How are Europeans liking Model 3?

[voip-ninja]

My experience is that Europeans, and particularly Germans/Austrians are much more demanding of their cars than Americans. I've personally known Germans who have taken Mercedes technicians on the Autobahn at 100+ mph to diagnose minor vibration noise and so on. I would say they have quite high expectations out of a daily driver.

So, I'm starting a thread to see what impressions are from our European friends that have taken delivery of their new Model 3s.

 

[rendm]

I will take delevery in a week, but I think most of the people here agree that it is an awesome car. That said, they will need to improve on:
- Fit and finish (gaps etc)
- General build quality (rattles, clunk when charging etc)
- Some material quality
- Paint is much worse than we are used too. (softer paint, scratches easily). Even at delivery I hear many people complaining about defects.
- Service/communication should be much, much better. (I hope it's just because of growing pains atm)

If they can improve on these issues, it would be the perfect car / company.

 

[TeeEmCee]

My experience is that Europeans, and particularly Germans/Austrians are much more demanding of their cars than Americans. I've personally known Germans who have taken Mercedes technicians on the Autobahn at 100+ mph to diagnose minor vibration noise and so on. I would say they have quite high expectations out of a daily driver.

So, I'm starting a thread to see what impressions are from our European friends that have taken delivery of their new Model 3s.

My guess is that there will be some fallout from the gap between the Tesla mfg reality and the average European expectation of quality.

On the other hand though, driving any vehicle on a typical EU freeway is quite different from driving the same vehicle on a US interstate. The road curvature and smoothness does not come anywhere close to inducing the same vibrations as driving on any of the interstates around Dallas, for instance.
It may be a different story in the city, over cobblestone streets and such, but there aren't that many of those ... unless you're in Rome, but then you generally have have bigger problems when driving in Rome.

 

[StealthP3D]

I will take delevery in a week, but I think most of the people here agree that it is an awesome car. That said, they will need to improve on:
- Fit and finish (gaps etc)
- General build quality (rattles, clunk when charging etc)
- Some material quality
- Paint is much worse than we are used too. (softer paint, scratches easily). Even at delivery I hear many people complaining about defects.
- Service/communication should be much, much better. (I hope it's just because of growing pains atm)

If they can improve on these issues, it would be the perfect car / company.

Looking forward to your driving impressions when your long-awaited delivery finally happens! How exciting.

As far as reports of "soft paint", I think there is some misunderstanding. Paint continues to cure for up to a full year (or even longer in cold environments) after manufacture. Because Model 3's have a much quicker trip from paint shop to the customer (compared to a car that has sat in a dealership lot waiting for a buyer) it's likely the paint is actually softer on initial delivery. But it becomes a lot harder once it has baked in the sun. As far as I know, Tesla uses the same class of paints used by most modern automakers, water-based polyurethanes. These modern paints are incredibly tough compared to previous solvent-based paints but they do take longer to cure.

My advice, park it out in the sun when possible for the first month or two. The heat will accelerate the cure to final hardness. Also, avoid following too closely, particularly on high-speed roads before the paint has had adequate time to reach full hardness.

Enjoy the new car!

 

[voip-ninja]

Looking forward to your driving impressions when your long-awaited delivery finally happens! How exciting.

As far as reports of "soft paint", I think there is some misunderstanding. Paint continues to cure for up to a full year (or even longer in cold environments) after manufacture. Because Model 3's have a much quicker trip from paint shop to the customer (compared to a car that has sat in a dealership lot waiting for a buyer) it's likely the paint is actually softer on initial delivery. But it becomes a lot harder once it has baked in the sun. As far as I know, Tesla uses the same class of paints used by most modern automakers, water-based polyurethanes. These modern paints are incredibly tough compared to previous solvent-based paints but they do take longer to cure.

My advice, park it out in the sun when possible for the first month or two. The heat will accelerate the cure to final hardness. Also, avoid following too closely, particularly on high-speed roads before the paint has had adequate time to reach full hardness.

Enjoy the new car!

I have a good friend who was a plant supervisor at the Saturn plant back in the early 90's. He is now a professional detailer in his retirement.

According to him, paint cure time (fully cured) is 30-90 days depending on products used.

If you have another source of information perhaps you could provide it rather than presenting myths as facts.

I don't know how Tesla paint stacks up to the competition but I do know that this same friend who actually details many Tesla S and X vehicles in the SLC area indicated that in his opinion Tesla paint is "soft" compared to some of the other makes he works on. He also says that "all" automotive paint sucks now compared to when he first got into auto detailing as a hobby in the 90's.

And just a reminder. This thread is so we can get some direct feedback from European owners, not sidetrack into conversations where people feel some desperate need to defend Tesla at all costs.

 

[StealthP3D]

I have a good friend who was a plant supervisor at the Saturn plant back in the early 90's. He is now a professional detailer in his retirement.

According to him, paint cure time (fully cured) is 30-90 days depending on products used.

If you have another source of information perhaps you could provide it rather than presenting myths as facts.

I don't know how Tesla paint stacks up to the competition but I do know that this same friend who actually details many Tesla S and X vehicles in the SLC area indicated that in his opinion Tesla paint is "soft" compared to some of the other makes he works on. He also says that "all" automotive paint sucks now compared to when he first got into auto detailing as a hobby in the 90's.

I would expect a negative opinion on Tesla paint from you (and whatever sources you quote). Paint cure time is dependent upon temperature (and even the color of the paint). In a colder environment, it can easily go beyond 30-90 days. I do not accept your source as a word of mouth expert on automotive paint even if he was a supervisor at a Saturn plant, at least not as relayed by you. You are free to believe whatever you want. The fact is that modern automotive paints are tougher than in the past and they don't need to be applied in such thick coats to provide the same or better protection than anything we saw in the 1990's. This also saves weight and fuel and reduces VOC released into the atmosphere.

My mom had a Saturn and it had terrible paint - there are good reasons why Saturn went out of business and one of the biggest ones is the quality did not live up to the marketing hype about how high quality they were. Saturns were crap.

 

[voip-ninja]

I would expect a negative opinion on Tesla paint from you (and whatever sources you quote). Paint cure time is dependent upon temperature (and even the color of the paint). In a colder environment, it can easily go beyond 30-90 days. I do not accept your source as a word of mouth expert on automotive paint even if he was a supervisor at a Saturn plant, at least not as relayed by you. You are free to believe whatever you want. The fact is that modern automotive paints are tougher than in the past and they don't need to be applied in such thick coats to provide the same or better protection than anything we saw in the 1990's. This also saves weight and fuel and reduces VOC released into the atmosphere.

My mom had a Saturn and it had terrible paint - there are good reasons why Saturn went out of business and one of the biggest ones is the quality did not live up to the marketing hype about how high quality they were. Saturns were crap.

Well if nothing else you are always good for a laugh. You still didn't provide your source on automotive paint cure time which is exactly what I would expect from you.

I'm not commenting further as your attempt here is clearly to derail this thread and I'd genuinely like to get feedback from the Germans, Norwegians and others who have received their cars.

 

[StealthP3D]

I'm not commenting further as your attempt here is clearly to derail this thread and I'd genuinely like to get feedback from the Germans, Norwegians and others who have received their cars.

Thank you, I genuinely appreciate it!

 

[rendm]

I'll post my experiences after I take delivery.

I forgot one item, for the price of the m3 (we can only order LR AWD and performance), I think most people here would expect an automated trunk open/close.

 

[voip-ninja]

Bump.

Also,

Tesla Model 3 Performance im Test: Das Raumschiff ist gelandet

 

[nvx1977]

]Tesla Model 3 Performance im Test: Das Raumschiff ist gelandet

still don't get why the glovebox is such a hardship. It's 2 taps on the screen that takes 1 second to perform. Anyhow, the glovebox issue was mentioned a lot in a bunch of first reviews here in the US too, but rarely have I heard actual owners complain about it.

 

[TeeEmCee]

Bump.

Also,

Tesla Model 3 Performance im Test: Das Raumschiff ist gelandet

“Obwohl die Qualität deutlich besser geworden ist” ... no idea what this guy’s reference is.
Unless we’re comparing to some of the catastrophic 2017 builds, I’m yet to see that improvement.


I generally like this guy’s videos:

 

[Arpe]

I found this article awhile ago (Germany):
Tesla Model 3 Consumer Satisfaction In Germany — The Good & The Bad | CleanTechnica

And this thread from Denmark (google translation will be sufficient):
Tesla Forum - Alt om Tesla Model S / Tesla Model X - Teslaforum.dk

All in all it seems like Europeans loves the Tesla Model 3, my dad will get his this Friday. Can't wait to try it!

 

[PoitNarf]

still don't get why the glovebox is such a hardship. It's 2 taps on the screen that takes 1 second to perform. Anyhow, the glovebox issue was mentioned a lot in a bunch of first reviews here in the US too, but rarely have I heard actual owners complain about it.

Probably because most owners rarely use the glove box. I’ll be at exactly 1 year of ownership on Friday and in that first year I doubt I’ve used the glove box more than 10 times.

Edit: I just read that article (translated) and at the end in addition to them complaining about the glove box opening procedure they also mention that the exterior door handles “endanger” fingernails. Huh? That’s the very first time I’ve ever heard of such a complaint. Perhaps the reviewer needs a manicure

 

[Matt L]

My guess is that there will be some fallout from the gap between the Tesla mfg reality and the average European expectation of

It’s this really myth at this point? Granted early models had some issues but have there really been any significant issues in the last year? I got mine in July and it is flawless.

 

[srs5694]

I just read that article (translated) and at the end in addition to them complaining about the glove box opening procedure they also mention that the exterior door handles “endanger” fingernails. Huh? That’s the very first time I’ve ever heard of such a complaint. Perhaps the reviewer needs a manicure

Somebody with long fingernails (like a lot of women) might have trouble with the Model 3's door handles. That said, fingernails that long are impractical for a lot of things, so I'm not sure how fair it is to complain about a car's door-handle design on this issue. It's probably fair to mention it in a review just to warn people who might be affected, though. (Note the distinction between "mention" and "complain," which is easily lost these days.)

 

[Matt L]

Somebody with long fingernails (like a lot of women) might have trouble with the Model 3's door handles. That said, fingernails that long are impractical for a lot of things, so I'm not sure how fair it is to complain about a car's door-handle design on this issue. It's probably fair to mention it in a review just to warn people who might be affected, though. (Note the distinction between "mention" and "complain," which is easily lost these days.)

Euro women don’t do the long fake nail thing...or were you talking about the men?

 

[srs5694]

It’s this really myth at this point? Granted early models had some issues but have there really been any significant issues in the last year? I got mine in July and it is flawless.

There are continuing threads about paint and panel-gap issues in the deliveries sub-forum. One person claimed that only 10% of 200 cars he saw recently would be acceptable to him. That said, I don't know this guy's standards, or how common the reported problems are. It could be that 99% of buyers are happy with their cars, and we're just seeing loud complaints from the 1% who've received cars with problems.

 

[Matt L]

There are continuing threads about paint and panel-gap issues in the deliveries sub-forum. One person claimed that only 10% of 200 cars he saw recently would be acceptable to him. That said, I don't know this guy's standards, or how common the reported problems are. It could be that 99% of buyers are happy with their cars, and we're just seeing loud complaints from the 1% who've received cars with problems.

Yeah, I’m not sure complaints on forums represent consensus views.

 

[TeeEmCee]

I found this article awhile ago (Germany):
Tesla Model 3 Consumer Satisfaction In Germany — The Good & The Bad | CleanTechnica

And this thread from Denmark (google translation will be sufficient):
Tesla Forum - Alt om Tesla Model S / Tesla Model X - Teslaforum.dk

All in all it seems like Europeans loves the Tesla Model 3, my dad will get his this Friday. Can't wait to try it!

I think their saving grace will come from, among other things, the favorable tax and regulatory treatment. With the emission regulations and taxes in place, the bulk of traditional vehicles must be sold with puny and, at least by American standards, totally inadequate engines. Since anything with a halfway decent engine costs an arm and a leg, Tesla should not have too much trouble competing at its current price point. Between that and the fact that it represents something finally new in the automotive landscape, I can see why some would decide to pick one over yet another 4-cylinder mercedes or such.