Elon & Twitter

[bkp_duke]

Sorry - I thought CNBC was home of the FUD. Now we're believing them?

I don't really care that you owned multiple simultaneous companies - that's not what I'm talking about, unless you were CEO of a public company and owned a separate side business in which you directed employees of the public company to work on.

Misappropriation of Human Resources at a publicly owned company for a vanity project is typically grounds for termination from ANY company.

Anyway, this seems a bit relevant given the upcoming testimony this month in Tornetta v. Musk (investor suit over Musk's compensation package...at the heart of which is whether or not Musk was acting like a controlling shareholder, despite owning 17% of Tesla's shares). Case will go before Kathaleen McCormick (same Delaware Chancery Court judge who oversaw the Twitter litigation).

WRONG WRONG WRONG - this was an SEC official. Pretty much the HIGHEST AUTHORITY of the government regarding this.

Nice try at conflation there.

Oh, and you should have SEEN the look on the CNBC host's face when the SEC official said that. It was clear that he was disappointed that what Elon was doing fell squarely within the boundaries of the law. CNBS was not expecting that reply, that is for sure.


Regarding your "legal case" - you have a VERY high bar to scale to prove it was misappropriation of resources. 1) This would be being done with the approval of the Tesla board (just like things with SpaceX and The Boring Co are approved by the Tesla board to share resources). That right there would be plenty of legal cover. 2) Twitter is a legitimate company, with owners, etc. that Musk has to report to. So calling this a "vanity project" is subjective at best and would not fall under any legal definition as such. YOU may view it as that, but the LAW won't.

Good luck also getting the board or a majority of shareholders to back anything against Musk. First Musk and the board own enough TSLA shares to make any motion against Musk a TALL hill to climb. Second you have a lot of people that would back him. I'm in that camp, and a lot of the large corporate investors (Cathie Wood, Ron Barron, etc.) would not vote to discipline Musk, even if they view Twitter as a distraction. They all view a distracted Musk as still head and shoulders better than anyone else on the planet to run Tesla.

AGAIN - you are CONFLATING your own WISHES and OPINIONS and trying to find a way for them to be FACTS. They are not. Congratulations, you literally just fell for what the MSM was wanting to do.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

conflation

you are CONFLATING your own WISHES and OPINIONS and trying to find a way for them to be FACTS.

Conflate means to combine two ideas into one.

 

[bkp_duke]

Conflate means to combine two ideas into one.

Ahem, wishes AND opinions (two). Into Facts (one).

Yes, I used the term correctly.

 

[JRP3]

First I end up owning NKLA shares and now Montana Skeptic writes a Seeking Alpha article about the Twitter mess I mostly agree with I'm afraid to see what happens next.

 

[bkp_duke]

First I end up owning NKLA shares and now Montana Skeptic writes a Seeking Alpha article about the Twitter mess I mostly agree with I'm afraid to see what happens next.

So . . . we should take great caution when you post about a mining stock?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Ahem, wishes AND opinions (two). Into Facts (one).

Yes, I used the term correctly.

Yeah, maybe, although reading in context seemed a bit of a stretch, since you seemed to be using it with FACTS as well (wishes and opinions arguably don’t make sense to be conflated). Anyway, it was the first use that threw me for a loop.

 

[mspohr]

Elon Musk turns Twitter offices into a 'Hunger Games' labor camp

As Elon Musk cements control of Twitter, he’s already effected a remarkable transformation to the global platform, inspiring racist trolls, Russian disinformation bots, and other socially repugnant specimens everywhere to enlist in his noble crusade...

www.dailykos.com

Now he’s ensconcing himself in an even more rarefied pantheon: the realm of the abusive employer. As reported by Lora Kolodny for CNBC, the new normal at Twitter for some employees appears to be an 84-hour work week.

 

[bkp_duke]

Elon Musk turns Twitter offices into a 'Hunger Games' labor camp

As Elon Musk cements control of Twitter, he’s already effected a remarkable transformation to the global platform, inspiring racist trolls, Russian disinformation bots, and other socially repugnant specimens everywhere to enlist in his noble crusade...

www.dailykos.com

Now he’s ensconcing himself in an even more rarefied pantheon: the realm of the abusive employer. As reported by Lora Kolodny for CNBC, the new normal at Twitter for some employees appears to be an 84-hour work week.

Read the details, they are doing this of their own volition, to try an impress Musk.

 

[JRP3]

Also while it doesn't surprise me the source is Kolodny so everything she reports is suspect.

 

[mspohr]

Read the details, they are doing this of their own volition, to try an impress Musk.

Here's some details from TFA:

Musk appears to be using a “carrot and stick” approach to these abusive practices, as he has publicly declared vast numbers of layoffs are in the offing, thus cultivating an atmosphere of “fear and distrust” at the company, according to Kolodny’s reporting. Employees claim they’ve been left largely in the dark as to whether they’ll be targeted, even as their managerial taskmasters implement weekend assignments, sleeping (presumably) on cots laid out in their offices on Friday and Saturday nights, according to reporting by Grace Dean of Business Insider.

CNBC reported that staff haven't been told whether they'll get overtime pay, time off in lieu, or job security for working on the assignments.
Staff worry that their careers at Twitter could be over if they don't complete their tasks by the early November deadlines, CNBC reported.
Twitter's managers, meanwhile, have been asked to carry out performance reviews and send Musk's team lists of which employees should be kept on, people familiar with the discussions told Insider.

(Also includes reporting from Grace Dean of Business Insider... Is this person also bad?)

 

[bkp_duke]

Here's some details from TFA:

Musk appears to be using a “carrot and stick” approach to these abusive practices, as he has publicly declared vast numbers of layoffs are in the offing, thus cultivating an atmosphere of “fear and distrust” at the company, according to Kolodny’s reporting. Employees claim they’ve been left largely in the dark as to whether they’ll be targeted, even as their managerial taskmasters implement weekend assignments, sleeping (presumably) on cots laid out in their offices on Friday and Saturday nights, according to reporting by Grace Dean of Business Insider.


(Also includes reporting from Grace Dean of Business Insider... Is this person also bad?)

So? If I worked at Twitter, I would fully be aware that I sat on the golden goose for YEARS doing minimal work for a large salary (there are people on YT that were bragging about this before Elon's bid back in April).

There is absolutely nothing illegal about what he's doing. The staff know this, and that's why those that really want to keep their jobs are working their tails off.

EDIT - and seriously? Business Insider? The owner of that drab has one of the largest axes to grind against Elon. The guy is so dirty he's banned from trading for life by the SEC.

 

[JRP3]

Also includes reporting from Grace Dean of Business Insider... Is this person also bad?

Probably.

 

[mspohr]

So? If I worked at Twitter, I would fully be aware that I sat on the golden goose for YEARS doing minimal work for a large salary (there are people on YT that were bragging about this before Elon's bid back in April).

There is absolutely nothing illegal about what he's doing. The staff know this, and that's why those that really want to keep their jobs are working their tails off.

EDIT - and seriously? Business Insider? The owner of that drab has one of the largest axes to grind against Elon. The guy is so dirty he's banned from trading for life by the SEC.

The fanboy delusion is strong here.
(I believe Musk is a brilliant engineer and manager who is able to motivate people to do incredible work... using carrots and sticks. That's why I am still invested in the company. However, absolutely no way I would ever want to work for him.)

 

[Crutonius]

Well, good thing slavery isn't a thing. They've got tech skills. Find a job in a less crazy place.

 

[bkp_duke]

The fanboy delusion is strong here.
(I believe Musk is a brilliant engineer and manager who is able to motivate people to do incredible work... using carrots and sticks. That's why I am still invested in the company. However, absolutely no way I would ever want to work for him.)

Ah, so you resort to calling names. I'm far from a Musk fanboi. I have heard accounts from friends that worked at Tesla during the Model 3 ramp that were just bone-chilling.

But I'm also a businessman. Twitter corp is like 90% FAT, 10% substance. I'm 100% behind anyone that cuts the fat on unnecessary bloat like that.

 

[texas_star_TM3]

Well, good thing slavery isn't a thing. They've got tech skills. Find a job in a less crazy place.

oh for sure. Recruiters are probably feasting on twitter right now and picking up the best & brightest engineers for their clients... top talent with options in the tech sector isn't going to sleep on the floor in their cube trying to impress Elon with how dedicated they are... they can easily work for for a sane place like Apple/Google/Microsoft etc. and make the same/ more money with less craziness...

 

[mspohr]

Ah, so you resort to calling names. I'm far from a Musk fanboi. I have heard accounts from friends that worked at Tesla during the Model 3 ramp that were just bone-chilling.

But I'm also a businessman. Twitter corp is like 90% FAT, 10% substance. I'm 100% behind anyone that cuts the fat on unnecessary bloat like that.

I don't think it's useful to repeat slurs on Twitter ("90% fat") blaming the employees. My experience has been that most problems with employees are actually management problems. Musk has shown that he is a brilliant manager (but also can be abusive).

 

[bkp_duke]

I don't think it's useful to repeat slurs on Twitter ("90% fat") blaming the employees. My experience has been that most problems with employees are actually management problems. Musk has shown that he is a brilliant manager (but also can be abusive).

Then we'll agree to disagree, but Musk isn't the only one that thinks Twitter is grossly overstaffed. There were several articles when the economic downturn started that stated tech overstaffing was rampant (and those articles cited Twitter specifically).

All of Elon's companies have always been LEAN enterprises. Why he will probably cut staff should surprise no one. Twitter has never been described as remotely close to "lean".

 

[ElectricIAC]

oh for sure. Recruiters are probably feasting on twitter right now and picking up the best & brightest engineers for their clients... top talent with options in the tech sector isn't going to sleep on the floor in their cube trying to impress Elon with how dedicated they are... they can easily work for for a sane place like Apple/Google/Microsoft etc. and make the same/ more money with less craziness...

They can poach the girl from the tik tok video where she’s basically at an adult daycare working for Twitter pre-takeover.

Excellent pick.

 

[Crutonius]

oh for sure. Recruiters are probably feasting on twitter right now and picking up the best & brightest engineers for their clients... top talent with options in the tech sector isn't going to sleep on the floor in their cube trying to impress Elon with how dedicated they are... they can easily work for for a sane place like Apple/Google/Microsoft etc. and make the same/ more money with less craziness...

A few years ago I worked for a somewhat small company. This company was bought by a giant multinational corporation. They saw this purchase as an investment and therefore wanted to make a profit off of it.

So raises were frozen. Hiring was largely frozen. We were constantly pressured to put in more hours without pay.

This might have seemed rational in a narrow view. But this was 2018 with a very hot economy, especially for tech workers. So everyone who could get a better job elsewhere, myself included, did so. This left the company with the employees who could not get a better job elsewhere. Not a great recipe for the long term health of a company.

Elon's kind of a celebrity CEO. I think he's used to having a lot of people really wanting to work for him. I think he might not appreciate the risk he's facing of damaging twitters workforce by hollowing out the productive employees.