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2023 Model Y no USS discussion, incl. Discussion of Tesla Vision Firmware

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#821
Eric5273 said:
Wow, reading these posts I feel like everyone is in panic mode. The Tesla vision software just came out recently. Give it some time. Like everything else, the software will improve over time as Tesla upgrades it. Not many new features that Tesla has introduced over the past 4 years that I’ve owned a Tesla have been perfect (or even good) at first release. I’m not really concerned.

I just sold my 2019 Model 3 Long Range (38k miles) last week, and am picking up my new 2023 Model Y Long Range on Monday. The total cost of my upgrade (after tax rebates) is $14,130. When I decided to order the new Model Y, I remember thinking if it were to cost me less than $20k for the upgrade, I’d be happy. I could not have imagined it would be as low as $14k.
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Do you mind sharing where sold/how much did you get for your Model 3 2019?
In similarish boat. Thanks
 
#823
Eric5273 said:
Wow, reading these posts I feel like everyone is in panic mode. The Tesla vision software just came out recently. Give it some time. Like everything else, the software will improve over time as Tesla upgrades it. Not many new features that Tesla has introduced over the past 4 years that I’ve owned a Tesla have been perfect (or even good) at first release. I’m not really concerned.

I just sold my 2019 Model 3 Long Range (38k miles) last week, and am picking up my new 2023 Model Y Long Range on Monday. The total cost of my upgrade (after tax rebates) is $14,130. When I decided to order the new Model Y, I remember thinking if it were to cost me less than $20k for the upgrade, I’d be happy. I could not have imagined it would be as low as $14k.
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Not sure about panic mode, more deeply p1ssed off mode.

Tesla has (and continues to) charge anyone who paid for Enhanced Autopilot or Full Self Driving not inconsiderable sums of money, and then delivers cars not just with all these features disabled, but even the most basic of capabilities removed. 6 months later it pushes out beta software which is pretty rubbish (by the majority of contributors on this forum), and we have to suck it up, and at the same time crashing the value of our cars with list price drops, as sadly we don’t all live in the US and benefit from rebates.

Could they make me feel less p1ssed off? Yes - give me my money back for the features that have been fraudulently sold to me which are not available on my car at purchase, today 7 months later, or even being talked about as “coming soon”. Do they…no.

So instead I have a heavily depreciated car, that isn’t what I ordered and seemingly paid a premium price for.
 
#825
stopcrazypp said:
The car needs a front bumper camera to support that stitched view and so far none of them have it. Probably the Cybertruck will be the first one to have it (there were cameras in the prototypes).
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Due to the obvious limitations of the present system this is what is needed. My distance perception is pretty good, but why there isn't a camera on the front is beyond me. In one instance a small child was in front of the car and the car was completely blind. The exisitng system does its best to make a distance calculation but can't see the blind spots.

I don't really care how they do it, but we need to see or be aware of objects or people in front of the car. Tesla's disclaimer that requires ackowledgment for those buying 2023 cars with this system lacking USS was a stop gap measure. Nowhere in that ageement are the limitations stated. If one is going to make a safety system it needs to be accurate. I'm not sure how they got away with this seriously.

I don't see them changing it unless there is a mandatory recall on the grounds of safety. That's the only way it's going to happen because Tesla will not do anything but move on to the next version of car.

Instead of attempting to work the problem through software, they should, IMO, be looking to add a hardware retrofit free to those of us with this system. What if you were skydiving and they told you they couldn't guarantee the reliability parachute? Really this defeats the purpose of a safety awareness system.

I knew the implications going into this and I wanted to believe the promises, but I don't see the system being accurate unless they add that camera or USS.
 
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#826
starise said:
Due to the obvious limitations of the present system this is what is needed. My distance perception is pretty good, but why there isn't a camera on the front is beyond me. In one instance a small child was in front of the car and the car was completely blind. The exisitng system does its best to make a distance calculation but can't see the blind spots.

I don't really care how they do it, but we need to see or be aware of objects or people in front of the car. Tesla's disclaimer that requires ackowledgment for those buying 2023 cars with this system lacking USS was a stop gap measure. Nowhere in that ageement are the limitations stated. If one is going to make a safety system it needs to be accurate. I'm not sure how they got away with this seriously.

I don't see them changing it unless there is a mandatory recall on the grounds of safety. That's the only way it's going to happen because Tesla will not do anything but move on to the next version of car.

Instead of attempting to work the problem through software, they should, IMO, be looking to add a hardware retrofit free to those of us with this system. What if you were skydiving and they told you they couldn't guarantee the reliability parachute? Really this defeats the purpose of a safety awareness system.

I knew the implications going into this and I wanted to believe the promises, but I don't see the system being accurate unless they add that camera or USS.
Click to expand...
A recall is not going to happen. USS are optional features in cars anyways and USS have extensive limitations too. Here it is from the original manual (well before Vision):
Warning: Never depend on Park Assist to inform you if an area you are approaching is free of objects and/or people. Several external factors can reduce the performance of Park Assist, causing either no readings or false readings (see Limitations and False Warnings on page 53). Therefore, depending on Park Assist to determine if Model 3 is approaching an obstruction can result in damage to the vehicle and/or objects, and can potentially cause serious injury. Always inspect the area with your own eyes. When reversing, perform shoulder checks and use all mirrors. Park assist does not detect children, pedestrians, bicyclists, animals, or objects that are moving, protruding, located too far above or below the sensors, or too close or too far from the sensors. Park Assist is for guidance purposes only and is not intended to replace your own direct visual checks. It is not a substitute for careful driving.
...
Limitations and False Warnings The parking sensors may not function correctly in these situations:
• One or more of the parking sensors is damaged, dirty, or covered (such as mud, ice, or snow).
• The object is located below approximately 8 inches (20 cm) (such as a curb or low barrier). Caution: Shorter objects that are detected (such as curbs or low barriers) can move into the blind spot of the sensors. Model 3 cannot alert you about an object while it is in the blind spot of the sensors.
• Weather conditions (heavy rain, snow, or fog) are interfering with sensor operation.
• The object is thin (such as a sign post).
• A sensor’s operating range has been exceeded.
• The object is sound-absorbing or soft (such as powder snow).
• The object is sloped (such as a sloped embankment).
• Model 3 has been parked in, or being driven in, extremely hot or cold temperatures.
• The sensors are affected by other electrical equipment or devices that generate ultrasonic waves.
• You are driving in a location where the sensors' ultrasonic waves are deflected away from the vehicle (such as driving next to a wall or pillar).
• The object is located too close to the bumper.
• A bumper is misaligned or damaged.
• An object that is mounted to Model 3 is interfering with and/or obstructing the sensor (such as a bike rack or bumper sticker).
• Model 3 rolls freely in the opposite direction of the gear you selected (for example, you will not receive an alert if Model 3 rolls backwards down a hill while in Drive).
Click to expand...
 
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#827
stopcrazypp said:
A recall is not going to happen. USS are optional features in cars anyways and USS have extensive limitations too. Here it is from the original manual (well before Vision):
Click to expand...
Yeah I made this determination and still decided to buy the car. Vision is just a little quiky, but I live with it. Redundancy of multiple systems would have been the best IMO, but it is what it is.
 
#828
stopcrazypp said:
A recall is not going to happen. USS are optional features in cars anyways and USS have extensive limitations too. Here it is from the original manual (well before Vision):
Click to expand...

I understand recall may not happen. On the other hand, if it was such a trivial thing why would Tesla specifically seek a waiver/ok from new buyers before they are set up with delivery for cars without USS?

May be after market options ( backed by Tesla to retrofit older but capable cars), or Tesla itself providing an upgrade path may be the way to go. Backers of this company feel confident of inhabiting Mars one day in this lifetime - surely they can problem solve this trivial issue.

Buying new “updated” ~50-100k car every 3-5 years isn’t really smart for the planet. If battery condition is good, they can surely service/upgrade most of the tech components. Even if Tesla has to break the industry mould. That would allow many current older Tesla owners to instead use that money for FSD purchase (that was after all a big selling point - cars like appreciating asset with better features over time)
 
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#829
AJ.. said:
I understand recall may not happen. On the other hand, if it was such a trivial thing why would Tesla specifically seek a waiver/ok from new buyers before they are set up with delivery for cars without USS?

May be after market options ( backed by Tesla to retrofit older but capable cars), or Tesla itself providing an upgrade path may be the way to go. Backers of this company feel confident of inhabiting Mars one day in this lifetime - surely they can problem solve this trivial issue.

Buying new “updated” ~50-100k car every 3-5 years isn’t really smart for the planet. If battery condition is good, they can surely service/upgrade most of the tech components. Even if Tesla has to break the industry mould. That would allow many current older Tesla owners to instead use that money for FSD purchase (that was after all a big selling point - cars like appreciating asset with better features over time)
Click to expand...
They seek a waiver because buyers may be expecting the car to be the same as the older car, so it makes sense to inform the consumer, plus there are some features that are yet to be delivered in the non-USS cars but they specify as part of the car (even today, like Autopark, Summon, Smart Summon).

That doesn't mean USS will ever return though, or that any solution they push will have zero limitations (again even USS had an extremely long list of limitations).
 
#831
AJ.. said:
I understand recall may not happen. On the other hand, if it was such a trivial thing why would Tesla specifically seek a waiver/ok from new buyers before they are set up with delivery for cars without USS?

May be after market options ( backed by Tesla to retrofit older but capable cars), or Tesla itself providing an upgrade path may be the way to go. Backers of this company feel confident of inhabiting Mars one day in this lifetime - surely they can problem solve this trivial issue.

Buying new “updated” ~50-100k car every 3-5 years isn’t really smart for the planet. If battery condition is good, they can surely service/upgrade most of the tech components. Even if Tesla has to break the industry mould. That would allow many current older Tesla owners to instead use that money for FSD purchase (that was after all a big selling point - cars like appreciating asset with better features over time)
Click to expand...
They seek a waiver because it lets them keep the money you have paid for all the features they have disabled, rather than do the right thing and refund you.
 
#835
I’m now on 2023.12.5 but unfortunately there does not seem to be any improvements under the hood since first release of the TVPA in 2023.6.9 😣.
Although it will surely never be perfect or on par with former USS due to camera calculations limit, I would appreciate if Tesla folks did not wait another 6 months to provide update to the system after the first quite unreliable version we got.
 
#836
How do I enable Tesla Vision? Right now when I’m parking my 2023 Model Y, I don’t see anything on the screen, except for the rear camera if I’m going in reverse. I don’t see any visual of where other cars are like I’ve seen in YouTube videos.
 
#837
Sadly sitting here watching a programme about EVs. Hondas, Mercedes, BMWs, Polestars, Skodas etc all doing self-parking, summon etc. Where did Tesla leadership go? Oh yes, they disabled these features after taking our money, and now seeming can’t re enable them because of their stupid decision to remove sensors.
 
#840
zazim said:
It will appear once you finish the calibration process.
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It didn’t for me. My vehicle updated to 2023.12.5 the day I took delivery, but a full week later I still didn’t have the vision park assist. I factory reset, based on a post here on TMC, and park assist immediately appeared after the restart - even though the cameras had to be recalibrated from the reset.
 
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