Its like watching two guys boxing... only they are blind and don't have any arms....
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For AWD owners wanting a P3D-
- Thread starter Urbancowboy
- Start date
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Of course it is.
As pointed out already a number of folks who ordered a P had an actual AWD car at delivery and got software upgraded to P after the fact (either same day or within a couple days via OTA updates).
There's no reason every AWD (at least among those made during most of the time the AWD has been in production and got 980 rear drive units) can't get the same update if Tesla chooses to offer them.
It's unclear if the ones made in the last few months with 990 DUs can or not since nobody knows for sure what's actually different in the 990 vs the 980.
GateFather
Member
Is there any proof out there of this?
"As pointed out already a number of folks who ordered a P had an actual AWD car at delivery and got software upgraded to P after the fact (either same day or within a couple days via OTA updates)."
I ask as a hopeful AWD owner so please don't take this as doubting simply for argument. I am genuinely interested in getting to the bottom of this question. I'm not sure what proof there could be but I would love some indisputable confirmation that there truly were AWD vehicles that were software unlocked to Performance speeds.
My car was made in October 2018, would it have a 980 or 990 DU? Anyway easy way for me to confirm?
Look through the driver's side rear wheel, and look toward the middle of the car, and down toward the axle. You'll see a plate on it with a bunch of numbers, including either "980" or "990".
Since it was a 10/18 build, it *should* have a 980.
StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Of which part specifically?
If you mean that part then tons of it in this thread and others where such owners have said that.
In the recent P3D- threads it appears more often than not they got an AWD at delivery and had to wait for the OTA to make it a P for example.
It's a 980, but you can follow the directions already posted to take a pic and be sure.
The first 990 reported from anyone was in europe in January.
US AWD cars were still being built with 980 rear DUs as late as at least April (though all the ones on the last couple months appear to be 990 worldwide now)
GateFather
Member
Yes I meant the quoted part. I know many have said it - but that alone doesn't make it true. Is there some visual proof that they received an AWD, had software update applied, and then had a Performance Model 3?
Thanks - good to know! I'll wind up checking anyways!
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
FYI: You took delivery 12 days after me, so there's a small chance your inverter plate will be blank. (Mine is, P3D+.) Applies to cars built in a narrow window of time (sometime in October 2018 - it's not clear whether only Performance cars or not - but I suspect all rear motors (RWD/AWD/P3D) in that window, but I have no evidence - I would have to do detailed review of the "Motors" thread posts to figure it out, and I am not going to).
Anyway, if it's a blank silver plate, it's very very likely a 980 motor, as there is no evidence that it would be anything else. There were only 980 motors just before and just after that time period.
Only that I can confirm that the software exists on at least one of the EU LR AWD's (March delivery). Tesla gave it as compensation for messing up deliveries on the first EU batches to arrive.
Software looks exactly the same as normal LR AWD (e.g. no performance badge or track mode) and was installed a few weeks after delivery. The car has faster accelleration than my AWD (it's my neighbors Model 3 by the way) and was measured on a track to perform very close to a P model.
So Tesla definitly took time to create a dedicated version for AWD's that upgrades to 20% extra performance, just not available yet officially.
The software even had "official" install warnings showing on the screen that the driver needed to pay attention etc. due to the extra performance, so it's not just a "hacked" version they quickly made for it. The 20% update came with update 2019.8.5. The car rejected one update at 2019.28.1 with an interesting error "Update unavailable due to drive unit incompability", but 2019.28.2 installed fine a week later.
Also all newer AWD's delivered in Europe now are being registered as being capable of 350KW/470hp (even though this is not what they are currently outputting).
yerEVan
Active Member
This thread got lame. i kinda liked it before. people are arguing about an unknown.
Questions:
If they were to offer a perf upgrade, but not quite as fast as the p3d-, would AWD people go for it?
Or, if they offered a perf upgrade that brought you to today's p3d- performance, and they handed the p3d- people a little more perf for free. i.e. 2.9seconds 0-60, and the awd perf upgrade option gets, 3.2seconds 0-60. would the awd people be upset? or totally fine?
the reason I ask, do you want to equal the p3d-, or do you want to just have more umph off the line, but doesn't HAVE to be exactly the same as p3d-?
Questions:
If they were to offer a perf upgrade, but not quite as fast as the p3d-, would AWD people go for it?
Or, if they offered a perf upgrade that brought you to today's p3d- performance, and they handed the p3d- people a little more perf for free. i.e. 2.9seconds 0-60, and the awd perf upgrade option gets, 3.2seconds 0-60. would the awd people be upset? or totally fine?
the reason I ask, do you want to equal the p3d-, or do you want to just have more umph off the line, but doesn't HAVE to be exactly the same as p3d-?
Interesting question. At least based on the EU motor/type registrations then the Performance model would be able to get ~5% more than it has today (~20% for the AWD). It would more or less allow for ludicris mode for Performance and "performance" for AWD. Interesting to see if that happens.
Forgive me I didn't fully read all the posts in this thread but just wanted to add my input anyway.
I don't see why they wouldn't offer the upgrade to the P3D software profile for the actual difference in cost between the LR AWD and the P3D. P3D owners wouldn't be losing anything for their money they get the speed + the wheels + the brakes + the Suspension + Pedals + the spoiler for the same price so they lose no value (and actually get better value being "early adopters" ) and it allows the AWD buyers some sort of value add upgrade path ( somthing that's missing from EV's in general compared to ICE cars, which have readily available hop up kits that can be added weeks months or years after purchase of the original vehicle ). I'd happily pay the full $9000 CAD (difference between AWD LR and Performace) a year from now to add that performance. All assuming it is possible with the 990s
I don't see why they wouldn't offer the upgrade to the P3D software profile for the actual difference in cost between the LR AWD and the P3D. P3D owners wouldn't be losing anything for their money they get the speed + the wheels + the brakes + the Suspension + Pedals + the spoiler for the same price so they lose no value (and actually get better value being "early adopters" ) and it allows the AWD buyers some sort of value add upgrade path ( somthing that's missing from EV's in general compared to ICE cars, which have readily available hop up kits that can be added weeks months or years after purchase of the original vehicle ). I'd happily pay the full $9000 CAD (difference between AWD LR and Performace) a year from now to add that performance. All assuming it is possible with the 990s
Some of us early adapters have already paid more for our AWD's then the current P3D+ costs. When we ordered we did not know that the P3D- owner's would be getting a $5k refund making their cars on a few thousand more then what we paid.
That's not really what I meant when I used "early adopters" which admittedly is the wrong term. I was referring to people who purchased the performance model and in this case got the extra performance earlier than the theoretical people who would upgrade. That's what I meant by early adopters. In any event I couldn't care less if the drop the price after I paid for it I made the decision that the car was worth the purchase price to me and couldn't really care less if they change it later, I've made my decision at that point and looking back at that doesn't lead to any positive outcomes in my opinion
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Recent price difference (apples-to-apples) has been $2k USD.
Historical price difference has been ~$4k-$6k USD.
Interesting question. At least based on the EU motor/type registrations then the Performance model would be able to get ~5% more than it has today (~20% for the AWD). It would more or less allow for ludicris mode for Performance and "performance" for AWD. Interesting to see if that happens.
Oh, man.. fantastic ideas there. I would *jump* at the chance to buy Ludicrous Mode for my car... darn family doesn't need to eat three times a day, every single day.
yerEVan
Active Member
I think that if a car is capable of faster speeds without stressing the motors and causing more warranty issues, then it should offer those speeds. Why not? It’s almost like a pc. If they have a processor that they install, and they say it can to 2.5Ghz, but the proc is really capable of doing 3.0 without burning out during the laptop’s warranty period, then they are throttling performance. If the P3D- or plus, can do faster than 3.2 seconds without messing with warranty, then they are basically throttling.
If they are throttling, then why not offer to remove the throttling maybe for a fee, maybe not. Question is, are they throttling for the reason to prevent warranty issues, or are they throttling because they don’t want to sell a model 3 cheaper than a model S, but performs the same, as to not piss off the Model S folks?
I guess time will tell. I.e. if we go another 6 months without any word from EM, then we’ll never know. But if we hear something soon, I guess this thread will become obsolete and we won’t have to speculate anymore. Even I’m annoying myself with speculation.
If they are throttling, then why not offer to remove the throttling maybe for a fee, maybe not. Question is, are they throttling for the reason to prevent warranty issues, or are they throttling because they don’t want to sell a model 3 cheaper than a model S, but performs the same, as to not piss off the Model S folks?
I guess time will tell. I.e. if we go another 6 months without any word from EM, then we’ll never know. But if we hear something soon, I guess this thread will become obsolete and we won’t have to speculate anymore. Even I’m annoying myself with speculation.
jebinc
Well-Known Member
So, I waited two days, and several different drives, before posting this...
Unlike any prior firmware updates, I noticed what thought was more power, and smoother consistent power, since 2019.32 was installed - almost like my LR AWD got a "Stealth" M3P- upgrade... For a second, I thought, "Did all of those calls, petitions, emails and messages to Tesla work"? Can't be, right? Must be in my head... but why didn't this feeling happen with prior updates if it were all in my head? Anyway, my M3 feels like it pulls a lot harder, and for longer, since the 2019.32 update... Anyone else notice this on there LR AWD, or any M3 for that matter? My build was 6/19...
Unlike any prior firmware updates, I noticed what thought was more power, and smoother consistent power, since 2019.32 was installed - almost like my LR AWD got a "Stealth" M3P- upgrade...
For a second, I thought, "Did all of those calls, petitions, emails and messages to Tesla work"? Can't be, right? Must be in my head... but why didn't this feeling happen with prior updates if it were all in my head? Anyway, my M3 feels like it pulls a lot harder, and for longer, since the 2019.32 update... Anyone else notice this on there LR AWD, or any M3 for that matter? My build was 6/19...Similar threads
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