CNBC throwing all the big guns in today
Cramer explains why valuation is not the end-all for individual stocks
Cramer explains why valuation is not the end-all for individual stocks
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Video: smack-down of "irrational behaviour" argument:
Rational behavior not found in Tesla valuation: Expert
Rational behavior not found in Tesla valuation: Expert
jschwefel
Tesla fan/TSLA, Model Y and Cybertruck owner.
At the end of he video there's a statement, "For every one car Tesla produces,...Ford produces 100,...same market cap.?"
That does sound crazy, but then again, I'd rather have one new iPhone, than a hundred old ones. And BTW, has anyone looked at the balance sheet and income statements from F and/or GM. The trends look terrible. Lots of debt and piling on more faster than revenues are growing.
That does sound crazy, but then again, I'd rather have one new iPhone, than a hundred old ones. And BTW, has anyone looked at the balance sheet and income statements from F and/or GM. The trends look terrible. Lots of debt and piling on more faster than revenues are growing.
Keep on shortin' shorts! Hope can be the greatest asset or the biggest weakness, depending on the ultimate outcome.... and thus far, it's looking like a yuuugggee weakness for shorts. I don't presume longs to be hopeful, bc there's been enough de-risking in the past couple months
That was actually a pretty good segment. I found it particularly interesting the way he characterized the Tencent thing. Makes me wonder if this run is more about that than the delivery numbers.
adiggs
Well-Known Member
I believe that there are 2 requirements of somebody that is short - a margin requirement that @neroden was talking about earlier AND a collateral requirement. The collateral requirement, that you are describing here @vgrinshpun, is that the account with the short position coughs up cash equal to 105% (or 101 / 102% - slightly more than) of the value of the position. That cash is removed from the short position account and transferred to a 4th party bank (for example - I'm with Fidelity; the collateral cash isn't held by me as the original share lender, by Fidelity as the borrower of my shares, OR the person who borrowed the shares to sell them in the market). That 4th party is holding the cash collateral as the final backstop to Fidelity's ability to return my shares to me when I want them back, in case Fidelity isn't able to perform.
When the short seller opens their position originally, they receive cash on the spot. That cash is them immediately transferred to the collateral holder, along with a little extra (1-5% - I don't know exactly how much), when the position is established. The amount on deposit as collateral is updated every day, so with Tesla going up, the short sellers are having cash equal to the daily raise (plus a little bit) being added to the collateral accounts (out of their control).
Apparently, they've got some additional margin requirements on their account. That makes sense to me - if I were Fidelity and the short seller had enough cash to meet today's collateral requirement, but they have nothing more to meet an increase in collateral requirements tomorrow, that sounds entirely too close to a failed position that puts Fidelity at risk. (I say Fidelity - of course I mean any broker that enables accounts to sell short). Thus the incremental margin requirement - cash etc.. that is in the control of the short seller, over and above the collateral requirement that is out of the control of the short seller.
EDIT: Or maybe I reread your comment better @vgrinshpun, and we're in violent agreement
SunCatcher
Member
Cramer is pretty funny here. And well worth the watch, as he has some very good points regarding TSLA>FORD
sundaymorning
Active Member
80,000 MS and MX deliveries at 28% margins is the same as Fords cheaper model delivery of 600,000 vehicles at 10% margins.
500,000 M3 at 28% margins is equal to about 1,500,000 of Ford's at 10%? Now imagine if Tesla sells 3million M3, MS and MX at 28%, it'll be the equivalent of Ford selling 8-10 million vehicles.
My bet is that Tesla will 3M one day, and Ford goes bankrupt.
larmor
Active Member
Didn't Ford nearly go under all ready, and was bailed out (correct me if i'm confusing us govt bailed out automakers)? Alien dreadnaught is coming, and will be controlled by a neural lace, or maybe it will control delivery people and residual factory workers by the same neural lace...
Hey, so turns out Cramer is actually pretty good at explaining why a stock is good to own - after it hits all time highs.
Two days ago, right after the announcement of the quarter numbers, I bought my first options ever.
And yes - it turned out the be a good invest - 70% up so far - will hold it longer now.
I am secretly reading the TSLA threads here for years now and learnt a lot from you guys - thanks to everyone here.
All my TSLA shares (30% of my portfolio - first from end of 2013) will not be sold the next 10 years - very LONG TSLA.
And yes - it turned out the be a good invest - 70% up so far - will hold it longer now.
I am secretly reading the TSLA threads here for years now and learnt a lot from you guys - thanks to everyone here.
All my TSLA shares (30% of my portfolio - first from end of 2013) will not be sold the next 10 years - very LONG TSLA.
jeewee3000
Active Member
TSLA up 0,46% at open on Frankfurt. Current SP €284,31.
For reference, ATH yesterday at Frankfurt was € 285,00.
For reference, ATH yesterday at Frankfurt was € 285,00.
Love these guys (sarc).
She talks about the amazing SpaceX achievement, and they keep harping on "cars are hard to build"...
What about reusable rockets?! Those are easy??
Sounds like they're the ones that don't understand and are irrational.
Yep, investing is forward looking. Otherwise one wouldn't invest.
Gerasimental
Member
Does an event like this sighting of Model 3 RC in the wild have any potential to affect the stock price in this environment?
mutle
Member
I don't think it has a direct impact, but it will make it harder for shorts to claim that it is delayed.
Gerardf
Active Member
Some first PT updates in April ..
The FBN update is quite spectacular.
The FBN update is quite spectacular.
Another note from AJ:
Investors are waking up to Tesla's true addressable market: Morgan Stanley analyst Jonas
MARKETWATCH 7:51 AM ET 4/5/2017
Morgan Stanley on Wednesday said the sooner Tesla Inc.(TSLA) investors view the company as a transportation/ infrastructure company and not just a car company, the better, as that will frame events coming in the next 12 to 18 months. Analyst Adam Jonas, in a note entitled "3 thoughts at $300," said talks with investors suggest they have come to an understanding of the company's true addressable market faster than he had expected. "The addressable markets within Tesla's ecosystem could potentially include a $10 trillion light vehicle mobility market, a $1 trillion logistics market, a $2 to $3 trillion energy market and a potential multi-trillion market captured in the 600 billion hours of consumer time spent in cars in the form of content delivery and data monetization," he said. At the time of stock's last high in September, few investors were viewing the company in those terms, he said. "We're pretty surprised by the recent run in Tesla's share price to over $300 so quickly - such is the power of technical factors over fundamental drivers," he said. Jonas said to expect Tesla to keep pushing the boundaries of safety for passengers and pedestrians and improvements will drive market awareness of Tesla's technologies. Morgan Stanley rates Tesla the equivalent of buy with a $305 price target. Tesla shares were slightly lower premarket, but have gained 42% in the year so far, while the S&P 500 has gained 5%.
-Ciara Linnane; 415-439-6400; [email protected]
Investors are waking up to Tesla's true addressable market: Morgan Stanley analyst Jonas
MARKETWATCH 7:51 AM ET 4/5/2017
Morgan Stanley on Wednesday said the sooner Tesla Inc.(TSLA) investors view the company as a transportation/ infrastructure company and not just a car company, the better, as that will frame events coming in the next 12 to 18 months. Analyst Adam Jonas, in a note entitled "3 thoughts at $300," said talks with investors suggest they have come to an understanding of the company's true addressable market faster than he had expected. "The addressable markets within Tesla's ecosystem could potentially include a $10 trillion light vehicle mobility market, a $1 trillion logistics market, a $2 to $3 trillion energy market and a potential multi-trillion market captured in the 600 billion hours of consumer time spent in cars in the form of content delivery and data monetization," he said. At the time of stock's last high in September, few investors were viewing the company in those terms, he said. "We're pretty surprised by the recent run in Tesla's share price to over $300 so quickly - such is the power of technical factors over fundamental drivers," he said. Jonas said to expect Tesla to keep pushing the boundaries of safety for passengers and pedestrians and improvements will drive market awareness of Tesla's technologies. Morgan Stanley rates Tesla the equivalent of buy with a $305 price target. Tesla shares were slightly lower premarket, but have gained 42% in the year so far, while the S&P 500 has gained 5%.
-Ciara Linnane; 415-439-6400; [email protected]
T3slaTulips
Member
Ford and Tesla are the two remaining that have not gone bankrupt. The other US automakers received a bailout.
Reciprocity
Active Member
Tesla actually compares better to BMW today in terms of product mix and Market Cap. I believe BMW is a few billion in market cap ahead of Tesla and in the most jeopardy of being sunk by Tesla vs Ford which would survive longer base purely on the F150. When Tesla gets around to doing a truck with unlimited torque, the F150 is toast.
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