BMW i3

[Electroman]

My son and I test drove the i3 last week. Drove very well, very zippy on the surface streets here. Of course our test drive was no more than 5 miles all on surface streets. I would have liked to take it on the highway, but i didn't ask. Field of vision was very good. A great car for city drive, for taking off from a stop light and switching lanes around. Doesn't look that bad at all in person, compared to all the videos I have seen,

But the things that I feared were more or less confirmed during my test drive. It is essentially a two door car, but more easier to get in and out of the back seat. In a typical two door car the driver/front passenger has to get out, slide/fold the seats to let people in. In the i3 you need to open the front doors for the back doors to be opened, and hold the front doors open until the back doors are closed. So it is a step up from a two door car in terms of ergonomics, but far removed from a regular 4 door sedan. The back seats are tiny just like a coupe.

But the real downer is the out of the door price for a ReX model - $50K. The non-ReX model is around $4K less, but that doesn't help solve the range anxiety problem, so it is a non-starter.

I simply cannot justify $50K (or $40K with Fed and Texas rebate). The lease price though was beyond ridiculous, which came to around $700+

 

[Vitaman]

I took a 25 min drive with half highway and half surface streets. It acquitted itself surprisingly well at 75 mph and is very competent on exit and entrance ramps. Although the suicide doors (whatta name) are awkward, the back seat is spacious for a car its size. My 13 year old daughter found it more comfy than those in a Kia Sportage or Land Rover Evoque.
The fully equipped (non Rex) one I just bought came to 47K after discount.
With Fed and State incentives 34,500.
I couldn't find anything I preferred at that price EV or ICE.

 

[gameon]

The tall/narrow i3 tire was designed for efficiency.


Have you seen what a purpose built ice/snow tire/wheel looks like compared to a purpose built summer tire/wheel looks like?

I know BMW keeps saying the same about the entire car design (tall tires and shape, etc.). Today I got a very close look (same garage) at the tire. It is possible they work fine in all weather, but anybody without EV knowledge (women in general) thinks tires are tiny, etc..

I think many people let go EV because of price too high for range. Right now, buying something in EV space is a difficult decision.

 

[NigelM]

...but anybody without EV knowledge (women in general) thinks tires are tiny, etc...

Dude seriously?

There's plenty of women on TMC (see the TMC Connect group photo) and even many, many members wives who will take exception to that comment; not to mention that unfounded generalizations do tend to undermine the author's overall credibility.

 

[ecarfan]

but anybody without EV knowledge (women in general)

Wow, that is an ignorant statement. You would be wise to apologize...

 

[bonnie]

... but anybody without EV knowledge (women in general) thinks tires are tiny, etc..

Can't. Stop. Laughing. (This was a joke, right? No one actually believes things like this, do they?)

- - - Updated - - -

Dude seriously?

There's plenty of women on TMC (see the TMC Connect group photo) and even many, many members wives who will take exception to that comment; not to mention that unfounded generalizations do tend to undermine the author's overall credibility.

Wow, that is an ignorant statement. You would be wise to apologize...

Oh wow. He wasn't joking? He was seriously saying that? Yeah, that was an ignorant statement. And yes, he's lost all credibility.

 

[ecarfan]

Bonnie, sometimes posts are meant to be a joke but the person doesn't word their post in such a way that you can tell they are joking or they fail to use an appropriate emoticon to indicate their post is meant in jest. In this case @gameon gave no indication he was joking, so I took his post at face value.

 

[bonnie]

(I was joking. I totally got that he was serious and really thinks that 'women in general' are without EV knowledge. Hopefully Nikki, Chelsea, Leilani don't see this thread ... such a disappointment, really. )

 

[ckessel]

(I was joking. I totally got that he was serious and really thinks that 'women in general' are without EV knowledge. Hopefully Nikki, Chelsea, Leilani don't see this thread ... such a disappointment, really. )

People in general are without EV knowledge. The comment was sexist in specifying just women, though it's not actually inaccurate.

It's also likely true the total number of men with EV knowledge out number women with EV knowledge, largely since men vastly outnumber women in the tech heavy fields that would typically be interested in EVs. That's simply a case of numbers, not sexist though certainly a sad state of affairs across the STEM fields.

 

[bonnie]

I get your point, but in specifying one gender, it implies the other gender does not suffer from the same condition.

Men do outnumber women in tech fields. The reasons are not as simple as 'because that's just an area they excel at', though that's what a lot of people assume. But unless we're going to start a separate thread for that discussion, I'll leave it alone. In the meantime, we'd like this forum to be welcoming to all genders. It's rare that a sweeping generalization that starts with 'women in general' or 'men in general' will end in anything good. I have never understood the need to put down large groups of people for no reason.

I do need my share my favorite sexist generalization, however ... because it was a generalization complaining about generalizations: "Why is it all you women all generalize so much?" OMG, that was priceless. And I had to explain to the poor guy why it was so funny. He truly didn't understand what he'd just said.

 

[bollar]

People in general are without EV knowledge. The comment was sexist in specifying just women, though it's not actually inaccurate.

It's also likely true the total number of men with EV knowledge out number women with EV knowledge, largely since men vastly outnumber women in the tech heavy fields that would typically be interested in EVs. That's simply a case of numbers, not sexist though certainly a sad state of affairs across the STEM fields.

As recently as 2005, reputable surveys, such as those from the Pew Research Center would have corroborated the OP's assertion. Recent surveys, however, show that women are somewhat more tech-savvy and more frequent tech users than men. There are a whole lot of caveats to the old and new surveys, though, so take them for what they're worth.

- - - Updated - - -

I have never understood the need to put down large groups of people for no reason.

I'm with ya on this.

 

[ckessel]

Recent surveys, however, show that women are somewhat more tech-savvy and more frequent tech users than men.

No shock there. Women have outnumbered men in college for a while now (in the US anyway) which has various implications, but surely one of which is a higher familiarity with technology as that's part of any non-trivial career these days.. It's a shame the STEM fields are still male dominated as the world is always facing a shortage of good people in those industries.

Anyway, far afield from the i3.

 

[Doug_G]

Back on topic, please...

 

[brianman]

Back on topic, please...

I applaud the effort to make a decent EV at a decent price. I'm not sure if I consider the BMW i3 a decent EV. I'm still mulling it over.

 

[TexasEV]

I applaud the effort to make a decent EV at a decent price. I'm not sure if I consider the BMW i3 a decent EV. I'm still mulling it over.

Or a decent price. What makes it worth so much more than a Leaf other than the BMW nameplate? The interior isn't any nicer than a Leaf.

 

[Shumdit]

I drive a 55hp Fiat Panda.

I'm sorry...

 

[johnnyS]

I have seen a couple of i3s driving and thought they look decent. I saw one charging at our local city hall. It was the copper and black color scheme. I think the two tone color scheme accentuates its ugliness. The design is over done. The interior looks small. The leaf is a lot more attractive for less money.

 

[surfingslovak]

In my industry they call this "design to fail". They are perpetuating the the perceived limitations.

I'm not sure what to make of the range extension feature using the 650cc motor. If I've done my back-of-the-envelope calculations correctly, I would not be able to drive from my home in San Diego to a nearby tourist trap called Julian (at about 5000'), because by the time I turned off the freeway the battery would be empty and the range extender wouldn't be able to handle even 45mph up any decent hill. And yet this is a drive that I don't hesitate to do in the Roadster so long as it has at least 3/4 standard charge. (There are now some Blink chargers at Santa Ynez, about 3/4 of the way to Julian if you go that way, but you'd still have to stop for an hour or so in the i3.)

Don Parsons from Denver, CO has recently taken a trip to the summit of Mt. Evans, which is the highest-elevation paved road in the US. The trip took him over 14,000 feet above sea level, and has pushed the range extender beyond its limit. Here is his write-up:

http://bit.ly/donparsonsmtevanstrip

 

[glhs272]

Climb up to the top of a mountain and your brakes fail?

 

[geosynch]

Brake "fail" was a warning not related to the climb; likely related to a known issue on the 12V system.

Here's a theoretical top speed of the i3 when the battery has become depleted, per my calculations. Assumptions of the calculation are documented here. One of the assumption is sea level, although I didn't list that in the assumption I'll have to fix that. This table has proven to be pretty close to observations.

Unfortunately, the "corner case" of needing to maintain freeway speeds during a sustained climb isn't that much of a corner. Many people don't find that "corner" but many do. I can't take my i3 to Tahoe from the SF Bay Are, for example. If we can get CARB to change its rules, this issue will go away. For example, in Europe, i3 drivers from Belgium can drive to the Swiss Alps on the REx.

This is a CARB fail, not a BMW fail.