Are Teslas Having a Noticeable Impact on the California Grid?

[ratsbew]

There are a lot of Teslas (and other EVs) in California. Are the power companies noticing an increased demand from all of the electric cars? I'd think they would be a non-trivial part of the consumption pie at this point.

Does anyone have stats on this?

 

[McRat]

All EVs combined with all PHEVs don't even begin to scratch the surface of the grid.

Understand you only use as much power as you drive each day. A typical driver goes under 40 miles a day.

In any case, most charging is done at night when the grid has unusable capacity.

 

[jerry33]

Until EVs get to over 50% of the total vehicle population, the only possible effect is local where they may not allow certain undersized transformers to cool off during the night.

 

[tga]

California ISO is forecasting a peak demand today of 28415 MW @ 7pm. This morning's low was just shy of 21000MW @ 3am:

http://www.caiso.com/outlook/SystemStatus.html

So that means there's at least 8000MW of spare generation capacity at night.

8000MW * 1000kW/1MW * 1 Tesla/10kW = capacity to charge 800,000 cars @ 40A simultaneously.

I expect that eventually we'll get smart EVSE's and cars that can regulate charging current/stagger charge times to allow several million cars to charge without overloading the grid. For reference, it looks like there are ~20M registered cars in CA

EDIT: Daytime capacity is something in the mid 30GW's

 

[freeewilly]

I like to monitor CAISO, I check on their website almost daily. In most days in California, I believe the best time to charge is between 10am to 3pm, when solar panels generate a lot of electricity, energy resource often 12000 MW above net demand, that's a lot of clean energy wasted.
The best for our wallet is between 10pm to 8am, that's when the electricity rate and net demand at its lowest.

 

[sorka]

All EVs combined with all PHEVs don't even begin to scratch the surface of the grid.

Understand you only use as much power as you drive each day. A typical driver goes under 40 miles a day.

In any case, most charging is done at night when the grid has unusable capacity.

I think you meant to say un-utilized capacity?

 

[McRat]

There is no economical way to store the unused capacity. You use it or lose it.

 

[tga]

California ISO is forecasting a peak demand today of 28415 MW @ 7pm. This morning's low was just shy of 21000MW @ 3am

It's not CA, but the New England forecast for today is/was 11830 MW @ 2am and 17520 @ 6pm, so that's room for another 570,000 simultaneous charging cars: ISO New England - Real-Time Maps and Charts

 

[ReddyLeaf]

I've posted this before on mynissanleaf.com, but there was a DOE report several years ago that suggested the existing US grid at that time (probably 2006-08) could charge about 75% of all light duty vehicles WITHOUT adding any additional capacity. Yes, the grid would use more fuel, and local circuits would need upgrades, but no additional power plants would be needed. That's very old data now, and by the time we even get to 10-20% EV's the grid will contain 100's of GW more renewable. Bottom line, don't worry about it. Buy an EV, drive it, and charge whenever there is excess renewables (especially up here in May-June when all our hydro power is maxed out).

 

[GregRF]

I like to monitor CAISO, I check on their website almost daily. In most days in California, I believe the best time to charge is between 10am to 3pm, when solar panels generate a lot of electricity, energy resource often 12000 MW above net demand, that's a lot of clean energy wasted.
The best for our wallet is between 10pm to 8am, that's when the electricity rate and net demand at its lowest.

I don't think any of the clean energy is wasted. Plants with scale-able capacity are cut back or shut down.

 

[flankspeed8]

Certainly DCFC could be having some localized impacts? That is a lot of demand that could be ramped up in short order. I am guessing that some more remote areas would have difficulty being able to support multiple ports like Super Charger stations or is electric supply that elastic?

 

[sorka]

Most plants can't shut down so they have minimum idling capacities that get wasted if the demand isn't there. This is the basis of TOU otherwise the suppliers would be able to adjust to the exact demand and only produce what is being used.

 

[Kbra]

California ISO is forecasting a peak demand today of 28415 MW @ 7pm. This morning's low was just shy of 21000MW @ 3am:

http://www.caiso.com/outlook/SystemStatus.html

So that means there's at least 8000MW of spare generation capacity at night.

8000MW * 1000kW/1MW * 1 Tesla/10kW = capacity to charge 800,000 cars @ 40A simultaneously.

I expect that eventually we'll get smart EVSE's and cars that can regulate charging current/stagger charge times to allow several million cars to charge without overloading the grid. For reference, it looks like there are ~20M registered cars in CA

EDIT: Daytime capacity is something in the mid 30GW's

California is becoming renewable heavy which means unreliable sources. You cant assume capacity based on the delta from max to min. They just have more capacity during the day with the sun and when the wind decides to blow. Otherwise they are importing power from other states, firing up gas and other fossil plants, or slurping off that 24/7 based load 2,250 MW Nuclear Power (or 18,000 GWh per year due to its continuous output). Can you tell which i prefer? :biggrin:

California is almost at 30% renewable which means nearly 30% maybe power.

 

[Bangor Bob]

California is becoming renewable heavy which means unreliable sources. You cant assume capacity based on the delta from max to min. They just have more capacity during the day with the sun and when the wind decides to blow. Otherwise they are importing power from other states, firing up gas and other fossil plants, or slurping off that 24/7 based load 2,250 MW Nuclear Power (or 18,000 GWh per year due to its continuous output). Can you tell which i prefer? :biggrin:

California is almost at 30% renewable which means nearly 30% maybe power.

"Intermittent" is different than "unreliable". Winds and sun can be forecast. A large bird relieving itself on some exposed electrical equipment causing a reactor shutdown, not so much... Bird poop shut down Indian Point nuclear plant | New York Post

And we probably shouldn't talk about how reliable San Onofre ended up being.