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Vampire drain again?

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I wish Tesla compensate for the droop in SOC in cold mornings. It’s not a huge deal, only few % but would be nice to actually get the SOC I wanted to charge to.
You can do it effectively by using scheduled departure, and in combination with off-peak price period.

My super-off-peak rate (being in San Diego SDGE this is equal to very high rates for anyone else) ends at 6am, coldest time period as well, so I set that in the app. It will charge to end at about 5:55 am, starting automatically at the proper time. You can put in any end time you want and it will delay charge until then. This will have it charging in colder temps and calibration will hence be better. Unlike supercharging there will be little issue with the battery at L2 charging in moderate cold.

This also keeps the average state of charge lower, which is also good for battery longevity, and it gives a long period at night of full BMS sleeping.

I'm going on 18 months/18k miles with about 3.6% degradation, and essentially none seen in last 5 months. My charge limit is almost always 50% from my 1st day owning. A typical daily drive/charge is 38% back up to 50%, and the charging happens as late as possible to catch best price. (There is a giant thread on charge limits, and the message to ignore typical recommendations and instead set limit as low as possible for NCM/NCA batteries is correct scientifically and certainly for me empirically true)
 
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Have spent so many times looked into the Tesla SOC and "Vehicle Standby" usage (?) over last three months for my 2023 MYLR, I just wish Tesla will implement a more transparent & more robust reporting system. The Tesla cars indeed has a very technically advanced system and most of the readers/commenters on the TMC forum are probably tech savvy. But to be mainstream cars to be adapted by general public, Tesla needs to do a better job in my own opinion to avoid all these perceived issues (phantom drain, vampire drain, SOC magic disappearance etc).

As AAKEE correctly stated and basic physics of battery, too many factors (much more than a tank of gas for a ICE) can cause the power and its estimation to be vary. While Tesla tries to capture the status in a very precious details (in 1/10 of percentage), its power consumption estimation provided by the car MOSTLY seems to be on the optimal (rosy) side (less power used and better driving efficiency) and then recalibration to a realistic SOC (based on my own car). These implementations thus caused so many discussions of perceived problems of power drain/drop. Yes, I have observed SOC "recovery" up to 3% a few times but SOC "loss" through "Vehicle Standby" happens on a daily basis. There is no truly gain or loss in reality in my opinion. But I also do not believe the car going back to change its trip consumption data so the car's life time power efficiency in term of "Wh/mile" as reported is better than true driving efficiency. For example, for total 14,697 miles on my car (a week ago), the odometer consumption is 3844 kWh. However, for the same mileage, 4474 kWh was received by the battery (16% more). I hardly used any power consuming features (car mostly in garages) so majority of the powers probably should go to true driving consumption.

I do not think a little 10% more is that bad for the efficiency of my MYLR. Compounding errors/uncertainties in the BMS system can easily cause it but it provided the basis for all the unhappiness and attacking launching points for non-EVers. Tesla's recommendation of plug-in all the times can only mask some of the issues (reset the parking reporting) but does not solve the problem. Glanced through often on TMC, there are so many people just trust the trip/odometer efficiency reporting as their real consumption (to derive the likely driving range). However based on my limited extra long-range none-stop drives (distant vacations etc), MYLR seems to provide more realistic power data (probably battery has to calibrate often to know remaining SOC to the next charging point).

May be Tesla can either provide less precious information (in 5% power interval ?) or some other ways to deal with the technical uncertainty so to minimize these perceived issues. The dial or bar approaches for the gas remaining on the ICE cars just make the "worry" going away.
 
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For example, for total 14,697 miles on my car (a week ago), the odometer consumption is 3844 kWh. However, for the same mileage, 4474 kWh was received by the battery (16% more).
Good post!

Just a comment about the charged energy.
Which data did you use for this?

The +kWh shown in the car, (and possibly in the app?) is exxagerated by the buffer proportion (1/0.955, so 4.7%).
Also, only energy used when the car is in Drive is counted, so anything in Park is not.
 
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Good post!

Just a comment about the charged energy.
Which data did you use for this?

The +kWh shown in the car, (and possibly in the app?) is exxagerated by the buffer proportion (1/0.955, so 4.7%).
Also, only energy used when the car is in Drive is counted, so anything in Park is not.
The total kWh is from App under Charge Stat tab. I installed L3 wall charger at home garage before the car delivery. It has all daily charge info. The power (kWh) delivered for each charge session matches with shown on car screen when the cord was detached based on my observation. Started last October, the app added Home Screen that provided charge stat for each session.

The current drive and since charge power usage reported by the car seems to be quite often off in my car so all these “vehicle standby” numbers shown up. I also have observed quite inconsistency in the power numbers. For example, I did a round none-stop item pickup trip at 107 miles away (all interstate driving) for a total 213 miles a few days ago. Started at 100% SOC with preconditioned car, got back home @ 8% power left. The car reported the trip used 67 kWh power. The pickup stop was only 15 minutes so no SOC change was observed (@55 %). If this is true, my car would only have 72 kWh battery total power. But after I charged the car back to 80%, 58.2 kWh was added. This would suggest I have a 81 kWh battery.

Anyway, after all these efforts, I just accepted the uncertainty of the Tesla BMS is part of life. It would be impossible to achieve the efficiency Tesla claimed (but I got great efficiency (220 kw/mile) for 40 miles behind a 18 wheeler on an interstate driving but it is too much a gamble to do unless I want to get a broken windshield soon). Tesla is a fun car to drive & my kids love it with all these high tech features.
 
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only energy used when the car is in Drive is counted
That would make Tesla’s trip reporting even more optimal (rosy). In the typical summer vacation travels, stop & go traffics just are so often. Switching the car to “P” in long traffic stops would make the power consumption go away from the trip, thus making car looking even more efficient for the trip and in odometer. People would expect worse efficiency in such situation.
 
The total kWh is from App under Charge Stat tab. I installed L3 wall charger at home garage before the car delivery. It has all daily charge info. The power (kWh) delivered for each charge session matches with shown on car screen when the cord was detached based on my observation.
The energy number shown in the car as +kWh, (which also is used for example in teslafi and I guess several other apps) will show a higher number than the actual charged energy that entered the battery.

The reason is that the range the car shows at 100% includes the buffer but as the SOC reduces the car progressively hides a part of the battery capacity so at 0% we have a 4.5% buffer below 0%. Only 95.5% of the battery capacity is between 100-0%.
During a charge this buffer is “unhidden” so each percent more charge means 1/0.955 of the battery capacity is displayed.

This means the on screen charging exaggerates the charged energy with 1/0.955 ( 1.047 = 4.7%)

This can be seen with softwares that can show BMS-data. The +energy will be 4.7% higher than the change in nominal remaining energy in the BMS.

This also makes that for example teslafi shows a charge efficiency that is about 4.7% too good.

When I measure the energy with a extern electrical meter mounted just before the WC I more or less always get ~10% more energy than the change in nominal remaining.
At the same time the displayed + energy is 4.7% higher than the increased nominal remaining, so the efficiency of the charge looks too good.

On top of this there is another loss when driving that depends on battery temp and power used. Sometimes (summertime) I see about no loss there, the nominal remaining and the delivered energy is about the same) and for faster drives or colder battery it can be 1-2%.

The difference between delivered energy and “recharge energy” in the EPA tests is about 12% for most Teslas tested, so we should expect about that efficiency (energy use when in park not counted here, just the real charged energy compared to when driving when looking at the trip screen energy)


Started last October, the app added Home Screen that provided charge stat for each session.

The current drive and since charge power usage reported by the car seems to be quite often off in my car so all these “vehicle standby” numbers shown up. I also have observed quite inconsistency in the power numbers. For example, I did a round none-stop item pickup trip at 107 miles away (all interstate driving) for a total 213 miles a few days ago. Started at 100% SOC with preconditioned car, got back home @ 8% power left. The car reported the trip used 67 kWh power. The pickup stop was only 15 minutes so no SOC change was observed (@55 %). If this is true, my car would only have 72 kWh battery total power. But after I charged the car back to 80%, 58.2 kWh was added. This would suggest I have a 81 kWh battery.

67kwh for 92% = 72.8kWh “usable”, so 76.25 kWh total capacity.
Charging back to 80% means 72% of 76.25 is reported as +energy so the screen should say 55kWh (54.9 rounded).
The real change in battery energy would be 0.955 x 54.9 = 52.4kWh (can also be counted as 72% of the usable 72.8).

The energy drawn from the wall should be about 52.4 / 0.9 = 58.2kWh (a bit depending on the charge power. Full 11kW AC charging causes low losses by shortening the charge time.)

So I guess the 58.2kWh you refer as added is the drawn energy from the wall?

Anyway, after all these efforts, I just accepted the uncertainty of the Tesla BMS is part of life. It would be impossible to achieve the efficiency Tesla claimed (but I got great efficiency (220 kw/mile) for 40 miles behind a 18 wheeler on an interstate driving but it is too much a gamble to do unless I want to get a broken windshield soon). Tesla is a fun car to drive & my kids love it with all these high tech features.

The efficiency Tesla clames is by the EPA rules and is not expected to be achieved in anyday driving. It is not impossible at low speeds on a warm day, but we should not expect that to happen most days.
 
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That would make Tesla’s trip reporting even more optimal (rosy). In the typical summer vacation travels, stop & go traffics just are so often. Switching the car to “P” in long traffic stops would make the power consumption go away from the trip, thus making car looking even more efficient for the trip and in odometer. People would expect worse efficiency in such situation.
I think swithing to P resets the trip, at least if you open the door and go out.

At least it is comfirmed that only the energy used in Drive is shown in the trip.
(refering to the trip/travel screen)
 
The total kWh is from App under Charge Stat tab. I installed L3 wall charger at home garage before the car delivery.
This seems to be the used energy from the net.
When charging more than a few kWh, like at least 50% you can compare the on screen +kWh with the app charge data. (+kWh is rounded so thats the reason to charge to see the rounding differ from the net).

The 220Wh/mi is including the buffer so each mile on screen use 0.955x220 = 210Wh/ mile.
You can check the displayed range before and after the charge (change to miles instead of percent).
The change (added) energy is the change in range x 210Wh/mile.
 
This seems to be the used energy from the net.
When charging more than a few kWh, like at least 50% you can compare the on screen +kWh with the app charge data. (+kWh is rounded so thats the reason to charge to see the rounding differ from the net).

The 220Wh/mi is including the buffer so each mile on screen use 0.955x220 = 210Wh/ mile.
You can check the displayed range before and after the charge (change to miles instead of percent).
The change (added) energy is the change in range x 210Wh/mile.
Thanks for all the explanations. I got so much useful information on the TMC from helpful people, much more than directly from Tesla. Sometimes their helps just too generic or pointless to be useful.

We do like our Tesla, pretty much everything except the real range per charge & of course the “VS” tab. The last “VS” photo posted is on Jan 4 after I parked the car in the office location for 7 hours - all SOC drop just to “VS” with everything else being zero. So the previous driving estimation in the morning was off by a lot (5.5/22 = 25% started from 80 SOC). It was a cold day for us, in the lower 40 F.

I did reserve a cyber truck but I’m sure it will be long time to get it. Hopefully by then Tesla will have a better range for it.
 
I guess the 58.2kWh you refer as added is the drawn energy from the wall?
I’m still confused about it. The app provided the numbers but the numbers matched with the numbers shown on car screen after charging at home based on my observations.

My total charge shown also included a few charges received from either public parks (L2 - no smart) and hotel L2 charges. So only car would provide the numbers and shown on app. So I believe all numbers were car received. I have never checked V3 wall charger numbers.
 
I’m still confused about it. The app provided the numbers but the numbers matched with the numbers shown on car screen after charging at home based on my observations.

My total charge shown also included a few charges received from either public parks (L2 - no smart) and hotel L2 charges. So only car would provide the numbers and shown on app. So I believe all numbers were car received. I have never checked V3 wall charger numbers.
I have a WC V2 But never really checked the app numbers.

I have checked the charge efficiency many, many times though.
The extra electrical meter I bought when the WC was installed is good enough to charge for the electricity. It should be very precise.

Below one of the latest times I checked this:
Electrical meter delta energy: 72.14kWh
Both the app ca (charging page, not charge statistics) and the car said +68kWh
Nominal Remaining delta: 65.6 kWh
(Heated garage with the car inside, the car was parked in the garage for 12hes before the charge started - no battery heating used).

The Nominal Remaining delta and the car/app +68 kWh is close to the 0.955 buffer factor.