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Dual Motor no longer offers range choice
- Thread starter Snow Drift
- Start date
MikeBur
ManualPilot
Are you referencing the cruise mode? They could deffinately use different gearing to widen the power band. What we don't have data on is the efficency curve of the new motor type. If it is mostly flat, then two motors at roughly half the current each could be better than one at full cruise power. Each would be at a different power level if the gear ratios are shifted due to the different motor RPMs (assuming identical motor construction).
The encoder feedback will also allow fast engagement of an idled motor. Drive phase angle will be known, so the power unit can instantly add/subtract torque as needed. Should work great with the open differential axle setup.
Or to do LR+AWD+P for all the people who've deferred, plus some stripper SR that depend on the full tax credit to employees.
Easy way to boost deliveries! Link their Phones while at work, then go to the finished goods lot and drive home.
SR + RWD = Stripper model, extremely low volume
LR + RWD = Base model, very low volume
LR + RWD + Prem = High cost, low volume (primarily CA and Southern US)
SR + Dual = Appliance car, lowest volume
LR + Dual = Mid-range, low volume
LR + Dual + Prem = Highest cost, most popular
I don't see a need for SR + Dual. Who won't want the all glass roof?
Too many variations. Maybe just get rid of RWD all together.
LR + RWD = Base model, very low volume
LR + RWD + Prem = High cost, low volume (primarily CA and Southern US)
SR + Dual = Appliance car, lowest volume
LR + Dual = Mid-range, low volume
LR + Dual + Prem = Highest cost, most popular
I don't see a need for SR + Dual. Who won't want the all glass roof?
Too many variations. Maybe just get rid of RWD all together.
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We're waiting on SR + Dual motors. We already have long range Model S for road trips but need SR + Dual motors for a daily driver that will never be used for road trips.
ℬête Noire
Active Member
You seem to assume "cost is irrelevant"? I expect longterm the SR to sell 3:2 against the LR, maybe even a little higher than that. $9K, about a 25% bump from base price, is pretty sizable. The SR still has enough range to use the SC network so not only is it great as a secondary, never-trip vehicle, it's also good enough for say a twice/year modest road trip vehicle.
The people that don't get the glass roof are those that don't want to drop $5K on the PUP.
The Dual prevalence will probably depend on pricing, I can definitely see it ending up more prevalent than the PUP. Longterm I expect it'll overtake RWD.
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If they get rid of RWD, they'll add the price of Dual Motors to all the cars (and will push the MSRP over $35k).
I believe for the S/X, they advertise dual motors as being "included in all cars." While true, the cost is baked into the final price of the car.
I agree from a consumer perspective, some people want to spend less, but do most forgo packages to save money? From a company's point of view, variation is expensive.
Do car companies sell more stripper models than premium of the same model? I.e, Base vs. Premium of an A4 or 3-Series? I don't see many FWD CVT A4s or RWD cloth interior 3-series. A lot of people are wiling to lease a Premium vs. buy a Base.
Even Tesla has already dropped RWD and bundled options into Standard Equipment or PUP. Sure, buyers would like to a-la carte pick options, but that just isn't cost effective for the company, and most were buying multiple packages anyway.
True, so they either eat the cost, move away from $35k in the future, or keep one stripper RWD model.
ℬête Noire
Active Member
Black, Aero SR is the true stripper.
SR with PUP, or even just paint + 19" really isn't. SR D isn't even close to a stripper and is an entirely viable vehicle.What you have to keep in mind is that there is no EV (w/ >150mi nominal range) competition in the price bracket below the Model 3. Tesla has a huge amount of distance between it and "competitors" that has very little to do with price. That's not really the case with most other car models, which leads their bottom end in serious competition with other optioned-up, lower-base-price cars.
So you'll have plenty of people stretching up to get into a M3 at all and that extra $9K is a big, big step. Again, an extra %25 of the purchase price of a M3 w/paint.
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david_42
Member
I strongly suspect removing the SD option from AWD is a recognition of the power demands. The (unicorn) SD RWD has a slower 0-60 time, despite being 250 lbs lighter. If the SD could produce the same amount of power as the LD, the time would be lower.
Of course, this difference may just be a intentional (software) restriction, to encourage people to buy LD cars, instead of waiting for the unicorn.
Of course, this difference may just be a intentional (software) restriction, to encourage people to buy LD cars, instead of waiting for the unicorn.
If it is like the S, the lowest battery capacity has a lower voltage too ( 350V vs 400V).
If the power limitation comes from the Amperes that the inverter can handle it means less power and slower supercharging too.
If the power limitation comes from the Amperes that the inverter can handle it means less power and slower supercharging too.
The S/X stacked an extra two modules (16 total) at the end of the pack and changed the number of cells in parallel for the 85 (6s74p), 90 (6s74p), and 100 (6s86p) kWh versions to get the extra capacity over the 60kWh pack (14 6s64p). The Model 3 only has 4 modules and no room for additional. They will likely use less cells in parallel and keep the same voltage.
Peak battery current is based on cells in parallel, but peak battery power is independent of cell arrangement. Pack voltage does impact top speed due to motor back EMF.
I believe the lower 0-60 of the SR is due directly to lower current available from lower # of parallel cells. Assuming the exact same C-rate (cell discharge rate) but 33% fewer cells, my spreadsheet model (which does account for rolling resistance, drag, weight, etc) lines up very very closely with motor-trend's test data and the announced SR specifications. Again assuming that the cell discharge rate and friction (max wheel torque) are the limiting factors, I also extrapolated potential dual motor performance figures.
MikeBur
ManualPilot
Yep, the torque sleep and differing power level has worked in P S/X and modulo anything crazy should be able to be factored in the optimal power bands for the motor.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Let's not forget that there was a rumor out of Germany about an upcoming larger battery for the Model 3. If that's the case, they may not wish to disclose the range just yet.
skitown
Member
ℬête Noire
Active Member
Maybe this one???? But I don't see the Germany connection there.
Model 3 P100D Exists? Is it possible?
skitown
Member
Thx. I’d read that thread and come to the conclusion it was user error based on the last couple posts.
Model 3 P100D Exists? Is it possible?
