Ford says owners can start using superchargers today (Feb 29)

[GoCanes]

v2 (150 kW) locations are not compatible with CCS adaptors

I assume Tesla will slowly upgrade these to v4 stalls first

This really limits the number of chargers open to non-Tesla EVs. Or we can look at it as keeping V2 charges open solely to Teslas. Slower yes, but it's better than waiting on non-Tesla owners who have filled up all the chargers. Plus many "legacy" Teslas like my 2016 MX can't charge above 125 kW.

 

[DuncanM]

I wish. Q4 sales were around 317K. At that rate, it would take ~9 months to reach 1 million. And, most people charge at home, not at superchargers.
But yeah, I'm keeping my CCS1 adapter as well, but I'm not worried about Tesla chargers getting jammed up.

I am talking about potential non-Tesla EVs sold from 2017-2024, that will have access to the TSC network, in the next few months.

 

[Supcom]

First of all, I think you mean the next couple of years might not be good ones to be a Tesla user. Why should this be anything other than an improvement for other EVs?

Even so, I think this is 90% FUD. The Supercharger network is expanding rapidly. Opening up to other EVs will only fuel that expansion, and frankly it's no different than when Tesla rolled out the Model 3, and the Model Y, and Giga Texas. Each one of those drastically increased the volume of vehicles using the network, and yet, we are all more or less happy with how it's working out, with Tesla actively monitoring usage and providing redundancy where the feel it's needed. Add to that the fact that one impediment that Tesla has had finding hosts is the fact that previously the Tesla Proprietary Connector only served a single brand of vehicle (albeit the dominant one) was viewed as detrimental by potential hosts. That barrier is now gone, which should open up a lot more options to host Superchargers. AND, third party CPOs will start rolling out native NACS support as well, expanding options for Tesla owners.

EV adoption requires that all EVs be able to charge at any public charging site. That means that Tesla's should be able to charge at CCS sites and non-Teslas charge at Superchargers. Total interoperability is necessary just as any gasoline powered car can fuel up at any gas station.

Removing the complexity of finding the right brand of charging network simplifies life for most EV drivers and cuts the legs out from those who hype up charging difficulties for EVs.

 

[DuncanM]

The future is now:

 

[xilex]

View attachment 1023325

How will the car on the right leave, if someone is charging on both sides of the neighboring stalls

 

[rzn89]

I drive to FL from NY, every December. If I have to wait at one SC this year because of this, I will never drive the Tesla again EVER on anyplace that will require a SC. We have a Lexus RX350h also that can be used for road trips. Elon is playing w/ fire. w/o SC exclusivity I would personally never buy another Tesla, currently Lexus options stink, they will probably make a good EV in 6 years when I look at a new car.

 

[sleepydoc]

Well, that opens up the range of EV’s I’ll consider now - I can get something with a decent suspension and a turn signal stalk without losing access to the SC network!

 

[CyberShy]

I drive to FL from NY, every December. If I have to wait at one SC this year because of this, I will never drive the Tesla again EVER

You must be a joy to be around in traffic or in line at McDonald's.

 

[ljbad4life]

The only hindrance I see is v3 stations not having long enough cables to accommodate different charge-port locations. That is the only thing I can see as causing congestion at superchargers. V4 fixes this but as with v3 I do not expect upgrades to happen quickly. If referring to the amount of vehicles the superchargers will attract, I'm not bothered, the vast majority of evs on the road in north america are Teslas... which are already on the network.

 

[alexgr]

Before anyone complains that the SCs are now going to be clogged with non-Teslas, remember that Tesla sells more Teslas to clog those chargers every year than the competition COMBINED. And if that's not accurate, it's close.

The real problem will be that based on the location of charging ports one Ford EV will occupy TWO Supercharger stalls and charge TWICE slower. So you can count each Ford as 4 Teslas in Supercharger utilization.

I am heading to a store for popcorn to watch supercharger fistfights on TikTok and Youtube.

 

[alexgr]

EV adoption requires that all EVs be able to charge at any public charging site. That means that Tesla's should be able to charge at CCS sites and non-Teslas charge at Superchargers. Total interoperability is necessary just as any gasoline powered car can fuel up at any gas station.

Removing the complexity of finding the right brand of charging network simplifies life for most EV drivers and cuts the legs out from those who hype up charging difficulties for EVs.

Well, I charged at CCS sites a total of 3 times using an adapter. The experience of making it work really sucks.

 

[Genie]

I drive to FL from NY, every December. If I have to wait at one SC this year because of this, I will never drive the Tesla again EVER on anyplace that will require a SC. We have a Lexus RX350h also that can be used for road trips. Elon is playing w/ fire. w/o SC exclusivity I would personally never buy another Tesla, currently Lexus options stink, they will probably make a good EV in 6 years when I look at a new car.

They’re your cars, drive whatever you want

 

[vermell]

Do non-Tesla users pay some hidden fee to use the TSC system?

 

[zknobody]

Do non-Tesla users pay some hidden fee to use the TSC system?

there's no hidden fees
users will see the prices on the app

2 tiers: member vs non-member

apparently some of the non-member fees are competitive with operators such as EVGO and Electrify America

ref:

https://www.tesla.com/support/supercharging-other-evs#cost

 

[tivoboy]

Do non-Tesla users pay some hidden fee to use the TSC system?

Hidden fee, or just higher charges… charging rates for non-tesla vehicles appear to be somewhere between 20-30% higher depending on location and time of day, peak non-peak, etc. There doesn’t appear to be some PER USE charge, like $1 + kw use fees.. but a non-tesla user can also PAY a monthly charge of $12.99 monthly, and pay the TESLA VEHICLE kw rate instead of the additional premium per kw charge.

for a non-tesla driver, the monthly fee seems to most likely pay off IF one is going to charge ~ 70-80 kw (1-1.5 80% charges a month) kw per month or MORE, of course again depending on location, time of day, etc.

Personally, I think the 12.99 charge is a teaser rate and it will move to $19.99 a month within ~ 90 days. For someone who wants reliable charging, nearly ubiquitous, high uptime, FAST chargers at market rates, the 12.99$ a month is a no brainer.

 

[vermell]

there's no hidden fees
users will see the prices on the app

2 tiers: member vs non-member

apparently some of the non-member fees are competitive with operators such as EVGO and Electrify America

ref:

https://www.tesla.com/support/supercharging-other-evs#cost

Thanks for sharing that link

<<Tesla owners always get the best pricing at each site without a Supercharging Membership.>>

I suppose this is a perk for us.

I just hope the analysts at Tesla war-gamed projected usage across this merge, and saw some gaps for low congestion.

With more expansion of the TSC, the relief should improve.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

This really limits the number of chargers open to non-Tesla EVs. Or we can look at it as keeping V2 charges open solely to Teslas. Slower yes, but it's better than waiting on non-Tesla owners who have filled up all the chargers. Plus many "legacy" Teslas like my 2016 MX can't charge above 125 kW.

The limitation is just that at the moment there are some areas with V2 only, such as a number sites in Central and Nothern Maine. Fortunately, those locations already either have non-Tesla alternatives, or at least 2 chargers will be added this year.

But in terms of total locations, and total stalls the number of V3+ is far higher, with V3 already more than 2.5 times the number of V2, and comfortably over 3 times the number of stalls, because V3 locations average almost 12 per site, while V2 average a bit over 9.

I think Tesla isn't doing V2 because they just consider that it wouldn't be worth the effort given fewer stalls, slower charging and limited power sharing. It would make offlset parking of non-Teslas more disruptive.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Hidden fee, or just higher charges… charging rates for non-tesla vehicles appear to be somewhere between 20-30% higher depending on location and time of day, peak non-peak, etc. There doesn’t appear to be some PER USE charge, like $1 + kw use fees.. but a non-tesla user can also PAY a monthly charge of $12.99 monthly, and pay the TESLA VEHICLE kw rate instead of the additional premium per kw charge.

for a non-tesla driver, the monthly fee seems to most likely pay off IF one is going to charge ~ 70-80 kw (1-1.5 80% charges a month) kw per month or MORE, of course again depending on location, time of day, etc.

Personally, I think the 12.99 charge is a teaser rate and it will move to $19.99 a month within ~ 90 days. For someone who wants reliable charging, nearly ubiquitous, high uptime, FAST chargers at market rates, the 12.99$ a month is a no brainer.

I disagree. At a site I checked, the $12.99 only saves money when charging more than 100kWh. They have to make it worth it.

 

[MP3Mike]

But in terms of total locations, and total stalls the number of V3+ is far higher, with V3 already more than 2.5 times the number of V2, and comfortably over 3 times the number of stalls, because V3 locations average almost 12 per site, while V2 average a bit over 9.

I don't think that is true, at least not yet. Last time I ran the numbers, in September, for North America there were 15,586 V3 stalls and 8,073 V2 stalls. So not even double the number of stalls. While it has grown since then, I don't think they have added 8,000 stalls in the last 5 months.

 

[tivoboy]

I disagree. At a site I checked, the $12.99 only saves money when charging more than 100kWh. They have to make it worth it.

As I said “depending on location”.. out here, the uncharge is ~ 16 cents per kw extra… so 80 x .16 gets one to 12.80..so, you got me, its not 80 exactly