.48 feels like AP2 finally passed AP1

[buttershrimp]

@Carl Obviously my AP1 experience comes from the cars of others, I have only owned pre-AP and AP2. This means my AP1 experience is limited. What I have experienced in AP1, though, is a confident product with a number of features AP2 does not have.

Look.

If this was a close call, I'd think differently. Let's say AP2 had all the features AP1 had, and we'd just be arguing which one is more confident in steering, I'd be willing to call it for AP2 or at least understand very well why some would. That would be a subjective call and would require lots of on-road time in both to judge.

But we're not even at feature parity, that much is simply factual: speed sign recognition is missing, non-highway lane change is missing, non-lane change multi-lane vehicle ID is missing, vehicle ID type is missing for AP2 (and if you want to count it, auto-wipers are missing from AP2).

AP2 has no feature AP1 does not. AP1 has several features AP2 does not. That's really the point I'm trying to make here. It is very hard to argue AP2 is at parity, let alone beyond, until it has the same or at least something different extra than AP1.

And, really, the reports on the driving itself are a mixed bag. I'm willing to call it a possible tie, but that still leaves the lack of feature parity.

Why is it AR or us that don't enjoy parity that should document it? I think they who claim parity should document it, like in pharma.
Tesla made a video once, why can't they make another? They earn money on this product? Or invite journalists to a test with the competition, like BMW does?

Well, I see my brilliant ass post earlier got overlooked once again and we are back in parity land. . I'm going to sit in the corner with my massive brain and solve cold fusion. No parity ever, only a point at which AP2 departs from AP1 categories. I don't think they will be there for 3 4 years so strap in.AP1 and AP2 are going to be extremely close in function for quite a while.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

@buttershrimp is probably, in his odd way, right. There will likely never be AP1 parity. AP2 will probably go off on a tangent before reaching AP1 parity, which means even if it later gets everything AP1 gets, it won't ever be "at parity". It will simply be beyond.

Some might argue it is already on a tangent since it uses two front cameras and has more advanced internal snapshotting. But to be clear, IMO in practical terms if Tesla implements the missing AP1 features in AP2, and does nothing else, then we'd be at rough parity still.

But more likely Tesla will implement something like blind-spot camera detection, setting off AP2 on a clearly separate tangent. Which is of course perfectly welcome.

Something new. Anything, really, would be welcome. Chasing AP1 is getting real old.

 

[lunitiks]

Vision based rain sensing wipers should (could) be a huge improvement over AP1 and non-AP cars IMO.

I like my rain sensor, but at the same time I really hate it. It’s not wiping 50% of the time I want it to wipe, and it wipes 50% of the time I don’t want it to.

Getting a more intelligent auto wiper would push me in direction of new car purchase. Right now, nothing really tempts me unfortunately...

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Vision based rain sensing wipers should (could) be a huge improvement over AP1 and non-AP cars IMO.

Ironically this thread has ruled rain sensing to not be part of AP, so we won't use it to call parity.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

...push me in direction of new car purchase. Right now, nothing really tempts me unfortunately...

Luckily Q2-Q3 is right around the corner...

The HUD Case - Mockup of what could be

 

[WannabeOwner]

I like my rain sensor

I've never had one that I liked well enough to just leave it to it. Mostly they have fallen well short of that. Of course I may not have driven marques that have particularly good ones ...

Getting a more intelligent auto wiper

Seems to me that fleet-learning from owners pushing the single-wipe button is all that is needed to figure out how much wipe for a given amount of rain. Probably also needs a "slow down" as well as a "do now" button.

Maybe that's all that's called for ... let the user fiddle with it a bit, if it then does exactly as required Great! if not, then user can provide some input, if they want to

One thing that AP cameras could do, for me, (which I presume that Rain Sensors can't) is to see that a truck I am about to draw alongside is chucking up huge amounts of spray and before-I-get-there increase the rate of wiping.

 

[daktari]

The rain sensor in my previous 2014 Citröen Grand Picasso was excellent. I don't think I touched the wiper stalk the 3 years I had it. It automatically increased speed when passing a truck on the highway, one of the best features. We get rain every week...
Auto high beams, lane departure warning and TACC was pretty poor though.

 

[lunitiks]

We get rain every week...

Bergen?

 

[Carl]

Kemi?

 

[GoTslaGo]

We have 2017.50 now on our AP2. Just tried using autopilot on some off ramps turning the car 270 degrees (example: HW drive east, off ramp turns around to go north).

Each time the car had to slow to 25-30 mph, but was able to negotiate the turns! I know AP1 cannot do this. I have both.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

We have 2017.50 now on our AP2. Just tried using autopilot on some off ramps turning the car 270 degrees (example: HW drive east, off ramp turns around to go north).

Each time the car had to slow to 25-30 mph, but was able to negotiate the turns! I know AP1 cannot do this. I have both.

Do you have AP1 on the same firmware?

If it is mapping, AP1 could get the same.

 

[GoTslaGo]

AP1 on .42

Maybe it might be able to on 0.50

We’ll see. But for now definitely no.

I will add I couldn’t do this for AP2 on .46 either. (We skipped .48)

And yes, it keeps being able to do this. Not a fluke. It will ride the outer lane toward the apex a bit, so if there’s two lanes be careful. And it really slows down to 25-30 mph, so folks behind you might get annoyed.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

@GoTslaGo Appreciate the info.

One thing to also consider are the different camera FoVs. AP2 will eventually have much wider FoV to handle much wider lanes, tighter curves.

I wonder how much of this factor already plays a part? The fisheye isn't used yet, I believe, but two of the narrower ones are.

 

[GoTslaGo]

Another observation. Just did the offramp/onramp again.

This time there was NO car in front of me. This time it I had to take it out of AP to make the first turn (it didn’t seem to recognize the first turn without a car turning as well!). Approximately 1/3 into the turn, the TACC/Autosteer indicator came back. I activated it in the turn and it completed the turn at approximately 30 mph—annoying the cars behind me.

 

[buttershrimp]

My album Drops NOW! ENJOY.

 

[WannabeOwner]

Is that as close as it looks at 0:57 ?

 

[SlicedBr3ad]

My album Drops NOW! ENJOY.

@buttershrimp with another clencher! . Watching the video, I realized that the only way for autopilot to go is up (I.e. more features and better reliability). Those not getting fsd are in for an awakening in q1?

 

[AnxietyRanger]

the only way for autopilot to go is up (I.e. more features and better reliability)

Hasn't that always been the case?

As I've always maintained, AP2 will get some kind of FSD one day. I'm a believer, probably geo-fenced or nag-limited, but obviously the way has always been up given how little of the suite is used... That's why I bought in on FSD too.

How truly well Tesla messed up the launch of EAP and how misleading their timeline statements originally, that was the surprise. FSD differentiating features for April-July 2017 seem like a distant memory now.

Will we even get that big Q4/2017 update?

 

[daktari]

I notice in the video that the wheel has a lot of microcorrections, just like my car. Steering wheel is in constant motion. My car is really poor on slope up/down still. 50.1

 

[verygreen]

I notice in the video that the wheel has a lot of microcorrections, just like my car. Steering wheel is in constant motion. My car is really poor on slope up/down still. 50.1

my theory is the steering wheel oscillations is the way for the car to detect if you are holding it. If you do, there's resistance to the oscillations, if you don't there is not.