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wow!!! the i8 is smacking down the tesla? huh>?

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#41
And that is perfectly true. People who have a plug-in hybrid which does, say, 30km on electricity and for whom that's enough to do their trips from home to work and back, are not polluting our cities during the whole work week, so I admire that, and will do everything I can to encourage such PHEV use.

In reality I really see a lot of people buying those PHEV cars just for the tax incentives and not even caring about charging them. That's what makes me sad, not only because they're such a-holes but also because it affects public opinion and therefore is dangerous for the tax incentives our "real" EV cars benefit from.
 
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#42
Let me be the first to scoff.

The i8 reminds me of the Pontiac Fiero. I do like the 2018 convertible better, I'm sure my P85+ can take this overpriced compact hybrid on the curves too. The i8 is a dogs breakfast of regurgitated ICE parts. Sorry, my damn Miata can do better in the curves too.

Isn't that six speed Aisin transmission in the Hyundai? yes its better than a rubber band CVT tranny that they drop in Toyota, Honda and Kia hybrids, but the direct drive tranny in my zero turn lawnmower is more responsive than the dull CVT tranny.

I'll take a Tesla everyday. Also you might want to read this article about how i8 gets demolished. For $141K, there lots of better options. A freaking Model S 75D does 0-60 in 4.2 seconds for half the price. Hell a $20,000 tuned Miata does better.

BMW - Bloody Money Wasted or Bring Mechanic With your choice... Old School parts bin car with pretty nice carbon fiber lipstick. Put a Tesla powertrain in that pretty carbon fiber Pontiac Fiero and lets see what it can really do.

Yawning, stretching, scratching body parts and looking longingly at the Next Gen Roadster which will make the i8 look like a pretty, expensive civic coupe. My Tesla grocery getter does better... BMW needs to wake up to some harsh realities, their stuff is slow and old school, you can never beat the torque of an electric motor tied to a bad ass battery... I'll take 200 Kw and a couple of electric motors on any car that I own over this over engineered Fiero.

Let hold a vote - a $150K 4.6 second car with a top speed of 150 mph top speed 2018 BMW i8 Roadster or the 2020 Next Gen Telsa Roadster for $200K with a 1.9 second car and top speed ~250 mph?
 
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#46
LOL. Someone rated my first post in this thread 'Disagree', when all I did was list the actual sales figures for the i8 vs the Model S.

(i.e. the Model S has been outselling the i8 by literally 50-to-1 in the US over the 1st half of 2017. Ouch.)

How can you 'Disagree' over a simple fact? It's like saying, "No, no, I don't agree that 2+2=4!!!"... LOL. :p

Oh, and we're not sure about gravity, either. ;)

.
 
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#47
FutureShock said:
LOL. Someone rated my first post in this thread 'Disagree', when all I did was list the actual sales figures for the BMW i8 vs the Model S.

(i.e. the Model S has been outselling the i8 by literally 50-to-1 in the US over the 1st half of 2017. Ouch.)

How can you 'Disagree' over a simple fact? It's like saying, "No, no, I don't agree that 2+2=4!!!"... LOL. :p

.
Click to expand...
It's Eclectic. Only knows 'Disagree'
 
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#52
idleuser said:
Why so much hate? The i8 is nice in it's own way.
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It has no real identity.
As an electric car it's more than compromised.
It looks like a supercar, and cost halfway between sportcar and supercar, but it has no power to outrun even basic Porsche 911.
So I've got Tesla and 911, and was thinking about i8, but it doesn't belong anywhere. For whatever reason I wanted to buy it, there are better cars in that class.

It does look good though, that may be the only reason to have it.
It feels like haute-couture fashion from 3 years ago.
 
#54
CarlK said:
I judy wonder how many those i8 BMW has sold. Only votes that count are those people voted with their wallets.
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I have ;)

Having gone from a Model S to an i8. My thoughts:
  • The i8 is more my preference in terms of handling. (Crisper turn in, more steering feel, less roll, and an eagerness to change direction).
  • The i8's steering is a tad over assisted for my tastes.
  • The interior, fit and finish and materials quality, hands down the i8 wins.
  • The BMW interior is a little cluttered (especially the radio preset buttons)
  • The i8 has more sorted damping at low speed over poor surfaces (though my old car had coils).
  • The cabin is better isolated from tire and wind noise in the BMW (this was a big shock).
  • Infotainment system the Model S was streets ahead. (Though I'm preferring a few small elements of the iDrive system that would make nice additions to the Tesla set up.)
  • Hybrid mode works for me, but I drive < 20 miles on a typical day, and done using pure EV in city traffic. (I would like more)
  • Hybrid mode isn't so great when in e-Drive because it becomes front wheel drive :(
  • I miss the 0-10 performance of the Tesla
  • I like the 40-100 performance of the BMW (Particularly how you it works in balance with the chassis).
  • I think the exterior design is more interesting than the Tesla. (This is subjective)
  • I like the more holistic approach BMW's i Division are taking wrt to recycled materials usage, and investment into green production facilities using on site renewable energy.
  • I like the effort BMW have put into their online portal, particularly the part around gamifying your efficiency vs the broader i8 owner base (would be even better if this was displayed in the dash ;) )
  • I LOVE the HUD
  • I would miss the Model S's practicality, if I didn't have a Landrover Discovery for those duties
  • I like the fact the i8 is a rarer sight.
  • The BMW dealers were far more organised and professional, returning calls when they said they would etc.
  • I like the fact the auto wipers and headlights work as advertised :p
To be completely blunt I got a bit bored of my Model S after 3.5 years and fancied a change. The Model S hasn't moved on enough for me to justify replacing mine for a new one, and the X is not for me.

I could hang around waiting for the RHD Performance Model 3, but life's too short.
 
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#55
Carl said:
And that is perfectly true. People who have a plug-in hybrid which does, say, 30km on electricity and for whom that's enough to do their trips from home to work and back, are not polluting our cities during the whole work week, so I admire that, and will do everything I can to encourage such PHEV use.

In reality I really see a lot of people buying those PHEV cars just for the tax incentives and not even caring about charging them. That's what makes me sad, not only because they're such a-holes but also because it affects public opinion and therefore is dangerous for the tax incentives our "real" EV cars benefit from.
Click to expand...

The only way I can see this being addressed is per mile based road taxation policies, with differential rates based on EV or ICE miles.

The problem is per mile taxation has been talked about over and over again, and always met with stiff public resistance. I can't see any politicians being brave enough to push it through (at least not here in the UK).
 
#56
smac said:
The only way I can see this being addressed is per mile based road taxation policies, with differential rates based on EV or ICE miles.

The problem is per mile taxation has been talked about over and over again, and always met with stiff public resistance. I can't see any politicians being brave enough to push it through (at least not here in the UK).
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You could just prorate any credit in the case of hybrids. They get 25% of the full benefit. Problem solved.
 
#59
gregd said:
Yeah, prorate it on the ratio of gas range to EV range! All gas, all taxes. No gas, no taxes. A hybrid getting 15 miles on EV, 300 on gas gets 15/300 = 5% discount.
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The manufacturers could simply put smaller gas tanks in. (Or software limit them like BMW did with the U.S. bound i3 :eek: )

A simpler approach would be to add significantly more tax on gas at the pump, this rewards actually driving on EV, not the theoretical range of a PHEV which never gets plugged in.

As a slight side note, one thing I am noticing is how much more efficient the BMW is in EV mode compared to the Tesla (it's around 0c here, and I'm getting 220Wh/mi in the BMW vs 360Wh/mi in the Tesla). As I'm charging it using grid electricity, on my commute I'm actually producing less CO2 in the BMW compared to the Tesla.
 
#60
smac said:
I have ;)

Having gone from a Model S to an i8. My thoughts:
  • The i8 is more my preference in terms of handling. (Crisper turn in, more steering feel, less roll, and an eagerness to change direction).
  • The i8's steering is a tad over assisted for my tastes.
  • The interior, fit and finish and materials quality, hands down the i8 wins.
  • The BMW interior is a little cluttered (especially the radio preset buttons)
  • The i8 has more sorted damping at low speed over poor surfaces (though my old car had coils).
  • The cabin is better isolated from tire and wind noise in the BMW (this was a big shock).
  • Infotainment system the Model S was streets ahead. (Though I'm preferring a few small elements of the iDrive system that would make nice additions to the Tesla set up.)
  • Hybrid mode works for me, but I drive < 20 miles on a typical day, and done using pure EV in city traffic. (I would like more)
  • Hybrid mode isn't so great when in e-Drive because it becomes front wheel drive :(
  • I miss the 0-10 performance of the Tesla
  • I like the 40-100 performance of the BMW (Particularly how you it works in balance with the chassis).
  • I think the exterior design is more interesting than the Tesla. (This is subjective)
  • I like the more holistic approach BMW's i Division are taking wrt to recycled materials usage, and investment into green production facilities using on site renewable energy.
  • I like the effort BMW have put into their online portal, particularly the part around gamifying your efficiency vs the broader i8 owner base (would be even better if this was displayed in the dash ;) )
  • I LOVE the HUD
  • I would miss the Model S's practicality, if I didn't have a Landrover Discovery for those duties
  • I like the fact the i8 is a rarer sight.
  • The BMW dealers were far more organised and professional, returning calls when they said they would etc.
  • I like the fact the auto wipers and headlights work as advertised :p
To be completely blunt I got a bit bored of my Model S after 3.5 years and fancied a change. The Model S hasn't moved on enough for me to justify replacing mine for a new one, and the X is not for me.

I could hang around waiting for the RHD Performance Model 3, but life's too short.
Click to expand...

Interesting take from someone who's driven both extensively. One quibble, concerning recycling and green production: carbon fibre (i8) isn't nearly as recyclable as metals such as steel and especially alumium. You can grind it up and then use it as fill in lower-quality products, but they don't have nearly the same properties as the original. Also, obviously, Tesla's facilities are also being designed to be powered entirely on renewable energy (I'm not sure what power they're buying today, however - obviously their facilities are still very much under construction)

From your description of your Model S's performance, I'm guessing you were in something rather far from a P100D? ;)

(Appropriate and well deserved jab at the auto wipers! ;) )
 
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