Climate Change / Global Warming Discussion

[Chopr147]

It's science!

 

[JRP3]

People that study gender are trained in a different discipline than people who study climate science.

Why mix the two?

To muddy the waters of course.

 

[SDRick]

It's science!

So how many genders does science say we have?

 

[Norbert]

Meanwhile...the temperature keeps going up.

Roughly 10 years ago we had this big discussion with deniers saying the temperature has reached a top and is going down now, claiming that climate scientists were misinterpreting the numbers statistically. They themselves were wrong, the temperature kept going up. Where is the admission, the apology? Did I miss it?

 

[Norbert]

NASA GISTEMP cycle as of September 2019

The black dots are the temperatures from 2019 until September.

 

[S'toon]

Illegal loggers in the Amazon ambushed an Indigenous group that was formed to protect the forest and shot dead a young warrior and wounded another, leaders of the Guajajara tribe in northern Brazil said Saturday.

The clash comes amid an increase in invasions of reservations by illegal loggers and miners since right-wing President Jair Bolsonaro took office this year and vowed to open up protected Indigenous lands to economic development.

"The Bolsonaro government has Indigenous blood on its hands," Brazil's pan-Indigenous organization APIB, which represents many of the country's 900,000 native people, said in a statement Saturday.

"The increase in violence in Indigenous territories is a direct result of his hateful speeches and steps taken against our people," APIB said.

APIB leader Sonia Guajajara said the government was dismantling environmental and Indigenous agencies, and leaving tribes to defend themselves from invasion of their lands.

<snip>

Full article at:

Illegal loggers kill Amazon Indigenous warrior who guarded forest

 

[ZsoZso]

People that study gender are trained in a different discipline than people who study climate science.

Why mix the two?

Oh, look at that Wookiee !

Spoiler: wookiee defense

Chewbacca defense - Wikipedia

 

[mspohr]

Want to save lives, money or both? Harvard says install solar

Want to save lives, money or both? Harvard says install solar
A new study released by the Harvard Center for Climate, Health, and the Global Environment looks at the importance of where renewable generation is developed, more than how much. The study analyzes the economic and public health benefits of renewables in each comparative region of the country.


Climate and health benefits of increasing renewable energy deployment in the United States - IOPscience

Climate and health benefits of increasing renewable energy deployment in the United States

 

[d21mike]

Want to save lives, money or both? Harvard says install solar

Want to save lives, money or both? Harvard says install solar
A new study released by the Harvard Center for Climate, Health, and the Global Environment looks at the importance of where renewable generation is developed, more than how much. The study analyzes the economic and public health benefits of renewables in each comparative region of the country.


Climate and health benefits of increasing renewable energy deployment in the United States - IOPscience

Climate and health benefits of increasing renewable energy deployment in the United States

This is what I have been saying. Anyone that can afford to put SOLAR on their Roof should do it NOW. Do not wait. The 30% tax credit ends this year and the entire tax credit ends in 2022 (unless extended). I do not understand why this is not the number 1 item in the GND. There is no reason the reshape the entire economy to make this happen this year. Just ASK those that CAN to do so. And then item 2 in the GND. Those that can buy an electric car do so ASAP. But at a minimum make a "PLEDGE" to never buy another ICE Car. Keep driving you current ICE Car until the auto makers come out with affordable electric cars. 1 year with NO NEW ICE Cars sold would cause a huge shift.

 

[JRP3]

I'm trying to get solar panels and a powerwall installed on my mother's house but after signing up for it the message from Tesla is "We will contact you when solar is available in your area". Hello, I'm 3 hours away from GF2! (Yes I realize they are using Korean panels not produced in Buffalo)

 

[Skotty]

NASA GISTEMP cycle as of September 2019

The black dots are the temperatures from 2019 until September.

View attachment 472904

Climate change is a hoax! I see this graph every year, and every year it looks the same with the current year dots at the top. They just recycle this chart every year.

Just joking, of course.

 

[Norbert]

Just joking, of course.

I'm so glad you added that!

 

[wateredown]

People still use coal, but it's dropping like a stone. Poorer countries use it, but no one's going to build new coal plants when solar/wind+storage are so much better and cheaper. It's already unthinkably rapid decline will likely accelerate from here.

Demand for oil is already in the 6 year window of peaking and pretty soon all investment will flee just like with coal. After that comes chaos that will continue to ratchet down the use of oil as it becomes alternately dirt cheap and absurdly expensive. Sit back and enjoy the show, it's gonna be hilarious.

I'm new to this forum and after my brother-in-law in Denver bought a M3 I decided to check this car out. There is a lot of interesting info here but then I ran across this thread. All this talk about oil going away is simply ridiculous. I farm In N Dakota and usually burn between 10 and 12000 gallons of diesel fuel a year. How is wind/solar produced electricity going to replace that? I know Elon is planning an electric semi (and pickup) but will be outrageously expensive and farmers don't buy new trucks. Mine are at least 12 years old and average 600000 miles on their odometers. It's all I can afford and making a slim profit is kind of important. How are you going to power locomotives if you get rid of diesel fuel? What about aircraft? Ships? My big tractors produce 450+ hp and have to run 16-18 hours a day, how big a Duracell will they require?

I have a neighbor who went full on Mother Earth News a while back. Solar panels, a windmill to pump water into a cistern uphill from his house, a wind turbine to produce electricity, gardens everywhere and all the rest of it. He tore it all out three years later or his wife was leaving. Sure that was ten years ago and everything has supposedly gotten better but it will always get better and those payback times you folks are talking about for your solar panels and battery backups will coincide with the need to replace it all. Wind turbines are already coming down around Cheyenne and the cost to dispose of that stuff is staggering.

I know, I live in the wrong part of the world to expect solar to ever be useful and though it can be very windy here, usually it's calm... but I guess you nice people in California will sympathetically provide the funds to install transmission lines from there to me. All I am trying to say is oil is NOT going away. Maybe in your comfortable climate where your biggest concern is deciding what color tie to wear to work and maybe having to hire somebody to change a flat, electricity from the wall is great. It doesn't work for me.

 

[ggies07]

I'm new to this forum and after my brother-in-law in Denver bought a M3 I decided to check this car out. There is a lot of interesting info here but then I ran across this thread. All this talk about oil going away is simply ridiculous. I farm In N Dakota and usually burn between 10 and 12000 gallons of diesel fuel a year. How is wind/solar produced electricity going to replace that? I know Elon is planning an electric semi (and pickup) but will be outrageously expensive and farmers don't buy new trucks. Mine are at least 12 years old and average 600000 miles on their odometers. It's all I can afford and making a slim profit is kind of important. How are you going to power locomotives if you get rid of diesel fuel? What about aircraft? Ships? My big tractors produce 450+ hp and have to run 16-18 hours a day, how big a Duracell will they require?

I have a neighbor who went full on Mother Earth News a while back. Solar panels, a windmill to pump water into a cistern uphill from his house, a wind turbine to produce electricity, gardens everywhere and all the rest of it. He tore it all out three years later or his wife was leaving. Sure that was ten years ago and everything has supposedly gotten better but it will always get better and those payback times you folks are talking about for your solar panels and battery backups will coincide with the need to replace it all. Wind turbines are already coming down around Cheyenne and the cost to dispose of that stuff is staggering.

I know, I live in the wrong part of the world to expect solar to ever be useful and though it can be very windy here, usually it's calm... but I guess you nice people in California will sympathetically provide the funds to install transmission lines from there to me. All I am trying to say is oil is NOT going away. Maybe in your comfortable climate where your biggest concern is deciding what color tie to wear to work and maybe having to hire somebody to change a flat, electricity from the wall is great. It doesn't work for me.

1) How are you new when you profile says 2015..........

2) You are in the wrong thread, this is the thread you want. All your questions will be answer over 290 pages, so get to reading!

Shorting Oil, Hedging Tesla

 

[JRP3]

electricity from the wall is great. It doesn't work for me.

So how did you manage to post that comment without electricity?

 

[nwdiver]

He tore it all out three years later or his wife was leaving. .........
I know, I live in the wrong part of the world to expect solar to ever be useful and though it can be very windy here, usually it's calm... but I guess you nice people in California will sympathetically provide the funds to install transmission lines from there to me. All I am trying to say is oil is NOT going away. Maybe in your comfortable climate where your biggest concern is deciding what color tie to wear to work and maybe having to hire somebody to change a flat, electricity from the wall is great. It doesn't work for me.

Why would his wife leave? Was she getting tired of saving money? I have a house near Seattle with solar that generates >100% of what it needs annually. If solar can work there then it can work anywhere in the US (Except maybe Alaska). You appear to have some incredibly significant misunderstanding in how a lot of stuff works. May I suggest asking questions instead of stuffing misinformation in knowledge gaps?

And oil doesn't have to 'go away' we just need to start behaving ethically and manufacture our own oil from CO2 + H2O and clean energy instead of stealing it from our kids... there are few things more pathetic than someone that steals from their children..... I suspect electrification will be FAR FAAR cheaper but oil doesn't have to 'go away'.....

 

[roblab]

...All I am trying to say is oil is NOT going away. Maybe in your comfortable climate where your biggest concern is deciding what color tie to wear to work and maybe having to hire somebody to change a flat, electricity from the wall is great. It doesn't work for me.

Well, my friend, it DOES work for me. I have 68 solar panels on my back roof, and three power walls, and we just went through a 5 day power outage, just another one from PG&E.

While everyone else worried about food spoiling and reading by candle light, my wife and I continued as if nothing had happened, because for us, nothing had changed. We had full power for lights, refrigerators and freezers, air conditioners, AND WE CHARGED OUR TESLAS. This was all because I decided a dozen years ago to cut down my electric bill (haven't had one for 6 years) and try to make power for our outages, which are common.

And, if you are smart, you might do some research on oil. It IS going away. Demand is shrinking, and every year less and less is needed. Most calculations figure big oil will be fighting to stay alive by 2030. Wind turbines and geothermal and dams keep increasing, and oil is definitely dropping year by year. It may not "go away", but it will no longer be "BIG" oil.

I don't use diesel because that was my choice years ago. All of my power tools are battery driven now, and my power walls make sure I don't use grid power even when it's on.

 

[WannabeOwner]

All this talk about oil going away is simply ridiculous. I farm In N Dakota and usually burn between 10 and 12000 gallons of diesel fuel a year.

Taking your point at face value I'll assume that your situation means you will be one of the last to leave Oil. I agree, there aren't solutions to all problems ... yet. I live in farming community, big tractors all around me, I don't see a solution to those ... yet.

My [Electricity] fuel cost, here in UK, for EV is FIVE TIMES less than Gas. Gas is cheaper in USA ... but its price will go up as it becomes scarce, or a future government decides to tax Carbon more, so whether you like it or not your oil cost will become unacceptable in a few years and that will force your hand to change in order to stay competitive as a farmer.

So for you, with your specific can't-switch-yet scenario, then so long as everyone who can switch does so then that will leave oil in the ground for you. You could therefore spend your "Eco effort" on persuading everyone you know, who can, to switch

If you don't think oil will become scarce then I foresee two immediate threats:

Peak Oil. From Peak Oil you have 20 years until it is all used up; extracting the second-half will be much harder than the first-half was.

Opinions vary on whether we are at, or have passed, Peak Oil. If we have only used 1/4 then we have 40 years until "empty". That might see you out ... but its "not long" for children / grand children.

Oil exploration. Investors (sovereign wealth funds, pensions, etc.) are ditching their Oil portfolio stocks like hot potatoes, "oil investment shame" will accelerate that. So the money for exploration investment is drying up ... so exploration will decline ... and therefore oil supply will decline and price will go up.

 

[mspohr]

Climate crisis: 11,000 scientists warn of ‘untold suffering’

Climate crisis: 11,000 scientists warn of ‘untold suffering’

“We declare clearly and unequivocally that planet Earth is facing a climate emergency,” it states. “To secure a sustainable future, we must change how we live. [This] entails major transformations in the ways our global society functions and interacts with natural ecosystems.”

The world’s people face “untold suffering due to the climate crisis” unless there are major transformations to global society, according to a stark warning from more than 11,000 scientists

They set out a series of urgently needed actions:

Use energy far more efficiently and apply strong carbon taxes to cut fossil fuel use
Stabilise global population – currently growing by 200,000 people a day – using ethical approaches such as longer education for girls
End the destruction of nature and restore forests and mangroves to absorb CO2
Eat mostly plants and less meat, and reduce food waste
Shift economic goals away from GDP growth

 

[iPlug]

Great optimism here and most on these threads rightly looking for oil demand to peak then drop. Unfortunately, no good signs it's happening yet or in the very near future. Lots of work to do.