Another Musk promise broken

[CWT3LR]

No, Musk was disastrously wrong, and not for the first time. Read his words - “I am certain of that, that is not a question mark.” That isn’t just being optimistic. That was more than three years ago and there is still no prospect of true autonomous driving anytime soon.

I don’t want a Cybertruck and no one will be going to Mars for decades, despite what Musk might spout.

Seems like Mr Musk has doubled down now. He is stating that robotaxis will be available by the end of next year. And that FSD will be on full release, not beta, by Q4 this year.

He reminds me of that octopus that could predict World Cup winners.

 

[Bouba]

Seems like Mr Musk has doubled down now. He is stating that robotaxis will be available by the end of next year. And that FSD will be on full release, not beta, by Q4 this year.

He reminds me of that octopus that could predict World Cup winners.

When they ripped the guts out of FSD by relaunching EAP with all the features of FSD...I assumed that he was signaling the end of beta

 

[Casss]

He is stating that robotaxis will be available by the end of next year. And that FSD will be on full release, not beta, by Q4 this year.

Tesla's engineers browsing twitter...

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

Me, you and everyone on this forum are driving around in these incredible vehicles that only started in Elon’s head. In fact you can get an acceptable ev from a number of manufacturers all because of him. The super charger network that now encircles the globe was all just a promise now a reality. Some things are harder to do...live on Mars, build electric trucks...ask the companies that have been making trucks for a hundred years

Except BMW were developing the i3 when Tesla were developing the Model S. The Renault Zoe and the Nissan Leaf came out before the Model S, and they funded Ecotricity to create the first country wide rapid charging network. They were arguably too early which is why the quality of the chargers was suspect, not to mention Ecotricity badly managing it

People make the assertion that the other car makers only started EV development programmes after Tesla launched, its not true. Tesla helped accelerate those programmes but they weren’t the first at anything

 

[Bouba]

Except BMW were developing the i3 when Tesla were developing the Model S. The Renault Zoe and the Nissan Leaf came out before the Model S, and they funded Ecotricity to create the first country wide rapid charging network. They were arguably too early which is why the quality of the chargers was suspect, not to mention Ecotricity badly managing it

People make the assertion that the other car makers only started EV development programmes after Tesla launched, its not true. Tesla helped accelerate those programmes but they weren’t the first at anything

EVs were at the beginning of automobile history... but to take credit away from Tesla is a bit like saying it all has nothing to do with Henry Ford, because Daimler got there first

 

[MovingSouth]

EVs were at the beginning of automobile history... but to take credit away from Tesla is a bit like saying it all has nothing to do with Henry Ford, because Daimler got there first

I don't think George is trying to take (all) the credit from Tesla - they've made a huge contribution. It's just the claim that they made it all happen. Tesla still haven't produced their affordable EV, yet we've been driving around in Europe in reasonably affordable EVs, such as the ZOE and Leaf, for 10 years.

Until Tesla produce a £30k (or cheaper) EV then they haven't reached Henry Ford status.

 

[EVer Hopeful]

An optimist would say, day precedes night

<pedantic>

An optimist would say, day follows night

</pedantic>

 

[Bouba]

<pedantic>

An optimist would say, day follows night

</pedantic>

Ok..you are forcing me to go full pedant on this..
The original quote was..

In other news, Night found to follow Day.

in this statement, we don’t know if day does follow night, but we do know...

day precedes night

Phew

 

[Rice&Curry]

To drive innovation one needs to be an eternal optimists - it is this quality that keeps the fire of innovation burning in spite of setbacks and deliver futuristic lifestyle altering products . At the same time, I agree that optimism to willfully mislead people is wrong. Each one of us have to come to their own conclusion. Reducing Bitcoin holding by 75% was a correcting a hedging decision that did not work out ( better late than never). Such decisions are happening everyday in the financial companies and Hedge Fund companies.

 

[pgkevet]

"In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth.
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
And God saw the light, and it was good; and God divided the light from the darkness. "

So patently day followed dark...

If one accepts Darwinian evolution, then obviously the first chicken came from the pre-chicken in the evolutionary series via the laid egg...so the egg came first.

L Ron Hubbard carefully crafted his cult. Musk is getting his handed to him...kneel facing Fremont and bow.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

Mod comment: I think we can drop night/day argument, it’s not adding anything.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

To drive innovation one needs to be an eternal optimists - it is this quality that keeps the fire of innovation burning in spite of setbacks and deliver futuristic lifestyle altering products . At the same time, I agree that optimism to willfully mislead people is wrong. Each one of us have to come to their own conclusion. Reducing Bitcoin holding by 75% was a correcting a hedging decision that did not work out ( better late than never). Such decisions are happening everyday in the financial companies and Hedge Fund companies.

I’m all for innovation, but it requires a couple of essential qualities:

- the recognition that not everything will be a good idea or successful. Tesla and the hardcore supporters see to struggle to accept that. Many arguments revolve around the acknowledgment of the failings.
- not killing off dead in the water ideas. Solar should just be dropped, at least for now. The only thing I can think of is the plaid+ model. Everything else has just gone backwards in time.
- innovation stopping at the advanced prototype stage. Too many things seem to get to a 60-80% state and then they’ve moved on to the next thing. Auto wipers, auto headlights, blind spot camera, sentry mode, dashcam. Nothing ever feels quite finished and slapping “beta” on loads of things doesn’t excuse them of that.
- inappropriate or incoherent lines of innovation. Maybe this is me confusing Musk with Tesla, but the neural implant, the robot thing, I don’t get what they have to do with Tesla values and yet get airtime on investor days. To me they look like a diversion to deflect from under achieving elsewhere
- on a similar line, bitcoin was nothing to do with cars, or hedging against China, it was about Musk flexing his influence to unsettle the regulators and markets. That wasn’t innovation, it was pure disruption which isn’t the same thing.

 

[_Redshift_]

"Tesla will not be selling any Bitcoin". That sounds pretty emphatic.
Yet from the mouth of the world's richest person, statements should be taken with not just a pinch but a shovel of salt.

The BBC expected him to keep & never sell his $billions in BTC... what exactly do you think he was buying it for.. to look at!

He has also said:

”FSD will be solved next year” since 2012
”We will never charge for supercharging, ever”
“Our service centers will never be profit centers, you will have the best service experience of all car makers”
”We will drive coast-to-coast by 2017 end”

At this point, if you are surprised he reneged on a promise, you are really not the attention paying type.

 

[_Redshift_]

Sure. BBC might be less biased than I. But even the times, guardian, and a few more I checked this morning went only with the Bitcoin story. Tesla is the only automaker that continues to deliver EVs at scale despite the lockdowns and chip shortages. Surely our tabloid could find a few words to report this. Perhaps the lack of marketing budget is the reason?

So, something like this?

“Tesla has, and continues to do great service to the world. On a small side note, Tesla is selling Bitcoin. Elon had previously mentioned he would never sell it. Anyway, let us not forget that Tesla sells more EVs than anyone else. They do a great service to this world. Please remember that, folks.”

Would you be happy then?

 

[Dilly]

The most annoying thing about Tesla vehicles must be that whatever price point you purchase at, you are afflicted by the same dreadful software shortcomings!

 

[Pants]

Seems like Mr Musk has doubled down now. He is stating that robotaxis will be available by the end of next year. And that FSD will be on full release, not beta, by Q4 this year.

He reminds me of that octopus that could predict World Cup winners.

You’d think that after spouting complete crap for years and being very publicly proved wrong time and again Musk would have learnt to put a sock in it. He just can’t stop the verbal diarrhoea. And yet, as we see on this forum, there are still people who treat him as a demigod and hang on to his every word. When it comes to FSD Musk has zero credibility.

 

[Wol747]

You’d think that after spouting complete crap for years and being very publicly proved wrong time and again Musk would have learnt to put a sock in it. He just can’t stop the verbal diarrhoea. And yet, as we see on this forum, there are still people who treat him as a demigod and hang on to his every word. When it comes to FSD Musk has zero credibility.

Probably all innovators have similar qualities and shortcomings: there's no doubt that Musk's driven psychology propelled Tesla into the giant it now is, but unfortunately the other side of him appears to be massive hubris and an inability to think outside the next "feature" (also known al la Microsoft as a "bug).
As a multi billionaire he doesn't HAVE to think about how customers who have paid high prices are treated - even if Tesla went bust tomorrow and he lost his share he wouldn't be lining up at the food bank - but he needs to learn that building cars is one thing: looking after them long term is actually important to the buyers, who would rather all the little niggles were put right rather than be constantly told what was coming "tomorrow".
This is not to detract from his achievement but it increasingly strikes me that Tesla would be better off if he left the company for adult manufacturers to consolidate it and took his talents on to the next project.

 

[_Redshift_]

Probably all innovators have similar qualities and shortcomings: there's no doubt that Musk's driven psychology propelled Tesla into the giant it now is, but unfortunately the other side of him appears to be massive hubris and an inability to think outside the next "feature" (also known al la Microsoft as a "bug).
As a multi billionaire he doesn't HAVE to think about how customers who have paid high prices are treated - even if Tesla went bust tomorrow and he lost his share he wouldn't be lining up at the food bank - but he needs to learn that building cars is one thing: looking after them long term is actually important to the buyers, who would rather all the little niggles were put right rather than be constantly told what was coming "tomorrow".
This is not to detract from his achievement but it increasingly strikes me that Tesla would be better off if he left the company for adult manufacturers to consolidate it and took his talents on to the next project.

I have also said the same thing - Elon does not have the temperament to build a company long term.

He gets distracted too easily, is immature in his thinking and behavior. These qualities are coming out, now that he is the richest person on the planet.

 

[pgkevet]

So, something like this?

“Tesla has, and continues to do great service to the world. On a small side note, Tesla is selling Bitcoin. Elon had previously mentioned he would never sell it. Anyway, let us not forget that Tesla sells more EVs than anyone else. They do a great service to this world. Please remember that, folks.”

Would you be happy then?

Tesla has shown that electric vehicles are practicable. But keep a sense of proportion. When Tesla has all 3 factories working flat out they'll still produce fewer cars than Nissan , less than half the cars Toyota makes. What they aren't doing is making cars affordable for average Joe and they still have a long way to go before they match the quality of the other makers. OTA updates sound wonderful but it'd be so much better if they weren't needed.
Globally there will still be a demand and dependence on fossil fuels and likely with increasing population no net reduction until fossil fuels really run out.
Lorries will continue to spew out diesel exhaust while we live in a society of consumerism and greed.
What does happen is that the wealthy few will smugly claim green credentials while queueing at ferry terminals and airports to indulge themselves in a MacDonalds in a foreign land.
If there really was going to be a transport revolution then overhead cables for electric lorries when rail transport won't do and short range battery packs for the last part of their trip and the public universally using mass transport systems.
It ain't gonna happen because of our economic dependence on car sales, fuel sales and buying disposable rubbish. Getting rid of plastic bags and cotton buds is a tiny proportion of the huge waste we generate.

 

[Bouba]

Tesla has shown that electric vehicles are practicable. But keep a sense of proportion. When Tesla has all 3 factories working flat out they'll still produce fewer cars than Nissan , less than half the cars Toyota makes. What they aren't doing is making cars affordable for average Joe and they still have a long way to go before they match the quality of the other makers. OTA updates sound wonderful but it'd be so much better if they weren't needed.
Globally there will still be a demand and dependence on fossil fuels and likely with increasing population no net reduction until fossil fuels really run out.
Lorries will continue to spew out diesel exhaust while we live in a society of consumerism and greed.
What does happen is that the wealthy few will smugly claim green credentials while queueing at ferry terminals and airports to indulge themselves in a MacDonalds in a foreign land.
If there really was going to be a transport revolution then overhead cables for electric lorries when rail transport won't do and short range battery packs for the last part of their trip and the public universally using mass transport systems.
It ain't gonna happen because of our economic dependence on car sales, fuel sales and buying disposable rubbish. Getting rid of plastic bags and cotton buds is a tiny proportion of the huge waste we generate.

In the short term the government could raise taxes on ice cars and fuel...they could call it a green tax..that always goes down well. And for the long term...well, what government ever cares about the long term...