Green New Deal

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

The Green New Deal has emerged as a key litmus test for prospective 2020 presidential candidates, with high-profile candidates jumping on board to back the progressive environmental pitch.

What key 2020 candidates are saying about the Green New Deal

Growing number of 2020 Democrats supporting 'Green New Deal'

They'll endorse it or they'll be "losers".

No, they won't. The ones who are _really_ serious about becoming President won't endorse it, because _really_ endorsing it will make them losers.

They'll weasel.

They'll publicly endorse elements of it that they were already endorsing anyway.

But when it comes to the _whole_ and more controversial things like mass-scale workfare, free higher education and widespread debt relief they'll talk about the plan being bold, that they like the concept of it, that the goals are admirable, but they'll back off from full support and talk about taking steps.

 

[Skotty]

they decided on insanity.

I'm fearful for our democracy here in the United States. The amount of support on the right for someone who is clearly lacks decency, moral standards, and respect for our constitutional norms is upsetting. What happens if such people achieve a lasting majority? A new dark age, I would think.

I'm on board with whatever the Democrats want, even if it's doomed socialist utopia, because that is still preferable to the current alternative. For climate, I would take whatever is on the table; I'm just dubious as to whether measures that look too strong could harm the effort. Kind of like retirement planners at one time who were saying you should save 50%+ of your earnings for retirement, at which point people write them off and save nothing instead.

 

[nwdiver]

Kind of like retirement planners at one time who were saying you should save 50%+ of your earnings for retirement, at which point people write them off and save nothing instead.

I've never seen that >12% for someone in their 20s. But that is an apt example. In terms of climate we're now the 65 yo with nothing saved and living in Moms basement. We really... really... REALLY should have gotten serious ~40 years ago, the distain I have for my parents and their POS cohort will never fade. The 'greatest generation' was followed by the most selfish and pathetic generation. They really screwed us. But things are only going to get worse. We need to start with what we have yesterday......

 

[dhrivnak]

I've never seen that >12% for someone in their 20s. But that is an apt example. In terms of climate we're now the 65 yo with nothing saved and living in Moms basement. We really... really... REALLY should have gotten serious ~40 years ago, the distain I have for my parents and their POS cohort will never fade. The 'greatest generation' was followed by the most selfish and pathetic generation. They really screwed us. But things are only going to get worse. We need to start with what we have yesterday......

We do not have to wait on the Government as WE can do something and if thousands of us do it will make a difference. See how people across the USA and Canada have made a difference. https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0692...F8&qid=1545411085&sr=1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65

 

[mspohr]

The Green New Deal's Big Idea - The Atlantic

The economic thinker who most influenced the Green New Deal isn’t Marx or Lenin. No, if you want to understand Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s bid to remake the economy to fight climate change, you need to read Hamilton.

Hamilton, in short, successfully used the power of the federal government to boost manufacturing, to pick winners and losers, and to shape the fate of the U.S. economy. He is the father of American industrial policy: the set of laws and regulations that say the federal government can guide economic growth without micro-managing it. And the Green New Deal, for all its socialist regalia, only makes sense in light of his capitalistic work.

Above all, the Green New Deal is a leftist resurrection of federal industrial policy. It is not an attempt to control the private sector, according to its authors; it is a bid to collaborate with it. And it draws on a set of ideas with a rich American history, extending long before the great World War II mobilization to which the Green New Deal is regularly compared.

“This goes back to Hamilton, the daddy of it all,” says Stephen Cohen, a professor of city and regional planning at UC Berkeley. He argues that industrial policy has birthed the transcontinental railroad, the cookie-cutter suburb, the home appliance, and the computer—nearly every major American economic transition since 1776.

 

[juliusa]

This is possibly the most ridiculous statement ever posted on TMC, which is why I'm assuming your posts are sarcasm and satire.

Your assumption is correct. Add disdain for those in DC that pretend to care about climate change, but have done nothing in the past decade to develop a plan, policy, or legislation to address it.

AOC gets a pass, since she is new to Washington. Anyone that was re-elected to the House or has been in the Senate for more than 2 years have no excuse.

 

[juliusa]

I think the Democrats have it right. They realize that the Republicans will block GND until at least 2021. They are starting now to put plans in place to be ready to go as soon as possible.

Fair enough, but wouldn't it be better to have legislation written and have co-sponsors than just sit around with their thumbs up their arses for two years? And what were they doing the past two years? What if they had taken control of the Senate and were in a position to pass legislation - even if it got vetoed by Trump? Or what if he were impeached and thrown out?

 

[juliusa]

If you "think" that Repukes and Dems have understood climate change and the needed response similarly then your head is still in the crevice and you are delusional from the methane.

I don't know how to judge how much they understand. I do know that the difference between what they have done is not measurable in temperature rise.

 

[SageBrush]

I don't know how to judge how much they understand. I do know that the difference between what they have done is not measurable in temperature rise.

Start by listening to what is said.
Then get a clue and realize that action has been blocked or reversed by the Repukes.
How much climate change legislation was submitted to congress by Repukes ?
How much climate change legislation was submitted to congress by Dems ?
How much was blocked by Repukes ?
How much was blocked by Dems ?

Read the political platforms of each party
Note the policies and AGW positions of the people put in charge of the EPA and DOE by each president.

How many of last 30 Dem candidates for president in Primary elections SAID AGW was real and required action ?
Do the same for the Repukes

This is not difficult.
How did you vote in the last 10 Federal elections ? When did it become apparent to YOU that AGW is real and requires urgent action ?

 

[juliusa]

Start by listening to what is said.

I read no further than that. They all lie, so no point in listening to them - just look at what they accomplish. That is all the planet cares about - their hot air helps nothing.

 

[Merrill]

No politician gives a crap about you and I unless we can provide them with money. It is unfortunate that we elect these people to work for us and all they do is work for themselves.

 

[JRP3]

They all lie, so no point in listening to them

That's the kind of thinking that gave us Trump. They don't all lie and they aren't all the same, just like any other group of human beings.

 

[SageBrush]

I read no further than that.

Do you vote ? Based on what ?

 

[juliusa]

That's the kind of thinking that gave us Trump. They don't all lie and they aren't all the same

The choice was Trump or Clinton. Two sides of the same coin.

But you are right; they are not all the same. I think Amy Klobuchar, Bernie Sanders, and Joe Biden are honest and believe in what they are doing - even if you disagree them on policy. Maybe Tulsi Gabbard - have not seen enough of her yet. Not impressed with the others.

 

[juliusa]

Do you vote ? Based on what ?

Yes, I vote. Based on everything. I'm not a one-issue voter.

 

[SageBrush]

Yes, I vote. Based on everything. I'm not a one-issue voter.

Everything ... but you don't listen to them, and by extension you do not read much. What is left ?

Their past performance perhaps ? Good, what is the voting record on climate change of the politicians you vote for ?

 

[SageBrush]

The choice was Trump or Clinton. Two sides of the same coin.

With regards to AGW ?
Oh ... right. Neither had a legislative record so they were equal in your eyes.

Why do you bother with this charade ?

 

[juliusa]

what is the voting record on climate change of the politicians you vote for

Mixed.

With regards to AGW ?

With regards to being slimebags.

 

[SageBrush]

Mixed

Clarify.

 

[nwdiver]

'The Green New Deal' was the subject this week on 'The Energy Gang'

One snippet I found interesting is that taken as a whole without any party affiliation attached the basic objectives outlined in 'The Green New Deal' polls at ~92% with Democrats and 64% with Republicans. There's OVERWHELMING support for this.

Let's get to work!