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Carbon Footprint of attending the Model S Factory tour

Discussion in 'Energy, Environment, and Policy' started by AndrewBissell, Aug 12, 2011.

  1. AndrewBissell

    AndrewBissell Member

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    Anyone see the Carbon Footprint Elephant-in-the-Room? All this flying to ride in an electric car? Hate to be a party pooper, and I really want to go, but if I do it could only be because I had to be in the close area anyway for some other essential reason.

    The European alternative is to see it in March at Geneva, with either electric trains or our own electric rides to take us there.
     
  2. GSP

    GSP Member

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    Some of us use electricity from the oldest coal power plant in the US to charge our electric vehicles. Not helping CO2, but we still love our EVs, which do still help in other ways.

    Every day we have to decide how we will spend our electric miles (a limited asset for non-Tesla EVs). The best CO2 answer is to just stay home, but life must go on, so decide what trips are important, or add value to our lives, and go.

    Likewise, everyone has a limited time to live. We all have to decide how to spend this limited time. If an activity is important or enriches your life, do it.

    Likewise, we all have a travel budget. We only have so much vacation time, or just time period. We also have a monetary budget, and must decide what is most important to us, then use our money, and our time, for that. Some are also consicous of our CO2 budget. It is not zero. We have to decide what is important in life and spent our CO2 on that.

    If anyone thinks that flying to beautiful SanFrancisco, meeting fellow Tesla enthusiasts and employees, and riding in a the new BETA Model S is worth spending their time and money to greatly enrich their life, it is also worth spending their CO2 budget as well. The time, money, and CO2 would most likely be spent on a different leisure trip somewhere else if they did not come to to celebrate Tesla's new EV.

    GSP
     
  3. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    Nice, GSP.

    As many have gleefully pointed out, Al Gore does not sit in a cave with candles and blankets.
     
  4. PopSmith

    PopSmith Saving for a Model 3

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    For the CO2 part, find a nearly-full flight and use it to go to California for the tour. The planes are going to fly whether or not a Beta "Test Ride" attendee is on board. :tongue:

    I hope Tesla does a similar event for BlueStar and beyond when they are first introduced.
     
  5. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    Absolutely

    What actually is the level this budget should be set at?

    The planes are flying there anyway argument is the one that keeps them flying. So your personal emissions for the flight must be 0 then...


    To give an idea of what this involves, if one took a flight from London to SFO just to see the car, you would have to drive more than 33000 km in the Model S just to offset the emissions from that flight compared with getting a 3 litre Audi A6 TDi from the local dealer. (I've used UK grid emissions in that calculation but German and Dutch are very similar.) 'Fraid I'm with Andrew on this: If you have to go there anyway, fair enough, but if you're just going to see the car then it kinda wipes out the benefit of the car.
     
  6. Kevin Sharpe

    Kevin Sharpe Active Member

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    this personal responsibility stuff sure is tough sometimes :wink:
     
  7. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    Can we please not turn this thread into this? Not everyone is into EVs for the uber green credit. With me, discussions about my "Carbon Footprint" is nearly equivalent to PETA telling me I can't have a steak.

    It's all hypocritical anyway unless you're living like the Amish folk around here, but if that's what you're about: great. Just don't preach to me.
     
  8. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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  9. Kevin Sharpe

    Kevin Sharpe Active Member

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    nobody is preaching to you... just asking a grown up question about the choices that we make...
     
  10. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Carbon Footprint Calculator

    Where is that 'electric jet' we keep hearing about?

    I try to avoid flying as much as possible these days, but it sure does feel constraining.
     
  11. Kevin Harney

    Kevin Harney Active Member

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    Well you do have to divide that 1.53 metric tons by the 200 or so passengers and crew right ?!?!?! LOL :)
     
  12. Lloyd

    Lloyd Active Member

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    #12 Lloyd, Aug 17, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2011
    No this figure would be correct for each passenger. Typical flight 200 seats will burn about 15,000 gallons San Francisco to London. Weight of Fuel ~90,000 lbs. C02 produced is about 600,000 lbs divided by 200 passengers is 3,000 lbs per passenger each way.
     
  13. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    Yep. The calculator I used says 1.86 tonnes for economy, 5.3 for business class and over 7.4 for first.

    I used 1.86 in the calculation.
     
  14. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

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    Anyone want to buy some carbon offset credits from my solar system? :biggrin:

    Carbon Offset.jpg
     
  15. Jaff

    Jaff Active Member

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    #15 Jaff, Aug 18, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2011
    Buy carbon credits from Florida Nig?

    That one acre kinda looked like swampland to me...:biggrin::wink:
     
  16. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

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    Everglades! :tongue:
     
  17. zack

    zack Member

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    Not sure how much one less ticket sold will reduce the amount of kerosene burned on any given flight, but it sure would be nice if jets burned hydrogen in the future and it was derived from alternative, non-carbon renewable energy. We're not going to change everything at once, but our electric cars make a significant impact in many ways. One thing to keep in mind, even if we can't reduce our carbon footprints as fast as we'd like, is that we've never had to fight a war over electricity. Coal, uranium, hydro, natural gas, solar, wind, geothermal... it's all right here in North America and requires no guns, tanks, rockets, drones, or fallen soldiers. To me it's more about moving the focus of our precious financial resources away from killing and toward developing a sustainable course. It's not so much about the momentary guilt of buying an airplane ticket... it's about the overall direction we're headed. It's impossible to live in the modern world at the moment without having significant carbon footprints, but I'd like to believe that the directions my footprints are headed are beginning to aim away from fossil fuels. Oil is a great resource, and the oil left in the ground needs to stay there for use in making plastics and other materials we need in the future. Even natural gas is used to make plastics.
     
  18. DisneylandIsHome

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    Everyone stay home and give us more time with the Model S. We're charging our Roadster using our solar panels and driving the 37 miles round trip no matter what anyone says! :cool:
     
  19. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    It's more about reducing demand so that maybe 9 instead of 10 flights operate a route on a given day

    Or they could be switched to run on methanol pretty much tomorrow. Hydrogen for planes en masse is as much of an unobtainable dream as for road cars.

    From http://www.efcf.com/reports/E21.pdf

    But is that going to really be affected by your seeing the car a few months before it's in the local store?
     
  20. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    I wonder how much CO2 is produced to fly a corporate jet between LA and SF twice a week all year long...
     

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