Derek Kessler
Active Member
Same. CHAdeMo three blocks away, Supercharger three miles away. But my garage is closer than either of them, so it wins.
Why does Model 3 need CCS/CHAdeMO adapter? This is why.
- Thread starter halfricanguy
- Start date
Cheburashka
Active Member
It'd be nice to have for me. There are plenty of Chademo and CSS in California. Not that I'd use them often, but when I go skiing they'd work better for me than superchargers that may be full.
Reeler
Decade of Pure EV Driving
V3 superchargers will have CSS, just like Europe. The new Tesla's (including Model Y) will also have the CSS connector. Problem solved?
Do you have a source for this information? And any accommodation for existing model 3s?
Derek Kessler
Active Member
Reeler
Decade of Pure EV Driving
One can dream. I need to drive my Chevy Bolt cross country. Tesla could make a boat load of money if they added CSS. It would basically eviscerate any competitor's attempt to get funding for a countrywide network.
Randy Spencer
Active Member
How would they make that money? Selling power at cost to Bolt owners? And offering support? I think they have said they would be willing to open Superchargers to vendors who are willing to share the cost burden. So if Teslas charge 1,000,000 times a year and Rivians charge 100 times and it costs $10,000 to build and maintain the Supercharger network than Rivian owes Tesla $10.
That's a simple example and I am sure I didn't move the decimal point the correct number of times and I am positive the numbers are wrong, but the point is, I don't think Tesla is going to be making a b* load of money off opening the Supercharger network, especially if they have to retrofit 12,000 *CCS* cables. I don't think there is a thing called a CSS cable
-Randy
That's a simple example and I am sure I didn't move the decimal point the correct number of times and I am positive the numbers are wrong, but the point is, I don't think Tesla is going to be making a b* load of money off opening the Supercharger network, especially if they have to retrofit 12,000 *CCS* cables. I don't think there is a thing called a CSS cable
-Randy
Reeler
Decade of Pure EV Driving
They charge a non-subsidized price for other brands or sell an adapter for a high price. Unlimited supercharging was once a $2K option so maybe sell the adapter for $1500 and charge the Tesla rate, or less for the adapter and charge more per use. The adapter could have a Tesla account that the owner attaches to their credit card.
The economics must work as competitors are getting into the fray. I just think it can drive Tesla revenue and keep others from getting traction in the space.
While I agree with most of your post, it's important to keep in mind that Tesla's goal of "accelerating the world's transition to sustainable transportation" is the opposite of "keeping others from getting traction in the space". While I love the idea of expanding the supercharger network to support other EVs, I think Elon ultimately wants there to be other successful and widespread charging networks as well, and not exclusively the Supercharger network.
In an ideal situation they would all be compatible with each other, further increasing the freedom of all EVs, including opening up the Supercharger network to other vehicles, but I almost wonder if Tesla is intentionally delaying opening up the Supercharger network to encourage other EV charger buildouts, that would likely not be built if other companies currently had access to Superchargers.
Reeler
Decade of Pure EV Driving
Tesla abandoned their Chademo adapter so the other systems don't help me with my Model 3. My daughter has a Chevy Bolt that she loves in LA, but we are trading it for the SR Model 3 because she got a job in Utah. The Bolt cannot get to Utah with supercharging. My point being, the $1500 adapter that she could use with her Bolt would "accelerate . . . . "
Different ways of looking at the same thing. If I were a shareholder of Tesla, I would be perplexed that they are uninterested in monetizing their network and also mad that they are going to lose their first mover advantage.
BTW: I have never been a shareholder.
diamond.g
Active Member
With V3 cabinets having 3G/4G built in, maybe they will be open to allowing an adapter for CCS vehicles.
theredviper
Member
I thought the specifically said LTE? (4G). Though I guess that might be location dependent. I thought it was weird to point out though. Obviously V2 and Urban SCs have data connections, they have to. What's different about V3?
Does this mean our cars can communicate with "the mothership" when they are plugged into a SCer? or by simply being near a SCer.
I ask this b/c many of the garages in NYC with SCers are so far below ground, it is often impossible to communicate with the car to check the status of SCing.
but lately in places where I once had very bad connectivity problems the situation seems much improved.
of course I am referring to 72 kW "urban" which i don't believe qualify as V3.
it would be cool if the cars could be given internet connectivity thru the SCer cable.
theredviper
Member
Hmmm, I have not been to a SC site in a place where the car doesn't have connectivity myself, but I have to imagine there is some live communication with the mothership to enable and track supercharging as it happens. I don't know if that is meant to happen through the car's connection today, or the charger. Possibly the car can cache the charge info and upload it at the earliest possible time.
There was talk of superchargers in general having strong Wifi connectivity, for both surfing while you wait, and the car auto connecting to grab updates (much like they do at service centers). I think this is still the plan, but maybe not everywhere. Certainly it would make sense in a strong urban environment like NYC, where you don't have a cell signal at the actual charger.
I'm in Vancouver and we have one on the 2nd level of a parkade that still has cell signal. Another underground location is under construction, time will tell if that also has connectivity.
diamond.g
Active Member
From my understanding the V2 and V1 cabinets have no cell service. All coms come from the vehicles talking back to Tesla. This changes with V3 and is why I wonder if they will use that to offer an adapter as they can then not worry about the vehicle handling the billing.
theredviper
Member
I'd say the cabinet having the connection makes more sense for a number of reasons. Both could talk back to Tesla and show things like an empty car only getting 50kW of power, and why, etc.
An adapter is possible, but I kind of doubt it.
MorrisonHiker
S 100D 2021.4.12
Lots of existing Supercharger sites have cell phone service...but the antennas are on the Superchargers themselves, not on the actual Supercharger stalls where you plug in.
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Others have mentioned it - but they'll need a CHAdeMO capability when they enter the Japanese market. That would also require RHD cars to be in production. Though admittedly they could build a CHAdeMO port into the side of the car - like they are doing with the Chinese GB/T cars.
As an aside: There are enough CCS sites now that one can drive from LA (I'm assuming you mean Los Angeles, not Louisiana) to SLC in a Bolt EV without reverting to L2 charging.
Reeler
Decade of Pure EV Driving
Going by the comments on plugshare, the majority of the cars using the CCS chargers on I-15 between Las Vegas and SLC are Bolt EVs. Between LA and Vegas, Victorville and Baker are also highly used. It is a good point about the 'one station broken' though. A couple of those sites only have one charging stall. But EA and others are building more.
Nonetheless, it is interesting entering the trip from LA to SLC into abetterrouteplanner. According to it, using the currently available chargers, it estimates an 11 hour 46 min journey using a TM3 LR RWD, and a 15 hour 11 min journey in a Bolt EV. The difference is due to charging times and distance between chargers. The TM3 requires 1 hour 23 mins of charging, and the Bolt EV requires 4 hours 29 mins of charging. The TM3 charging times will drop even lower when V3 Supercharging is implemented along the route.
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