Al Gore gave it a legitimate foundation, it grew legs on extrapolations, now it's dogma.
Call it heresy.
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Climate Change / Global Warming Discussion
- Thread starter Raffy.Roma
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Call it heresy.
Say, did you happen to read Michael Crichton's book "State of Fear?" Because your ideas sound an awful lot like his. I've read it. Really enjoyed his other works of fiction.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Remember when certain people were falsely blaming renewables for Texas grid problems?
www.cnn.com
Wind and solar power are 'bailing out' Texas amid record heat and energy demand | CNN
Energy experts told CNN the Texas electric grid is holding up well this week in large part to strong performances from renewable energy.
www.cnn.com
mspohr
Well-Known Member
New data reveals extraordinary global heating in the Arctic
New data has revealed extraordinary rates of global heating in the Arctic, up to seven times faster than the global average. The heating is occurring in the North Barents Sea, a region where fast rising temperatures are suspected to trigger increases in extreme weather in North America, Europe and Asia. The researchers said the heating in this region was an “early warning” of what could happen across the rest of the Arctic.
New data has revealed extraordinary rates of global heating in the Arctic, up to seven times faster than the global average. The heating is occurring in the North Barents Sea, a region where fast rising temperatures are suspected to trigger increases in extreme weather in North America, Europe and Asia. The researchers said the heating in this region was an “early warning” of what could happen across the rest of the Arctic.
They were partly right. Not all things are done correctly. The "southern" wind turbines were installed without the deicing capabilities that are used in northern climates. They forgot that Texas has winter storms, too.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
No they weren't, even though the turbines went offline they were not what caused the grid failure during that winter storm, it was the failure of conventional generating plants.
fingers were pointed everywhere. there is no definitive answer that was given to the public. all we have are culprits, as defined by Media with agendas.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
It's an impossibility of physics in that case for wind, (which could have been at most around 20% of potential grid capability), to have caused what happened. It was the majority of power generation failing, i.e. NG and coal, that caused it.
mspohr
Well-Known Member
Texas didn't learn its lesson | Experts say little has changed with winterization of generators since blackouts of 2011
Ten years ago, severe winter weather caused rolling blackouts, sparking a Senate hearing and a lot of outrage. However, some observers say not much has changed.
www.khou.com
At power plants across the state, this 350-page report concluded cold-weather preps were "either inadequate or not adequately followed.”
Fast forward to present day, and little has changed.
“This was a failure from the get go,” UH Energy Professor Ed Hirs said. "It's exactly what happened in 2011, the summertime generators were not available to come online. They haven't been winterized. They haven't been in hot oil. They haven't had antifreeze.”
Abbott orders Texas PUC to double down on natural gas, coal
Houston Chronicle: Gov. Greg Abbott on Tuesday ordered the Public Utility Commission of Texas to make substantial changes in an effort to prevent power outages in the future.
Most of the power generation that went offline in the February freeze and in June came from thermal sources, said Kay McCall, executive director of the Renewable Energy Alliance of Houston.
I always love it when climate “skeptics” pull the Al Gore card. Apparently you folks think because Al Gore spoke, or bought a house or flew in an airplane that the basic physics of heat transfer no longer function and carbon reduction solutions can’t work because markets don’t function.
Totally rational positions.
Is Al Gore a wizard @tangible1 ? Is that why you have faith that nothing needs to be done about climate change?
I have faith that humans will adapt.
We fon't need the hyperbole, virtue signalling and shaming.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Discussing facts is none of that. Humans won't adapt by ignoring reality and if the environment is altered too greatly we may not be able to adapt.
mspohr
Well-Known Member
How do you think we adapt?
Since you don’t seem to have a background in how large scale engineering/design/ infrastructure projects occur let me fill you in.
The first thing is to estimate or model the issue that requires you to do the project in the first place. An example, DOT comes out and measures the traffic at an intersection and they model the expected increase in traffic flow for some time period. They then design an new intersection that can handle the expected increase but also meets their budget and schedule.
You say we will adapt. To adapt we have to know: adapting to what. Basic physics tells us if we burn all the known stores of fossil fuels we decrease the amount of heat leaving the earth by a certain amount which in turn requires global temperatures to increase until outgoing radiation equals incoming radiation. This is basic thermodynamics.
The temperatures the planet will reach will accelerate the melt of land based glaciers in Greenland and Antarctica increasing sea level rise. Thermal expansion of water will also contribute.
650M people live within 10m vertical rise of sea level along with every port city in the world. Sea level rise will require adaption by all of them. $$$$
All of our cities and more importantly farms were placed based on the temperatures and climate of the last 150 years. Global agriculture will have to adapt. More $$$$
That above is what we have to adapt to if we go about business as usual. It’s also what you call hyperbole.
Instead of going with business as usual and trying to adapt to the worst case. We can spend a lot less $$$$ and lives by adapting now and moving to eliminate carbon based fuels. Some warming is already baked in but it will require much less adaption if we reduce and stop the increase in the next few decades.
Quite frankly I see no reason why we can’t bootstrap ourselves from fossil fuels to a carbon neutral future while still increasing global quality of living and reducing poverty. But only if we accept what’s plainly happening and stop having “faith” it will magically be handled.
Unfortunately, there are many who don't seem to be susceptible to logic and facts. They are visceral thinkers. A few centuries ago these same folks were insisting that the world is flat and persecuting Galileo.
You have it completely backwards bringing up tobacco companies.
That's the exact method and even the same companies used by climate change deniers -- the ones you believe.
For more details, see the film Merchants of Doubt
More like exactly what's going on, from BOTH sides of the coin.
Don;'t think for one minute that your preferred sources are angels either.
Let it go.
Sorry to put you out.
No sale. You're captive to the construct without direct experience of the problem.
30 years ago the researchers at Salk Institue of Oceanography were in my orbit.
They were tracking CO2 rise even before then. But they struggled to find cause/effect and direct links to actual issues.
Still the case.
Fast forward to today, and climate change is now the preferred phrase for Media to describe any weather event, trivial or major.
Yes, things are changing, but that's not under our direct control. It's the height of conceit to believe otherwise; science as religion doesn't wash.
That doesn't mean we shouldn't seek to understand root causes, or attempt to mitigate what we can. But we are not in an existential situation.
The emotional rhetoric and shaming put forth by the 'faithful' is just a bit over the top.
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