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Carbon Footprint of attending the Model S Factory tour

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My sense is that when we try to "fix nature" on a grand scale we tend to make things worse.
Generally I think it is better to "stop doing bad stuff" and let it "heal itself" than try to intervene further.
Even if we fixed one problem we might introduce others.
 
I'm all for doing the right thing. I'm a realist, however, and I don't see the whole world taking the situation seriously enough to really slow down oil consumption (as fuel) until something catastrophic happens, say, every week. China's out of control with CO2 and will probably get much more out of control before anything gets better. Continued technological innovation and generating more excitement and acceptance of electric vehicles are some of the most important things we can do right now.
 
I'm all for doing the right thing. I'm a realist, however, and I don't see the whole world taking the situation seriously enough to really slow down oil consumption (as fuel) until something catastrophic happens, say, every week. China's out of control with CO2 and will probably get much more out of control before anything gets better. Continued technological innovation and generating more excitement and acceptance of electric vehicles are some of the most important things we can do right now.

In the next few years, several clean/efficient technologies technologies will become viable technologies. In our minds they already are, but by usual standards, for example solar will become cost competitive only soon. EVs have not yet proven their mainstream appeal. In our minds, they are already solutions, but they aren't yet by usual standards.

However, once they are "solutions" in a more conventional sense, vague environmental problems will be re-categorized as solvable problems, as problems for which there is practical action that can solve them or at least begin to solve them in the sense of making a valid difference.

This means that environmental thinking will change from being perceived as "utopian", to being understood as "real". Which in turn will allow the problem recognized by environmental thinking to be taken seriously, as a "real" problem. At that point, I think, a lot can change.
 
What about just Europe? Do all reporters have to be global, filling up flights to far off destinations?
No offense to you, but it is part of the system that continues to consume up the oil.

I disagree. *aminorjourney* is very welcome! Tesla and the rest of us EV advocates can do with all the favorable press that we can get. If anything, the press on this side of the Atlantic is much more myopic, prejudiced and stuck in the past on average. Flying far and often is what it is - I'm 'guilty' of that too; as someone said on the other thread about the event, Al Gore does not live in a cave burning just candles :)
 
Cloud computing is, in general, much more efficient than using local computing resources.
http://googlegreenblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/how-our-cloud-does-more-with-less.html

And, like EVs, cloud computing gets more green as we green the grid (so does local computing, but like ICE vs. EV, might as well be efficient, too).



Look, we're at the tip of an iceberg here. If travelling to the event gets you more excited by the Model S, and you sell more to the unbelieving heathens(*), then the CO2 spent is well worth it. It's still very, very hard to live a zero-damage life - I doubt you actually can (I suspect you can come close on CO2, but there are so many measures...). It's like building renewable power - it still costs a lot of fossil fuel / CO2 to build renewable power sources, but for each one we do, it's far, far better leverage of the non-renewable resources than just puttering about in a inefficient pollution-spewing banger.

(*)I originally thought I needed some sort of explanation for this, but really, do I?
 
A thought that keeps popping into my head is "where does the buck stop?"
In other words, the early adopters can say "we are just early adopters still using the old fuel but we start to set an example for the next generation to take over." Or do we decide that the time has come to fully embrace the EV and start to make huge sacrifices on anything else that burns fuel?

I have seriously mixed feelings when the ones creating or hyping the product aren't doing everything possible to set the full example. Well, Tesla themselves seem to have "ratcheted way back" from the "sales by guilt" angle... I guess it is probably true that sales volumes could be bigger if they sell purely based on attractive metrics such as costs per mile for energy, and reduced maintenance without resorting to the "you must buy this to be good" angle that would turn many away.

One great thing about the Internet is that it can replace much air travel for many. Particularly for things like new product information announcements. For instance, say hypothetically, I wanted to go to the Frankfurt auto show and see what is there. Well these days I can look on the Internet and see photos and videos of everything going on there, and don't feel like I missed out by not going there in person.

If a UK based reporter flys to the USA to cover a USA product unveiling and that keeps multiple other Europeans from "bothering" to make the trip themselves, then great... Pollution reduction. But if EV products are attracting so much mainstream press that every publication wants to get on board, and there are huge amounts of reporters flying in, maybe not so good. Maybe Nikki can let us know how many international reporters ended up flying out to see it? Also, will that result in many unique stories, or a bunch of redundant repeats of the same info?
 
This probably should be moved to another thread, namely Carbon Footprint of attending the Model S Factory tour

But I'm going to comment on this thread anyway.

IMHO your comment was inappropriate. Nikki's job is to report on green technologies. She can't do that by reading a few random third-hand internet postings. It's not just reasonable for her to attend the event and report on it; it's necessary.

You're going to have a footprint on the environment if you're living in this world. At this point in time some things can be done with a lower environmental footprint, and other things cannot. You can't stop your life because of that; you just have to do what you can. I'm not going to stop traveling by air when I need/want to, but I do less of it than I used to. Hopefully over time low-carbon or recycled-carbon fuels will be developed for air travel.

In the meantime, I'm driving an EV, which is more than 99% of the population is doing, but I don't feel a need to get on a high horse about it. I'm not trying to shame my neighbours about what car they are driving.
 
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Barring some huge eye-opening event that outright requires it, the world isn't going to change this way... People aren't going to all of a sudden start thinking "hmmm, should I really take this trip? How can I take a vacation and have the lowest carbon footprint possible?". Myself included.

I think the trick, if there is one, would be to make it easy to do the right thing. Make it no compromise. Work to make jets cleaner, not reduce travel. Work to make the energy you burn in the house cleaner, not enter full blackout mode in your house after 9pm. Work to offer a great vehicle that saves you money while also burning clean!
 
If you REALLY want to be green, forget about all this electric car stuff. There are just too !@#$%^& people on this planet. So the real answer is not 'buy Tesla' but 'buy condoms!'
 
Sorry to be a 'Debbie Downer' (as Doug might say), but I do feel rather strongly that long haul air travel is something we (as a populace) should take more seriously. Think about this:
An average driver goes perhaps 10K miles per year in their car. One air trip from San Francisco to London and back basically duplicates that mileage. The aircraft has no catalytic converter. It goes at a fast speed which causes a lot of wind resistance. Sure you have a lot of people in the one vehicle, but it still uses a tremendous amount of fuel per person. Just taking one of those trips negates a good chunk of the environmental relief one might have had from driving an EV instead of an ICE all year.

And yes, I hope we get some new technology someday soon so that air travel can get off of petroleum burning just like Tesla is doing for cars.
 
Just to chime in with support for TEG. I do believe it is appropriate to ask if a reporter really needs to come over from the UK. I'm not saying it's never justified but one should really ask that question. I also believe reducing long-range travel has merit, though I've done almost a yearly US vacation the last years so what a strive to do and what I actually do isn't the same. That doesn't mean the goal is wrong just that I'm working towards it.

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