80 Amp Charing for Cybertruck, Tesla WC Gen 4?

[kpanda17]

Range is different, it’s not a feature, it’s a requirement with trucks and def with towing

The Silverado body is heavy

Cybertruck should be lighter as unibody with castings

With the weight diff, CT vs SEV, and 4680/gen3 advances
Think the CT won’t have a problem getting to 500/600 miles

 

[texas_star_TM3]

Range is different, it’s not a feature, it’s a requirement with trucks and def with towing

The Silverado body is heavy
View attachment 963537

Cybertruck should be lighter as unibody with castings
View attachment 963539
With the weight diff, CT vs SEV, and 4680/gen3 advances
Think the CT won’t have a problem getting to 500/600 miles

weight doesnt matter much for EPA rated range.... aerodynamics do.... and regardless... you'd need *well over* 200kwh battery pack. that ain't cheap. Tesla could be building 2x Model S with that much battery capacity or just one CT ... mmmh..

 

[ucmndd]

Range is different, it’s not a feature, it’s a requirement with trucks and def with towing

A tiny tiny fraction of CT sales are going to go to people who want a truck for work and hauling/towing. These are cosplay bro-dozers.

Nobody whose livelihood depends on it is gonna be buying these goofy things for a good long time.

 

[kpanda17]

CT drag corefficient is much better than any of the EV pickups with large vertical flat fronts

 

[uscbucsfan]

But the estimations are worse than the Rivian at this point. It absolutely should be better than the F150, though.

 

[kpanda17]

you think, with a master like Franz leading design?

 

[E90alex]

People keep referencing 4680 like it’s going to be some magic bullet. It’s not. At its present state it’s still worse than 2170.

They haven’t been able to scale the technologies that would further improve power density eg DBE and tabless design. They anticipated with all new technologies implemented it would provide +16% range at the pack level. That means a battery pack the size of a Model 3/Y battery would increase from 82 to ~95 kWh or a Model X sized pack would increase from 100 to ~116 kWh.

Just looking at the wheelbase differences, CT wheelbase is 28% longer than Model X. That would mean the biggest CT battery pack (unless they double stack parts of it) will be ~128 kWh at current NCA battery density levels (which 4680 has not achieved yet). Maximum potential with fully optimized 4680 eventually would be ~148 kWh.

 

[kpanda17]

Performance wise gen 2 4680 = best 2170
It is almost a magic bullet, gen 3 will be
Between Tx, Fremont and Nevada they will be making a lot of 4680s
Interesting M3Ps might even get replaced long term
But think multiple battery tech and suppliers will always be rhe plan

 

[uscbucsfan]

Performance wise gen 2 4680 = best 2170
It is almost a magic bullet, gen 3 will be
Between Tx, Fremont and Nevada they will be making a lot of 4680s
Interesting M3Ps might even get replaced long term
But think multiple battery tech and suppliers will always be rhe plan

View attachment 963591

This info is wrong, though. It's outdated. THe 2170 from 2017 was 263 and there was a specific Model Y 2710 that was 263. Tesla switched to the 2170M in 2020 (maybe 2021, I'd have to find that again) which is 271.

It's so odd how you continue to post things that are proven incorrect or as random rumors like Farzad. They aren't reference or argument points.

NCR2170-M

Get all you need of the battery cell Panasonic NCR2170-M. A high-precision battery model, measurement data and a detailed cell report.

www.batemo.de

Also, the 4680 is more than twice the size of the 2170 and has lower energy. It takes up more space for lower power.

 

[uscbucsfan]

you think, with a master like Franz leading design?

The prototype was worse than Rivian...we'll see about the final version.

 

[kpanda17]

Farzad, Limiting Factor, and Cleanerwatt do very good analysis
Current, in depth and detailed
Interesting how they have more trusted information and also Elon has included them, such as Farzad former Tesla employee and has run recent events for Elon
Than us

Challenges are good, why we are all on here, for detailed rebates and some type of meeting of the minds
But total disregard is sad

 

[uscbucsfan]

Farzad, Limiting Factor, and Cleanerwatt do very good analysis
Current, in depth and detailed
Interesting how they have more trusted information and also Elon has included them, such as Farzad former Tesla employee and has run recent events for Elon
Than us

Challenges are good, why we are all on here, for detailed rebates and some type of meeting of the minds
But total disregard is sad

Farzad is just guessing. He has no insider information. That's been proven with his previous predictions. It holds no more weight than your guess. I understand it as a talking point, but it's certainly not something to cite as "Here's what pricing will be". You cite it as something of substance.

 

[kpanda17]

Seems you guys want a new post:

“Tesla Youtube Presenters Limiting Factor, Cleanerwatt, Farzad, do we believe them?”

 

[TessP100D]

weight doesnt matter much for EPA rated range.... aerodynamics do.... and regardless... you'd need *well over* 200kwh battery pack. that ain't cheap. Tesla could be building 2x Model S with that much battery capacity or just one CT ... mmmh..

Oh but EM said they will,be cheaper. So I guess they will be cheaper batteries to manufacture

 

[kpanda17]

Oh but EM said they will,be cheaper. So I guess they will be cheaper batteries to manufacture

4680 gen 2

It’s all out there
Dry cell manuf from Maxwell
Hired a dry cell expert
Big savings on manuf costs
10% increase in energy density equaling Samsung 2170
Great news with gen 3 pending

Tesla's GigaTexas reaches production milestone for revolutionary 4680 battery cells

Tesla's GigaTexas has produced its 10 millionth 4680 battery cell. A milestone for the new technology.

thedriven.io

 

[uscbucsfan]

4680 gen 2

It’s all out there
Dry cell manuf from Maxwell
Hired a dry cell expert
Big savings on manuf costs
10% increase in energy density equaling Samsung 2170
Great news with gen 3 pending

Tesla's GigaTexas reaches production milestone for revolutionary 4680 battery cells

Tesla's GigaTexas has produced its 10 millionth 4680 battery cell. A milestone for the new technology.

thedriven.io

Do you understand that doesn't make sense, right?

The 2170 is less than half the size of the 4680. So 2 2170s will roughly fit where 1 4680 is. So at this point the 2170s would be far more beneficial than even Gen 3 for total range.

 

[kpanda17]

The CT has rhe floor space for a large pack
One of rhe videos talks to how they are packing more 4680s in the struct pack
Remember struct pack saves weight being the actual floor
Also big, cheaper to make from the standpoint of efficiencies and because it’s from Tesla, way cheaper than buying Samsung 2170s

I understand

 

[uscbucsfan]

The CT has rhe floor space for a large pack
One of rhe videos talks to how they are packing more 4680s in the struct pack
Remember struct pack saves weight being the actual floor
Also big, cheaper to make from the standpoint of efficiencies and because it’s from Tesla, way cheaper than buying Samsung 2170s

I understand

I think you mean Panasonic, but that doesn't speak to total range. The 2170 would be the best option for the foreseeable future for maximum range.

 

[kpanda17]

Tesla is doing a lot of battery direction changes:
CATL M3Ps moving away from LFP
Samsung 2170s also
Panasonic assembling Tesla 4680s
Tesla making 4680s
Hard to understand rhe biggest focus for long term but the following is clear:
Low end short range are M3P and 4680
Long range are 4680
It doesn’t seem 2170s are the main long term focus

Tesla's 2170 vs. 4680 Batteries: What's The Difference?

Tesla uses a variety of different batteries depending on the model. What's the difference between their 2170 vs 4680?

history-computer.com

 

[uscbucsfan]

Tesla is doing a lot of battery direction changes:
CATL M3Ps moving away from LFP
Samsung 2170s also
Panasonic assembling Tesla 4680s
Tesla making 4680s
Hard to understand rhe biggest focus for long term but the following is clear:
Low end short range are M3P and 4680
Long range are 4680
It doesn’t seem 2170s are the main long term focus

Tesla's 2170 vs. 4680 Batteries: What's The Difference?

Tesla uses a variety of different batteries depending on the model. What's the difference between their 2170 vs 4680?

history-computer.com

The reason the Semi uses 2170s is to maximize range, which are made by Panasonic (same with all 2170s). 4680s are just cheaper, but currently have less performance, less range, and slower charging. I understand that the goal is that the 4680s will eventually be the better, but that appears to be a long ways off considering that even Gen3 would take up a larger footprint for the range they could get with the 2170s. Tesla decided to use the 19650s because of their performance in the MS.