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Delaware to Texas Incorporation

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“The public vote…” 😂

Like walking into a bar and asking everyone to vote “to drink” or “not to drink.” You know what the majority response will be. That’s an extremely biased sample for the vote.

The board is built of devotees who feel they owe Musk something. I can see an investor vote happening. Whether or not the results of the actual vote is in his favor is to be seen.

Part of the reason for dropping the pay package was that Musk and the board were proven to have deceived investors in order to secure their votes. Investors may not appreciate being treated that way and could vote against Musk’s desire to move to Texas.
This investor voted for the pay package and is feeling disenfranchised right now. If the class action lawyers, that are theoretically representing my interests, also walk away with billions (frankly anything more than a few token million, and I know that won't happen), are going to actually hammer my interests badly. Probably not badly enough to force me out of retirement, but now I have some doubt. H'mm - I wonder if the class lawyers can themselves be sued for harming the interests of their class? I'm sure not, even if they have and do.

I say this as somebody that is overwhelmingly against the larger trend in CEO compensation. The same year (maybe off by 1) that Elon's compensation was set this way, Bob Swan made $66M as CEO of Intel corp (I was an employee of the company then). Mr Swan being paid $66M as CEO of Intel was the straw that broke this camel's back and I steadily closed out all of my stock at that point. Its not that a CEO can't be worth that much heading up a large enterprise - it's that Mr Swan wasn't adding that level of value - I expect there were at least a dozen people in the world that the BoD could have hired in his place, most of them already working at the company as VPs of one sort or another, gotten comparable (or better) results, and paid them 1/3rd to 1/2 as much.

Meanwhile I voted for Elon's compensation package and I HOPED his compensation package would be worth $60B some day. All he had to do was >10x the company in 10 years - easy peasy! (not).


Critical difference between the two - Bob's pay and bonuses were structured in a way that he was able to apply some financial engineering to juice his bonus. The big deal I remember back then was Intel's balance sheet was pristine. Zero long term debt - huge annual capital budget and fully paid for out of profits (and cash flow).

Of course that's a bad way to run a business - so Intel started borrowing billions. What gets said publicly is that its to fund capital improvements and suchlike, but the dividend went up (more than it had been going up when paying it out of profits), buy backs went up (also more than they would have otherwise). From my point of view it looked like Intel was borrowing money for the purpose of increasing the share price by giving it to share holders. Of course Bob's bonus (and other execs) was more driven by the share price than by market cap, making acquisitions, borrowing money to increase the dividend and/or buy back stock, all legit mechanisms to increase value when value is measured by share price (or EPS, or other per-share measures of value). Generically, in my lexicon, financial engineering.

Elon could only juice his bonus by delivering actual market cap increases measured in multiples of the company market cap at that point in time. Anybody that concludes that the market cap increases were inevitable after that is cherry picking the available data. Tesla's increase in market cap to today's value was only inevitable in the way that any company that disrupts a gargantuan industry is inevitable - it isn't. Until some time later when it was obvious all along. The one minor possibility for financial engineering his way to success in that compensation play was some massive acquisitions, and that was foreclosed with an adjustment mechanism that at least neutralized the benefits of acquisitions.


It also leaves me wondering what is the statute of limitations on this sort of thing? For how long does Delaware reserve the right to reach back in time and nullify shareholder votes? In the extreme - do shareholder votes actually mean anything?

This is the main reason I asked my earlier question about actual differences between being incorporated in Delaware and Texas.
 
There was a scam many years ago where the scammer contacted many small business owners. The scammer would say to the business owner, "I can increase your sales income, web traffic, leads, whatever the flavor of the day was 10 fold. You don't have to pay me anything if I can't deliver what I am promising. But if I succeed, you agree to pay me 10% of the profits." Sounds like a great deal to the business owner because there's absolutely no risk. And if by some coincidence that the business did increase 10x, paying 10% of the profits is quite a bargain.

The scam was that the scammer didn't do a thing. Sometimes a business would suceed on its own or for some unrelated reason. The business owner would happily pay the scammer 10% without even knowing that they've been scammed.

There's a name for this scam but I forgot what it was called.

So what did Elon do? He kept his mouth shut... until recently.
 
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Musk is becoming a pathetically childish human being. It’s really sad to watch. This isn’t about what’s best for Tesla or Tesla’s shareholders. This is 100% about an impulsive, self centered man child placating his fragile ego inside his own little echo chamber. Grow up.
Becoming? I realized he was a terrible person when he called a cave diver a pedophile. He's also been heavily promoting right wing conspiracy theories for a while, with increasing frequency. His catastrophic personal life is one testament to this.
 
Texas governor just created a business court a few months ago (HB19). It won't even be open for a few more months. The court will be presided by 7 justices appointed by the governor. All this would seem to be Tesla friendly for now. Musk is thinking that the new business court will be great for him and Tesla and he's probably right. But really it's probably more about him and less about Tesla. He is mad about his $57 billion compensation package that the Delaware court shot down.
I think you are underestimating Musk. You need to take a step back and look at the big picture. This is not entirely about one $57 billion compensation package at Tesla.

Not only is he CEO of Tesla, but he is also head of SpaceX, X, xAI, Neuralink, The Boring Company, TITS, and probably many others that I have forgotten or never knew about. These are for-profit corporations, non-profit corporations, and at least one public benefit corporation. He has to think about control while he is living and capable. But he is also 52 years old and has to think about the future when he is incapacitated or dead.

All of these have a large legal component and they are devilishly complicated questions. If he's looking out into future decades, he has to judge the predictability of what each state will do. Delaware has proven unpredictable, and so it seems entirely reasonable to actively avoid the jurisdiction.
 
I think you are underestimating Musk. You need to take a step back and look at the big picture. This is not entirely about one $57 billion compensation package at Tesla.

Not only is he CEO of Tesla, but he is also head of SpaceX, X, xAI, Neuralink, The Boring Company, TITS, and probably many others that I have forgotten or never knew about. These are for-profit corporations, non-profit corporations, and at least one public benefit corporation. He has to think about control while he is living and capable. But he is also 52 years old and has to think about the future when he is incapacitated or dead.

All of these have a large legal component and they are devilishly complicated questions. If he's looking out into future decades, he has to judge the predictability of what each state will do. Delaware has proven unpredictable, and so it seems entirely reasonable to actively avoid the jurisdiction.


Exposure in Delaware

  1. Tesla, Inc.
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA)
  2. SpaceX (Space Exploration Technologies Corp.)
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA)
  3. SolarCity Corporation
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA) [Acquired by Tesla in 2016]
  4. Neuralink Corporation
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA)
  5. The Boring Company
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA)
  6. OpenAI LP
    • State of Incorporation: Delaware (USA)
  7. X.com / PayPal
    • Originally X.com, which later became part of Confinity and then merged to become PayPal.
    • State of Incorporation: California (USA)
  8. X (formerly Twitter): Incorporated in Nevada, headquartered in California
  9. X.ai (Grok) in New York a benefit corporation incorporated in Nevada

I think that the Delaware decision was known in early 2023, one year ago. The judge's written excuse was recently published. (Judge required 5 days of testimony and 2 months of deliberation.) Musk and Tesla BOD were largely silent until Jan 15th 2024 when Musk posted the ultimatum regarding voting control of Tesla. I am not aware of Tesla's official response to the 200 page decision.


Predictive

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2020/12/24/elon-musk-dave-lee-holding-company-proposal.html
 
Tesla does not pay him a salary, its all in stock shares based on performance goals.

"potential compensation opportunity ever" does not equal his actual pay. If Elon does a great job and makes Tesla the biggest and best car company in the entire world shouldn't that justify a big pay day? on the other hand if he sinks Tesla he also sinks his "potential compensation" its performance based pay, its not a participation trophy.
 
Tesla does not pay him a salary, its all in stock shares based on performance goals.

"potential compensation opportunity ever" does not equal his actual pay. If Elon does a great job and makes Tesla the biggest and best car company in the entire world shouldn't that justify a big pay day? on the other hand if he sinks Tesla he also sinks his "potential compensation" its performance based pay, its not a participation trophy.
no one, literally, no one in the world is worth THAT kind of compensation. it is just ridiculous.

That money could be better invested in things what matters with Tesla. You know, things like quality of assembly (that your car would not start to rattle all over the place within 5k miles from new), much better noise insulation, FSD working world wide, AP which does not *sugar* bricks once anyone moves just a bit closed to the line in their lane next to your car, auto wipers which actually sense rain, etc. etc.?
 
Dude bet on himself, his company, and his vision... it paid off... what is the problem? I thought the shareholders (roughly 75% when EXCLUDING Musk's shares) voted for this package. Why is an activist judge deciding to override the majority of voting shareholders? Tesla made all of the shareholders 10x return since then I am certainly not complaining. I'd be pissed too if I were him.
 
Dude bet on himself, his company, and his vision... it paid off... what is the problem? I thought the shareholders (roughly 75% when EXCLUDING Musk's shares) voted for this package. Why is an activist judge deciding to override the majority of voting shareholders? Tesla made all of the shareholders 10x return since then I am certainly not complaining. I'd be pissed too if I were him.
he bet on his company?
What was the upside and what was the downside of his bet? How much did he have to lose if that was such a bet as you say...
not shareholders voted for package - it was board of directors

judge is not an activist - he is very reasonable man of law. it was a shareholder with only few shares which sued Tesla because in his (and I am sure in many other's) opinion, that is not NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF TESLA.

Especially if you take into account annual results.
 
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no one, literally, no one in the world is worth THAT kind of compensation. it is just ridiculous.

That money could be better invested in things what matters with Tesla. You know, things like quality of assembly (that your car would not start to rattle all over the place within 5k miles from new), much better noise insulation, FSD working world wide, AP which does not *sugar* bricks once anyone moves just a bit closed to the line in their lane next to your car, auto wipers which actually sense rain, etc. etc.?
I certainly respect your point of view. I even understand where it comes from.

This shareholder however disagrees with you. I voted for the compensation plan, and put to a vote again today, I will vote for it again. Pretty much everything on your list is only an issue to be improved on because Elon exists and has pushed EV technology and business plan so hard, so far, so well. Yes - I do think that in this one instance that is worth that compensation.

There isn't a second anybody on my list of people that might be worth an amount within 1 order of magnitude, and probably 2 orders of magnitude.
 
That money could be better invested in things what matters with Tesla.

Many CEO's get a base salary of like $1M, $2M, etc plus stock options. But Elon does not get paid a salary, no money/cash. you do realize that the company (Tesla) does not lose cash by giving Elon stock option shares. all the cash flow stays with the company.

The company does not directly give the CEO the money/cash. The CEO buys the stock options, usually at a discount, from the company, then he sells his shares on the stock market where other investors on Wall St buys those shares.
 
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What was the upside and what was the downside of his bet? How much did he have to lose if that was such a bet as you say...
not shareholders voted for package - it was board of directors
The downside of his bet was 5-10 years of intense work, in an industry where the evidence was still in favor of the premise that new car companies are just a good way to waste money and visit bankruptcy court. For no pay.
 
Why hasn't there been a counter suit by the majority of investors that voted for the compensation package?
I've wondered about this as well. And while not a lawyer, my next question / thought is who would be sued? The judge isn't a target for a lawsuit.

The legal recourse here is for Tesla to appeal the result. Whether that is actually good legal strategy, IANAL and do not have legal opinions. I do have layperson questions though - like when does the appeal get filed :).
 
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Dude bet on himself, his company, and his vision... it paid off... what is the problem? I thought the shareholders (roughly 75% when EXCLUDING Musk's shares) voted for this package. Why is an activist judge deciding to override the majority of voting shareholders? Tesla made all of the shareholders 10x return since then I am certainly not complaining. I'd be pissed too if I were him.

I thought the board of directions voted for his compensation package and one of the key reasons why it was struck down is because they appeared to have breached their fiduciary duty to said shareholders. Musk, like any other super wealthy person out there, didn't build this company by himself. Yet, he is getting outsized share of its success.

The reason why executives are paid in stock is not entirely because it ties them to company's performance. Yes, it's a component of it. But in my opinion, the true reason is that they get to pay 15% in income tax max. The rest of us subsidize them and their companies.