are limited to 8A/12A?

 

[YAnthony]

Its a firmware update that is currently disabled. If you're lucky to have 10A pulling 10A or 15A pulling 15A, your doing well.

Tesla may bring it back.. they may not.

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

The newer 10/10A and 15/15A UMC tails do the full current on Gen 2 UMCs. Or have I misunderstood what your issue is? See this post…

Charging Adaptors 101

Hi all, I have a 2022 Model 3 Long Range (which is fantastic) and have been using the included charger once or twice per week only for a few hours at a time, mainly for battery health reasons and minor convenience. My sister just bought a new standard Model 3 (existing stock arriving this...

teslamotorsclub.com

Hmm thats good news if it is indeed true mate. Im a bit skeptical. Reasons = I subscribed to Tesla's electronic service manual for my incoming M3P and something that struck me right away is Tesla is hard core about documentation updates. The release notes in their service manual for my model 3 are showing multiple changes every month roughly. Given that I find it hard to believe that the factory umc documentation I referenced above in my screenshot is out of date. Also on my skepticism all the bloke has shown as his proof to convince himself is the labelling on the AU plugs. That means very very little. There is millions of plugs with AU written on it and 10AMP 240V and 15AMP 240v etcetc. Typically on those millions of millions what they are saying is "this plug is for that specification GPO and is certified under xyz" not what the actual device will actually draw that the plug is corded too.

What I would expect to see as conclusive proof - is a clamp meter measurement in operation of the actual tail current. Just about anyone is gunna have a clamp meter whos into this stuff.

I remain hopeful but I think its far far more likely its only 8AMPs on 10A plug like the manual says within the UMC, and only 12 amps on a 15amp plug like the manual says.

 

[bcarp]

What I would expect to see as conclusive proof - is a clamp meter measurement in operation of the actual tail current. Just about anyone is gunna have a clamp meter whos into this stuff.

I guess I could pull out a current meter if I could be bothered, but I'm not going to. What I can tell you is that the car reported a maximum charge rate of 8A when I first tried the UMC. At some stage, the firmware was updated as has been reported & the car now tells me that I can charge at 10A on the rare occasion when I use the UMC. Interesting comment from @YAnthony that the firmware update to allow this has been disabled. I wonder why.

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

I guess I could pull out a current meter if I could be bothered, but I'm not going to. What I can tell you is that the car reported a maximum charge rate of 8A when I first tried the UMC. At some stage, the firmware was updated as has been reported & the car now tells me that I can charge at 10A on the rare occasion when I use the UMC. Interesting comment from @YAnthony that the firmware update to allow this has been disabled. I wonder why.

Im happy to test it if I ever get a UMC in front of me.

The reason for 8A out of 10A domestic stuff is easy. The main use case is with residences the 10A which are shared circuits over multiple GPOs not dedicated circuits and the minimum residential code compliance requirement results in system being unsuitable and unsafe for 10 A continuous use. Its assumed in design the current flow will be on average always a fair whack less than 10 amps apart from time limited little flips up to max.

I argue 15A is a different use case which should be 15 not 12 while others here feel 15A in say caravan use cases is even worse than the situation with 10A. Both parties are right - it just depends on which use case Tesla are shooting for. I feel its really crappy given 16A Euro gets the full monty but I understand Teslas concern. Just craps me.

 

[Vostok]

Its a firmware update that is currently disabled… Tesla may bring it back.. they may not.

First I’ve ever heard of that. Source?

 

[Vostok]

Im a bit skeptical. Reasons = I subscribed to Tesla's electronic service manual for my incoming M3P and something that struck me right away is Tesla is hard core about documentation updates.

Tesla “hard core” about documentation updates? That would be a first… when I got my updated tails from the Alexandria Service Center, even though I gave them the part numbers in my Service order, they still initially gave me the wrong ones. No-one knew what I was on about until Ben came along - he knew.

Also on my skepticism all the bloke has shown as his proof to convince himself is the labelling on the AU plugs. That means very very little.

Is that bloke me? The labelling on the plugs is everything in this case. The old tails are labelled 8/10A and 12/15A, not 10/10 and 15/15.

What I would expect to see as conclusive proof - is a clamp meter measurement in operation of the actual tail current.

No need to do that. The car reports 15A when charging off this tail.

 

[JonDarian]

Here is the Australian manual from Tesla for their Gen 2 UMC:

View attachment 955181

If a given state has some sort of codes about peak vs off peak on different loads than isnt the universal to the context? I mean isnt it then irrelevant if its a UMC on 3 pin single phase 32A GPO cos thats just an industrial socket, as opposed to a directly wired 7KW wall mount. It seems all irrelevant to me isnt it about the load in this case not the colour of the magical unicorns doing happy state government rain dances around it Am I missing something?

I was just mentioning a limitation that people in Queensland may not be aware of. It is easy to read all the online information, buy a wall charger and have it installed in your single-phase supply, only to find you only get 4.8kW instead of the 7kW you were expecting.

It is useful to know both the specifications of the equipment or vehicle and how they work in the real world.

It is interesting that the Tesla manual shows 8A and 12A for Australia, even though their site and New Owners Manual showed 10A and 15A as recently as about 6 weeks ago.

I initially received a UMC with 8A and 12A tails. After I pointed out the advertising of 10A and 15A, Tesla replaced it (it took them three tries to actually send it, though!). I now have a UMC with 10A/15A tails, but the firmware has not updated despite following all the standard advice. A 10A GPO gives me 8A into the car.

 

[SL666]

My umc upgraded itself somewhere from 8-10 and 12-15 - but tails are marked as 10&15 externally.

sucks about QLD ripping off single phase places -

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

No need to do that. The car reports 15A when charging off this tail.

Top stuff. Im pleased there is evidence that these are the facts. Thankyou mate.

Trying to get a hold of this situation further. How do we get what version firmware there is for the UMC? Is it displayed in the Tesla panel at all? Im getting my hands on the diagnostic port adapter so I can poll my vehicle as is necessary. Id imagine if its not present in the UI display its going to be present somewhere in all the CAN chatter I'd wager. Then once we have a grasp on what version Vostok you have with the known amp draw we can collerate that to other versions that dont have that amp draw. It might even be possible for us to dump your firmware and manually load it up onto others.

 

[OzTzlaBloke]

I was just mentioning a limitation that people in Queensland may not be aware of. It is easy to read all the online information, buy a wall charger and have it installed in your single-phase supply, only to find you only get 4.8kW instead of the 7kW you were expecting.

Thanks. So as I suspected its universal - not a UMC specific thing its any load be it wall mount charger or a 7kw portable charger like the UMC or anything at all as a load well beyond charging BEVs. Hopefully pressure from QLD enthusiasts will see QLD revise their policy

 

[JonDarian]

Thanks. So as I suspected its universal - not a UMC specific thing its any load be it all mount or a portable. Hopefully pressure from QLD enthusiasts will see QLD revise their policy

You never know, although monopolies tend to be slower to change. For all I know, there is a good reason for the limitation. I assume it is a crude attempt to manage potentially large loads on the grid. Smarter grids would be better, and will be necessary in the future, but that takes time, resources and foresight.

I am fortunate to have three-phase power, so could use a wall charger up to 11kW if I chose. I am using the UMC for now, and would really like it to deliver the full 10A, and for the car to talk to my Powerwall and only draw from my excess solar production. One of my big reasons for driving an EV is reducing carbon emissions, so I want to maximise solar charging and avoid charging from coal and gas.