Confirm PUP $5000 refund thread

[Garlan Garner]

Many of us don't feel like $5000 is an even exchange for free supercharging which is why it's more of a refund to us. We've done the math for ourselves. For free supercharging to be worth $5000 you'd have to do a ton of supercharging for the entire life of the car. I charge at home and don't travel enough to make it worth it.

You have solar and likely charge at home too, so it's surprising that you've determined it's worth it to you to keep the free supercharging.

In Illinois, for example, it's $0.24 / kWh so you'd get 20,833 kWh for $5000 or fully charge your car from dead over 277 times. If you actually got the rated range of 310 miles that'd be over 86,000 miles solely using superchargers. Assuming the car is never sold or totalled in that time. You must travel a lot.

Personally, I travel/vacation by car 1000-1500 miles a year max, where I'd use superchargers, so that'd take me over 80 years to make that up, especially considering part of my trip uses the energy I got at home.

Just an FYI...

I have had my P3D+ for 15 weeks. I have over 15k miles on my car. I supercharge "a lot". I also charge at home every day.

It won't take me 80 years to charge $5k worth of electricity.

Lastly - I am a person that loves to get rid of anxiety in these days and times and I'm willing to pay to do so. Just like I don't have range anxiety of my model 3..….I also don't have supercharger anxiety. The supercharger cost meter in my car doesn't exist.
I have an anxietyless car.
All I all...I can charge anywhere on the planet for free ( supercharger, home, charge point) and 5K is a small price to pay to forever get rid of any fuel costs...IMHO.

 

[adhoc]

Yep...you are correct....."Tesla says....."

However if it was a true refund....I wouldn't also owe Tesla something in exchange for the $5000.00

I don't know of may refunds that require you to pay something back. That just makes no sense by definition of what a refund is.

Tesla should have said that they are willing to "Exchange" $5000 for unlimited supercharging. That would have been much more accurate.

maybe you should take this up with CEO?
his twitter said REFUND!

it wasn’t until corporate decide to possibly
talk or block some early PUP purchasers
from collecting upon the CEO’s good will,
that a return of FUSC resultant of reference
be withdrawn.

now several of us oredered early enough
to receive FUSC not via referral but due
to purchase date.

my confirmation email reads that I’m only
losing FUSC resultant from referral.
corporate has yet to address this issue.

I really don’t understand your aim at parsing
language that is self explanatory?

 

[JG T3SLA]

Just an FYI...

I have had my P3D+ for 15 weeks. I have over 15k miles on my car. I supercharge "a lot". I also charge at home every day.

It won't take me 80 years to charge $5k worth of electricity.

Lastly - I am a person that loves to get rid of anxiety in these days and times and I'm willing to pay to do so. Just like I don't have range anxiety of my model 3..….I also don't have supercharger anxiety. The supercharger cost meter in my car doesn't exist.
I have an anxietyless car.
All I all...I can charge anywhere on the planet for free ( supercharger, home, charge point) and 5K is a small price to pay to forever get rid of any fuel costs...IMHO.

But the math changes if you total your car tomorrow. Definitely taking on some risk since FUSC doesn’t carry over to another replacement car.

 

[dotbombjoe]

I get people wanting to defend Tesla. I get people wanting to hold them to even higher standards. What I don't really get is why so many people are so judgmental of the opposing opinions...especially in a thread primarily started to identify if anyone had received a refund or discuss where they may be in the process.

Is this really a "right" or "wrong" issue?

I am a huge Tesla fan-boy. That doesn't mean I can't be critical of the company too. I see it as exactly the opposite -- I feel like us "true believers" need to tell them when we think they could have done better so that they DO get better. If your best customers aren't working with you to improve your company then you're doing it wrong. That's my opinion anyway.

I had a pretty poor customer service experience earlier this year..basically, they stranded me without a car or even a lift home. If I didn't tell them about it, they wouldn't have known they did it. They wouldn't have known they sort of pissed me off. And they obviously wouldn't have had the opportunity to fix their mistake. Was I disappointed? Sure was. Was/am I any less of a fanboy? Nope...but I could understand anyone who would be.

Anyway, the point I'm making is that people can be critical of Tesla and still want them to succeed beyond every measure. I do.

FWIW, Tesla wanted me to buy in Q3. They provided incentives that would be available only if I took delivery in Q3. So, I ordered. From that point forward, the sales/support process was rather disappointing. I won't get into all the details but I ended up taking a car I didn't order mostly to help Tesla chalk another delivery up in Q3. Then they dropped the price by $5k a couple weeks later.

As someone that has spent a few hundred grand on Tesla the past few years, it feels like maybe not asking me to give up free supercharging would have been a better choice. I earned the free supercharging because I was a repeat customer/referral. I know the 3p came with it also...so in a way I had it twice over!

At least for those coming with the referral free supercharging, they should have just stuck with: "Hey, thank you for being such an awesome customer and Tesla supporter, we've decided to give you $5k back because we lowered the price on the vehicle right after you bought it".

To those arguing about the dollar value of supercharging, I hear you. And that's a perfectly valid way to think about it. But it is no less valid to consider other perspectives.

First, maybe this is less about the money for some people and more about feeling like you were treated well. Sure, any time a company gives me $5k back after buying something that I love, that's going to make me feel like I was treated pretty well. But following that by saying "but you have to give up your free supercharging that you got because you're a repeat customer" lessens that feeling.

Second, invert your calculations from focusing on the value to the individual car owner and instead think about the cost to Tesla. Will it really cost Tesla that much money to let these handful of customers keep free supercharging? I say handful because we're only talking about what, a few thousand people? Several hundred people? I don't know the numbers but it I don't believe it is a ton. So, maybe a few thousand people -- early adopters even -- who probably won't even use the network very much...I mean, I'm just surprised that they felt that was worth the loss of whatever small amount of good will it would have had. I mean, they go out of their way to make this group super-thrilled by giving them $5k back but then give them a reason to feel less good about it at the same time? I feel like the wrong people were in the room when that decision was made.

I'm guessing they could even have run pretty hard numbers too -- not just purely guessed at the "savings" from taking free supercharging away. Many of the people in this position now were Model S owners. I traded in my P85 for this car. They could have done the math and I bet come up with a pretty solid estimate for the cost and I just can't imagine it was remotely significant. So why ask for a benefit back?

I don't believe Tesla owes me anything. I'm extremely happy they feel they do and I'll be grateful to get that $5k back. One big reason I'm a devoted customer is because they have shown this attitude on many occasions. In this case, I think they were a little short sighted could have done even better. It's just an opinion...and it is no more wrong than anyone else's. ;-)

 

[JeffK]

I get people wanting to defend Tesla. I get people wanting to hold them to even higher standards. What I don't really get is why so many people are so judgmental of the opposing opinions...especially in a thread primarily started to identify if anyone had received a refund or discuss where they may be in the process.

Is this really a "right" or "wrong" issue?

I am a huge Tesla fan-boy. That doesn't mean I can't be critical of the company too. I see it as exactly the opposite -- I feel like us "true believers" need to tell them when we think they could have done better so that they DO get better. If your best customers aren't working with you to improve your company then you're doing it wrong. That's my opinion anyway.

I had a pretty poor customer service experience earlier this year..basically, they stranded me without a car or even a lift home. If I didn't tell them about it, they wouldn't have known they did it. They wouldn't have known they sort of pissed me off. And they obviously wouldn't have had the opportunity to fix their mistake. Was I disappointed? Sure was. Was/am I any less of a fanboy? Nope...but I could understand anyone who would be.

Anyway, the point I'm making is that people can be critical of Tesla and still want them to succeed beyond every measure. I do.

FWIW, Tesla wanted me to buy in Q3. They provided incentives that would be available only if I took delivery in Q3. So, I ordered. From that point forward, the sales/support process was rather disappointing. I won't get into all the details but I ended up taking a car I didn't order mostly to help Tesla chalk another delivery up in Q3. Then they dropped the price by $5k a couple weeks later.

As someone that has spent a few hundred grand on Tesla the past few years, it feels like maybe not asking me to give up free supercharging would have been a better choice. I earned the free supercharging because I was a repeat customer/referral. I know the 3p came with it also...so in a way I had it twice over!

At least for those coming with the referral free supercharging, they should have just stuck with: "Hey, thank you for being such an awesome customer and Tesla supporter, we've decided to give you $5k back because we lowered the price on the vehicle right after you bought it".

To those arguing about the dollar value of supercharging, I hear you. And that's a perfectly valid way to think about it. But it is no less valid to consider other perspectives.

First, maybe this is less about the money for some people and more about feeling like you were treated well. Sure, any time a company gives me $5k back after buying something that I love, that's going to make me feel like I was treated pretty well. But following that by saying "but you have to give up your free supercharging that you got because you're a repeat customer" lessens that feeling.

Second, invert your calculations from focusing on the value to the individual car owner and instead think about the cost to Tesla. Will it really cost Tesla that much money to let these handful of customers keep free supercharging? I say handful because we're only talking about what, a few thousand people? Several hundred people? I don't know the numbers but it I don't believe it is a ton. So, maybe a few thousand people -- early adopters even -- who probably won't even use the network very much...I mean, I'm just surprised that they felt that was worth the loss of whatever small amount of good will it would have had. I mean, they go out of their way to make this group super-thrilled by giving them $5k back but then give them a reason to feel less good about it at the same time? I feel like the wrong people were in the room when that decision was made.

I'm guessing they could even have run pretty hard numbers too -- not just purely guessed at the "savings" from taking free supercharging away. Many of the people in this position now were Model S owners. I traded in my P85 for this car. They could have done the math and I bet come up with a pretty solid estimate for the cost and I just can't imagine it was remotely significant. So why ask for a benefit back?

I don't believe Tesla owes me anything. I'm extremely happy they feel they do and I'll be grateful to get that $5k back. One big reason I'm a devoted customer is because they have shown this attitude on many occasions. In this case, I think they were a little short sighted could have done even better. It's just an opinion...and it is no more wrong than anyone else's. ;-)

This!

As a first day reservation holder and someone who ordered the Performance model the first second I could, I feel like they could have let us keep the free supercharging and give us the refund. Heck, with two and half years interest on my reservation money they could have covered several years of my personal supercharger use.

 

[MP3Mike]

Heck, with two and half years interest on my reservation money they could have covered several years of my personal supercharger use.

You must either not plan on supercharging much or you have a way better place to park cash than I do.

 

[JeffK]

You must either not plan on supercharging much or you have a way better place to park cash than I do.

1000-1500 miles a year of car travel (outside my daily commute)

It's about four or five trips of 300 miles (round trip to my parent's house). 170 miles of those trips are from my 100% charge starting at home.

In my state Tesla charges per minute not per kWh so if I stay for 30 min @ $0.26 = $7.80 * 5 times a year = $39 per year

even at 10% interest, over two and half years would pay for 3-5 years of supercharging.

Average road trip distance one way for Americans is 200-300 miles per trip according to US DOT

 

[Feathermerchan]

WTF guys? From the OP of this thread:

"Created this thread to track the status of your $5k refund for previous PUP owners.

Ive only received a confirmation from the TweetTeam that they have received my request and will contact me in the future.

Others,please chime in."

Can we stay on track and debate the viability, meaning, universal understanding, Karma, etc, etc elsewhere?

 

[JeffK]

WTF guys? From the OP of this thread:

"Created this thread to track the status of your $5k refund for previous PUP owners.

Ive only received a confirmation from the TweetTeam that they have received my request and will contact me in the future.

Others,please chime in."

Can we stay on track and debate the viability, meaning, universal understanding, Karma, etc, etc elsewhere?

There's nothing left to do in this thread until January... I'll eat my hat is someone gets a refund in 2018.

 

[Garlan Garner]

WTF guys? From the OP of this thread:

"Created this thread to track the status of your $5k refund for previous PUP owners.

Ive only received a confirmation from the TweetTeam that they have received my request and will contact me in the future.

Others,please chime in."

Can we stay on track and debate the viability, meaning, universal understanding, Karma, etc, etc elsewhere?

The thread is indeed on track...in that there is nothing to track - yet.

 

[Garlan Garner]

maybe you should take this up with CEO?
his twitter said REFUND!

it wasn’t until corporate decide to possibly
talk or block some early PUP purchasers
from collecting upon the CEO’s good will,
that a return of FUSC resultant of reference
be withdrawn.

now several of us oredered early enough
to receive FUSC not via referral but due
to purchase date.

my confirmation email reads that I’m only
losing FUSC resultant from referral.
corporate has yet to address this issue.

I really don’t understand your aim at parsing
language that is self explanatory?

Wait what? Take it up with the CEO....and say what? He can do whatever he wants. It doesn't mean that he is correct.

i was the 2nd in line on March 31'st 2016. Waited in the rain for 5 hours in the rain. I am certainly a fan-boy.

You know.....its interesting in that no one is conceptually disagreeing with me. The only thing people are saying is that "ELON" called it a refund so that's what it is.

I still call that hogwash. Its not a refund. Its a trade. Tesla is trading $5k for Supercharging - which to me has absolutely Nothing to do with the fact that they changed the price of the car..

In essence I and many others have now PAID for unlimited supercharging. It has become non-free.

 

[cityberty]

Is everyone here getting traction on the refund P3D or P33D+?

 

[Garlan Garner]

But the math changes if you total your car tomorrow. Definitely taking on some risk since FUSC doesn’t carry over to another replacement car.

What?

Sure the math changes if my car gets totaled tomorrow, however think about it....I have had 149 days so far of worriless free charging.

I have a "what if" for you.
What if I have another 17000 days of worriless free charging without incident. What if I NEVER in my lifetime total my car or anything of the sort.
I would have then waste 17000 days or a lifetime worrying about something that was totally unnecessary. Really?

Too many people spend countless useless hours worrying about tomorrow. Premature grey / health issues...etc.

I dare to quote something but it states...."don't worry about tomorrow...for tomorrow will worry about itself".
There is too much uncalled for stress these days. I choose not to choose it.

Soo with that said...I'm sticking with my anxietyless solution of unlimited free supercharging.

 

[NewTMSMan]

Yep...you are correct....."Tesla says....."

However if it was a true refund....I wouldn't also owe Tesla something in exchange for the $5000.00

I don't know of may refunds that require you to pay something back. That just makes no sense by definition of what a refund is.

Tesla should have said that they are willing to "Exchange" $5000 for unlimited supercharging. That would have been much more accurate.

I would agree if the "exchange" were something I paid for, but as it is "free" unlimited supercharging and they are returning money that I paid for something they are now saying I was overcharged for I am going with refund. TBH though I really don't care about the semantics as there is no real difference.

 

[adhoc]

Wait what? Take it up with the CEO....and say what? He can do whatever he wants. It doesn't mean that he is correct.

i was the 2nd in line on March 31'st 2016. Waited in the rain for 5 hours in the rain. I am certainly a fan-boy.

You know.....its interesting in that no one is conceptually disagreeing with me. The only thing people are saying is that "ELON" called it a refund so that's what it is.

I still call that hogwash. Its not a refund. Its a trade. Tesla is trading $5k for Supercharging - which to me has absolutely Nothing to do with the fact that they changed the price of the car..

In essence I and many others have now PAID for unlimited supercharging. It has become non-free.

I’m still missing the why you aren’t taking the CEO’s words verbatim?

congrats on being 2nd in line waiting in the rain,
many of us did it electronically from the comfort of home,
for what it’s worth it has no bearing here...

I’ll mention again, the reversal of FUSC came after the
promise of REFUND from the corporate head!

speculate as you might, conceptulize to your hearts content,
doesn’t change the wording, perhaps that’s why no one has
followed your conceptualization of events, while many have
reflected the wording of the text and the recovery intended to
dissuade early PUP buyers from requesting the REFUND
promised by CEO?

my promise of FreeUSC came from order date, not referral as
stated in my affirmation of request for REFUND of early
purchase PUP, that set of circumstances hadn’t been addressed.
and for the record it was not priced, it was FREE...

so wash the hogs as you will, but conceptualization won’t replace
statements by the CEO or the corporation surrounding this process.

 

[JG T3SLA]

What?

Sure the math changes if my car gets totaled tomorrow, however think about it....I have had 149 days so far of worriless free charging.

I have a "what if" for you.
What if I have another 17000 days of worriless free charging without incident. What if I NEVER in my lifetime total my car or anything of the sort.
I would have then waste 17000 days or a lifetime worrying about something that was totally unnecessary. Really?

Too many people spend countless useless hours worrying about tomorrow. Premature grey / health issues...etc.

I dare to quote something but it states...."don't worry about tomorrow...for tomorrow will worry about itself".
There is too much uncalled for stress these days. I choose not to choose it.

Soo with that said...I'm sticking with my anxietyless solution of unlimited free supercharging.

Less worrying about tomorrow. My rationale was take the cash that’s certain over a variable benefit that could disappear in an instance.

Bird in the hand vs two in the bush...

 

[TANGO SUKKA]

Just an FYI...

I have had my P3D+ for 15 weeks. I have over 15k miles on my car. I supercharge "a lot". I also charge at home every day.

It won't take me 80 years to charge $5k worth of electricity.

Lastly - I am a person that loves to get rid of anxiety in these days and times and I'm willing to pay to do so. Just like I don't have range anxiety of my model 3..….I also don't have supercharger anxiety. The supercharger cost meter in my car doesn't exist.
I have an anxietyless car.
All I all...I can charge anywhere on the planet for free ( supercharger, home, charge point) and 5K is a small price to pay to forever get rid of any fuel costs...IMHO.

how you get free chargepoint?

 

[Garlan Garner]

I’m still missing the why you aren’t taking the CEO’s words verbatim?

congrats on being 2nd in line waiting in the rain,
many of us did it electronically from the comfort of home,
for what it’s worth it has no bearing here...

I’ll mention again, the reversal of FUSC came after the
promise of REFUND from the corporate head!

speculate as you might, conceptulize to your hearts content,
doesn’t change the wording, perhaps that’s why no one has
followed your conceptualization of events, while many have
reflected the wording of the text and the recovery intended to
dissuade early PUP buyers from requesting the REFUND
promised by CEO?

my promise of FreeUSC came from order date, not referral as
stated in my affirmation of request for REFUND of early
purchase PUP, that set of circumstances hadn’t been addressed.
and for the record it was not priced, it was FREE...

so wash the hogs as you will, but conceptualization won’t replace
statements by the CEO or the corporation surrounding this process.

Why am I NOT taking the words of the CEO verbatim is simple.

The CEO is wrong.

That's why. Its simple.

I don't honor positions like other people. If you are wrong then you are wrong. From the president to the most menial position on the country.

I don't care if he is the CEO. He calls it a refund and it is NOT. Period. Its an exchange.

Maybe if I become the CEO I'll call all Teslas Bugatti's. Will you believe me just because I'm a CEO?

 

[Garlan Garner]

Less worrying about tomorrow. My rationale was take the cash that’s certain over a variable benefit that could disappear in an instance.

Bird in the hand vs two in the bush...

Great. If taking the money in exchange for free supercharging sooths your spirit and soul. Fantastic. I have absolutely no problem with that.

If God only made one type of people....then the would be only one answer/solution to this. As it stands...there are many solutions here. Pick the one you like.

 

[Garlan Garner]

how you get free chargepoint?

There are TONS of free chargepoints here in Chicago. I haven't run into any that have charged me. Every chargepoint I've been to has been sponsored by the business/school who owns the parking lot they exist in.