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Hong Kong Tesla Model S Charging Standard

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#421
DITB said:
Generally, dual chargers are twice as fast as single chargers. Makes sense, right?

But it all depends. If you are below 16A anyway, it won't make a difference. If it's a Tesla Wall Charger, it can make a single phase supply into three virtual phases and thus charge up to 45 km/h, even with one phase - on a single charger Model S.

If it's a non-Tesla charger, though, a single charger Model S on a single phase charging station, cannot get more than 1x16A, or about 15 km/h charging (3 to 3.5 kW). In this case, you would get 32 km/h (7 kW) rather than only 15 km/h, with the very same charger (if you have dual chargers in your car).
Click to expand...

One of the Aussie Tesla owners has made up a Mennekes-Mennekes cable that is wired like the Tesla Wall Charger (single phase input, three phase output)
I tested it today on a single charger Model S and got 30A (the max at this station); with Tesla supplied cable at this same charger it maxes out at 16A

He also sells a J1772 to Mennekes cable that is wired the same, so you can charge at up to 32A on a single-charger Model S.

The J1772 cable can be ordered direct from his website but the Mennekes cable is special order only right now (not many Mennekes stations in Australia other than a handful in Perth, Western Austalia)
 
#422
MDK said:
One of the Aussie Tesla owners has made up a Mennekes-Mennekes cable that is wired like the Tesla Wall Charger (single phase input, three phase output)
Click to expand...
Technically, it's not outputting three phase power, it is merely connecting same single phase power to all three lines of the vehicle inlet. This allows the Model S to take more than 16A per charger. People in Europe have been complaining about this since the Model S was introduced there. I don't know why someone over there didn't do the same thing. It's brilliant, especially for J1772 charging stations with captive cables.
 
#423
miimura said:
Technically, it's not outputting three phase power, it is merely connecting same single phase power to all three lines of the vehicle inlet. This allows the Model S to take more than 16A per charger. People in Europe have been complaining about this since the Model S was introduced there. I don't know why someone over there didn't do the same thing. It's brilliant, especially for J1772 charging stations with captive cables.
Click to expand...
I'm going to guess the IEC spec doesn't allow this, and there might be actual laws in the EU that could get you in trouble for selling such a cable (CE marking might be required, and something like that likely won't get through CE testing). Back then there was a lot of speculation on even if the CHAdeMO adapter will be allowed (ended up it was allowed so maybe Tesla was able to lobby for some exemption or a lenient interpretation of the rules). hcsharp's post back then hinted at the difficulty of getting his J1772 adapter for the Roadster through CE testing for this reason.
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/show...-adapter/page3?p=509643&viewfull=1#post509643

Since Australia is not in the EU, it doesn't need any CE marking, so anything goes.
 
Last edited:
#424
miimura said:
Technically, it's not outputting three phase power, it is merely connecting same single phase power to all three lines of the vehicle inlet. This allows the Model S to take more than 16A per charger. People in Europe have been complaining about this since the Model S was introduced there. I don't know why someone over there didn't do the same thing. It's brilliant, especially for J1772 charging stations with captive cables.
Click to expand...

In the EU, at least in the Northern part, most 16A and 32A installations have three phases anyway - which would max out a single charger Model S anyway. But in Hong Kong where many charging spots are single phase, it does make sense.

I wouldn't be surprised if such a cable wasn't legal in Europe.
 
#426
miimura said:
In addition, it seems that Tesla has equipped all UK cars with two on-board chargers and software limited them to 11kW if you didn't pay for the second one. The 32A single phase hardware limit still applies.
Click to expand...

It is more recently reported that this kludge is coming to an end, with newer UK cars having a hardware change so that single-charger cars can accept 32A on a conventionally-wired type2 (presumably an internal contactor to do the same job as the non-standard external wiring). Not sure of the cut-over date, or whether it applies to all markets rather than just the UK.
 
#427
arg said:
It is more recently reported that this kludge is coming to an end, with newer UK cars having a hardware change so that single-charger cars can accept 32A on a conventionally-wired type2 (presumably an internal contactor to do the same job as the non-standard external wiring). Not sure of the cut-over date, or whether it applies to all markets rather than just the UK.
Click to expand...
It was rumored long ago that the internal switcher was going to be the solution. However, it seems that it got pushed to the back burner in engineering and the software limiting on dual charger hardware was the most expedient solution. It's good to hear that they are coming back around to it.

Also, if they're doing it internally, then why not up to 40A or 48A (16A x 3) per charger? Probably no matter, since you will only find up to 32A single phase in public anyway.
 
#428
Different Charging Ways?

Read the threads here and found that there are chargers at different voltage - Superchargers (SCs), 13A, 32A and other voltage.

Since I am not electrician and do not know much about electricity, could someone tell me:
1. What I should know about charging the vehicle before making an order for an MS?
2. If I need to buy different wires for different voltage of chargers.
3. Whether the performance and durability of the battery of the car is affected if using different charging ways, SCs vs. 13A/32A, etc.
Thanks in advance.
 
#429
MingMan said:
Read the threads here and found that there are chargers at different voltage - Superchargers (SCs), 13A, 32A and other voltage.

Since I am not electrician and do not know much about electricity, could someone tell me:
1. What I should know about charging the vehicle before making an order for an MS?
2. If I need to buy different wires for different voltage of chargers.
3. Whether the performance and durability of the battery of the car is affected if using different charging ways, SCs vs. 13A/32A, etc.
Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

There is a thread here Hong Kong Tesla Model S Charging Standard
It's a long read, I try to give you some quick and short answers

1) if you cover many miles per day then you should start talking to your estate management about installing home charging (1 wall connector comes with car). Negotiation could be a long process unless you have seen other EV having their private charger installed at your estate parking. If you can charge at work that's fine or else you'll have to rely on SC.
2)IEC type 2 cable comes with the car, that'll do either 32/1~ or 32/3~ at government parking which gives you around 30 and 90km/hour charging respectively. 32/3 phase isn't very common yet. SC is DC charging directly to the battery, other chargers give alternating current either single or 3 phases. Japanese standard DoCoMo is also DC, only a few in HK you probably won't invest in an adaptor (not yet available from Tesla in HK). You'll have to (recommended) buy a $4,700 cable from Tesla for BS1363 socket charging (like your home square plug), there are lots of these installed in government and public parkings.
3) Durability of battery is not affected as the car will control/regulate the rate of charging.

PS: I cover 80k+ daily I charge only at supercharger.
 
#430
3fiftynine said:
There is a thread here Hong Kong Tesla Model S Charging Standard
It's a long read, I try to give you some quick and short answers

1) if you cover many miles per day then you should start talking to your estate management about installing home charging (1 wall connector comes with car). Negotiation could be a long process unless you have seen other EV having their private charger installed at your estate parking. If you can charge at work that's fine or else you'll have to rely on SC.
2)IEC type 2 cable comes with the car, that'll do either 32/1~ or 32/3~ at government parking which gives you around 30 and 90km/hour charging respectively. 32/3 phase isn't very common yet. SC is DC charging directly to the battery, other chargers give alternating current either single or 3 phases. Japanese standard DoCoMo is also DC, only a few in HK you probably won't invest in an adaptor (not yet available from Tesla in HK). You'll have to (recommended) buy a $4,700 cable from Tesla for BS1363 socket charging (like your home square plug), there are lots of these installed in government and public parkings.
3) Durability of battery is not affected as the car will control/regulate the rate of charging.

PS: I cover 80k+ daily I charge only at supercharger.
Click to expand...

Thank you.
1. I am not going to talk to my estate management as I think it is going to be a waste of time or owners of the other 2 MS that near my parking space should already have got theirs. The parking lot that I work has specifically a setup on the wall with 2 13A socket spaces (something like those at home). So I think I can just hook up the MS and one of the 2 sockets with a wire to do charging. If I understand correctly from you, the wire that I need is a cable from Tesla for BS1363 socket charging.
2. What do 32/1~ and 32/3~ mean? Again, if I understand correctly, if I buy the cable as mentioned in (1) and with the IEC type 2 cable comes with the car, I will have 2 cables for different charging ways. The former at work and the latter at government parking. How about those SCs and parking lots such as the Ocean Terminal in TST, what cable should be used?
 
#432
MingMan said:
If I understand correctly from you, the wire that I need is a cable from Tesla for BS1363 socket charging.
2. What do 32/1~ and 32/3~ mean? Again, if I understand correctly, if I buy the cable as mentioned in (1) and with the IEC type 2 cable comes with the car, I will have 2 cables for different charging ways. The former at work and the latter at government parking. How about those SCs and parking lots such as the Ocean Terminal in TST, what cable should be used?
Click to expand...

The BS1363 (like the home square plug) charging cable is $4,700 available from Tesla (ask for it on delivery so you save a trip back). At Ocean Terminal, Science Park (indoor parking), most government parking you have dozens of these.

Yes you'll have 2 charging cables (one free one paid for) in the trunk. When you charge at SC you pull the cable from the Tesla supercharger, i.e. you don't need cable from your car.

1~ and 3~ is single and 3 phase respectively. At home all your electric appliances run on single phase circuit, 3 phases equipment is for heavier duty and industrial. A medium rate charger at 3~ gives you roughly 3 times faster charging.

You'll be lucky if you could occupy one of the 13A sockets at work for charging, i.e. for 8 hours you'll get about 80km, you gain everyday if your round trip is less than this. There are owners who bought from Taobao cheaper China made charging cables which could do 13A (or even 16 to 20A), that's the legal maximum you could draw from a wall socket. You'll have 100km at the end of your workday!
 
#434
What happened to the promised 32 amp 3 phase wall charger from Tesla?

When I bought my P85D at the end of 2014, the 32 amp 3 phase wall charger was supposed to come out early 2015. Now it's early 2016 yet I still have not received any information on this from Tesla. Contacted Tesla a couple of times via phone where they promised to return my call after they find out more on this but of course, this is Tesla HK so no call backs as usual. Emails went to deaf ears as well as expected. My Dual-chargers are useless without the new wall chargers. Anyone in the same boat?:mad:
 
#435
my 70D order was placed oct 2015 and i've just taken delivery of the car. I've installed the wall charger that they provided with the car.

there's been absolutely no news about 3phase setups, and all my technical questions to tesla HK fell on deaf ears even before i fully paid the balance of the car. all the info on wall charging that i've learned, i've accquired from the tech sub forum on this site and the wall charger document in My Tesla, plus consulting with one of the wall charger installing companies that tesla recommended.

the best option that i could setup was a single phase 40A connection, which i had to insist on. The recommended construction company tried to convince me that it's OK to just run the wall charger on the same rail as the one powering the kitchen etc (which is, in itself, against the recommendation made inside tesla's wall charging info document).

the charger that i received from tesla basically has a connection inside that connects any 3 phase power into a single line, so it's absolutely pointless to spend extra money to setup a 3 phase rail for the charger. There's been zero updates from Tesla regarding whether their charger setup would be changed anytime soon, and it was admittedly frustrating to decided without knowing clearly whether it made sense to "future proof" the setup.

Tesla's really riding thin on customer's satisfaction with their customer service... if the cars were so good that they sell themselves, their customer service would really kill the business. at least in HK.
 
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