powertoold
Active Member
V9 sees cars farther away than the visualizations show (see the pathing change before the car shows up in the visualization):
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Pssst @Bladerskb doesn’t like Tesla and thinks Elon is a fraud!!!That's an oddly derogatory thing to say.
But I can't really see the value with beta 9 outside the fun and awe from a technology demonstrator.
You can not rest. You cannot text, watch a video or anything. It will not relieve your tasks. You have to learn a new way of driving, the "hands off surveillance mode", that is tiresome and prone to complacency.
After a while one will be annoyed by the regular failures and things that are not smooth.
And on ride nr 100 or 300 it suddenly does a silly turn and all airbags deployed, just that second you glanced the wrong way for a second.
i can’t rest, text, watch a video, or anything with AP right now, and I love it. It makes my long drives way less stressful because I can let the car do the tedious tasks while I monitor it and the road. I constantly disengage it and take over when it approaches situations I’m not comfortable with and it still makes my drive easier. You don’t need the system let you check out completely to be useful. It’s like cruise control, just letting the car handle maintaining speed on a highway was a big boon even though you still had to pay attention and drive because there is still an energy and mental drain from even the simple act of keeping the gas pedal pressed down to the same level that you don’t notice until you don’t have to do it anymore. I maintain situational awareness and keep my hands on the wheel and can feel by the torque of it whenever AP is going to do something weird (like aborting a lane change halfway through, for example) and can just easily override it, and it makes my drives easier. There is a real difference between moving the steering wheel yourself and letting the steering wheel move your hands, even though the actual motion is superficially the same.
I’ll also note that DirtyTesla missed FSD Beta when he had his 3 in for service and had a loaner instead and had been using it on a daily basis, basically everytime he drove (which was significantly more often than he made vids). That was on a previous build that was significantly worse than V9. There is real benefit, IMO, for V9 in the hands of an attentive driver who maintains situational awareness and is ready and able to take over anytime. The problem is that with a wide release Tesla would be releasing it to the idiots who would take it as license to start texting/sleeping/driving drunk/just zone out and daydream.
Why is current AP safe and useful and not used by idiots, but city streets would be different?
Looks like we need new hardware to improve processing visualizations to match the cameras.
rxlawdude
Active Member
Again, you are defending stupidity and laziness (not to mention compliance with the very clear statements this is a BETA and you must be ready to take over at any time).
I don't agree.
Did I understand correctly; FSD searches different objects (cars, pedestrians, bicycles etc.) and after it has found them, it checks from depth map their location. If there is something that it doesn’t understand (like monorail concrete pillars or planters, it doesn’t ask their location) and doesn’t care about them?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
It also marks non-drivable space and the previous videos (see the first one you quoted) show it was able to mark the pillars as non-drivable space. It's unclear if this was not the case for the FSD v9 video (as we don't have the same raw output) or if simply the visualization not showing everything (which we know to be the case in general already, just not sure for this specific case).
But all it takes is one bad accident from one irresponsible person to ruin this for everyone. And potentially drag down Tesla's reputation and its bank balance.
Think of an airliner accident. Regardless of how and why a crash happened, the OEM will always get sue. I am pretty certain same thing will happen when FSD involves in a bad accident that harms innocent by-standers, regardless if the driver is ultimately responsible for the accident.
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Not quite. As I understand it, Tesla Vision detects a bunch of stuff but the software is not programmed yet to respond to everything it sees. So the depth maps detected the pillars but FSD Beta is not programmed to avoid pillars, only curbs. Since there were no curbs around the pillars, it did not try to avoid them.
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That's a terrifying flaw in the design. It basically means that all you have to do to kill a lot of Tesla drivers is drop a random modern art sculpture in the middle of the road. Or a desk. Or a mattress. Or a chair. Or better yet, a tree.
I don't think I got a photo of it, but after the mudslides on CA-17, somewhere in the neighborhood of Redwood Estates, I encountered a fairly tall redwood tree standing perfectly upright, smack in the middle of the right lane. It was by far the most surreal thing I've ever experienced while driving. It wasn't until I had already gone around it that I fully understood what had just happened.
If there's something there, I don't care what it is. I don't want to hit it. Object detection should be used to determine whether it is something to go around or something that is likely to move on its own. But if an object is detected, with almost zero exceptions (e.g. an empty plastic bag blowing in the air, a small pile of paper trash, etc.) those are the only two choices. "Run right straight into it" is never an option unless you're playing a role in the next Cannonball Run movie.
That can't be the way it's supposed to work. If that were true then any new object that appeared, or one that was positioned in a novel manner (e.g. a smoking, upside down crushed car), wouldn't be avoided.
That is just one person's theory they got from watching the video. We have no idea how V9 works compared to the production versions that green makes the drive able space videos for.
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Sure but the theory makes sense based on all the evidence that we have. And we have plenty of evidence including the depth maps and point clouds that show us what the car's vision is detecting. But the bottom line is that FSD Beta steered the car into a pillar and would have hit the pillar if not for the driver's intervention. That's clearly an issue.
But those are not from V9 so you don't know what V9 is seeing.
You don't know for a fact it would have hit the pillar.
I direct quote someone calling people idiots, and I get blamed?
Your bias is showing. Show me where I ever called people idiots without quoting someone. "Idiots" is the term Tesla supporters use to dismiss anyone that gets hurt using AP so that they can ignore the mistakes it makes. It's not used by people that actually think real Human Factors Engineering includes considering real, broad, human behavior instead of relying on your system only being driven by expert drivers and beta disclaimers.
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