I traded in my Model S for a Prius Prime

[SO16]

If Tesla doesn't step up the quality and customer service game, it's over.

It’s over? Really?

I don’t know of any manufacturers that are good enough to say “if you made an EV, it would be game over for Tesla”. Not even Toyota.

Tesla Model 3 is the most satisfying car: Survey

Tesla Model S and Model Y are among the top 5 most satisfactory cars..Mazda CX-3 is the least satisfactory car, say the owners.

auto.hindustantimes.com

 

[skiwhmts]

For those considering a Prius Prime I highly recommend it. Its not like a Prius Hybrid because it can run in full EV mode. For the price its a great runabout. I test drove the Model 3 but the Prius Prime was half after incentives and its a great fun ride with a 660 mile range. I decided to get it as a spare family car. Its got great features like heads up display, heated steering wheel, Apple Carplay Android Auto, Its comfortable and easy to drive in the city. I am waiting on Tesla for a future car but waiting to see how the market evolves. My friends Teslas I have been driving both sold them for different reasons. As your life changes different cars can suit you better.

 

[David_Cary]

This reminds me of a similar thread that I started in 2007 when I switched from a BMW 545 to a Honda Civic hybrid. It was an efficiency change first and foremost but the frequency of service on the BMW was unacceptable - and since it was prepaid, it meant dealer every time. T

Obviously, most folks didn't understand and thought I was crazy. People have different ideas about what cars are. I always remember the saying about people in different cities and it had do with how you were judged. One was career, one was money, one was how you dressed. I can't remember the details but in LA, it was what you drove.

Probably 30-40% of forum members are from southern CA. Especially S forum members - the 3 is more spread out over the US. When you leave SoCA (do they still call it that?), most of us don't care. If someone thought differently of me because I drove a Prius, I wouldn't care one bit.

I am considering changing out of a Tesla and would probably do something like a Bolt/Ioniq. I hadn't thought about a Prius Prime. I also considered a used Volt but I need a bit more room.

My car (70D with 90K) has been reasonable from a reliability standpoint. But I just did my 3rd door handle last month. My costs on door handles are so far about $50. I can't really roadtrip anymore since the charging is so slow. I still have MCU1 so starting up is slow and voice barely works. I need to fix my horn and a rear door latch still.

Service sucks but I haven't needed it much. And our SC is pretty good.

 

[Tigers]

It’s over? Really?

I don’t know of any manufacturers that are good enough to say “if you made an EV, it would be game over for Tesla”. Not even Toyota.

Tesla Model 3 is the most satisfying car: Survey

Tesla Model S and Model Y are among the top 5 most satisfactory cars..Mazda CX-3 is the least satisfactory car, say the owners.

auto.hindustantimes.com

I'm sure Ford, GM and Chrysler said the same thing as they pumped out bad products year after year in the 80s and 90s before Toyota and Honda absolutely dominated them. Both GM and Chrysler would be out of business of the US government didn't save them.

I believe Rivian can take X sales, Lucid can take S sales, and a combination of other OEMs can start to eat away at 3/Y. For example, the Nissan Ariya is a very attractive product which I would consider over the Y.

 

[SO16]

I'm sure Ford, GM and Chrysler said the same thing as they pumped out bad products year after year in the 80s and 90s before Toyota and Honda absolutely dominated them. Both GM and Chrysler would be out of business of the US government didn't save them.

I believe Rivian can take X sales, Lucid can take S sales, and a combination of other OEMs can start to eat away at 3/Y. For example, the Nissan Ariya is a very attractive product which I would consider over the Y.

Take some sales, sure. All? Not hardly. More likely the market will continue to expand enough for quite some time that Tesla will still not lose overall sales.

Tesla is at least on par with Ford and GM quality of today. And I don’t count panel gaps as “concerns” since they are often addressed within a day.

 

[Cattledog]

Smart plan! I recently traded my Model S for a RAV4 Prime. Talk about a step up in build quality, dependability, resale value and customer service. And so much less hype.

Agree with the last sentence!

OP, we wish you well, you will be welcomed back when you are ready, all will be forgiven...

...from a driver of the 14th Model S ever made, so we have a long relationship together.

 

[fiehlsport]

I had a Prius Prime before my Model 3. Sold the Prime after 1 year, almost immediately after I test drove the 3.

I'm a "car guy," so the driving dynamics of the 3 were what I was missing from the Prime, but I have to say the Prime was the least stressful car I've ever owned. The only thing I really didn't like was the gas engine turning on when the EV battery depleted. It became pointless, I charged the Prime so much and loved it in electric mode - Toyota could've made that thing a pure EV and it would've been great. It even had a heat pump back in 2017, but it didn't work down to the temperatures the Tesla one does now.

Oh, and my Model 3 has had thirteen warranty service appointments. The Prime had zero in 30,000 miles, and my 3 has 35K now. And yeah, the Prime was about half the cost of the 3 after incentives. A lot of car for the money.

 

[SO16]

I had a Prius Prime before my Model 3. Sold the Prime after 1 year, almost immediately after I test drove the 3.

I'm a "car guy," so the driving dynamics of the 3 were what I was missing from the Prime, but I have to say the Prime was the least stressful car I've ever owned. The only thing I really didn't like was the gas engine turning on when the EV battery depleted. It became pointless, I charged the Prime so much and loved it in electric mode - Toyota could've made that thing a pure EV and it would've been great. It even had a heat pump back in 2017, but it didn't work down to the temperatures the Tesla one does now.

Oh, and my Model 3 has had thirteen warranty service appointments. The Prime had zero in 30,000 miles, and my 3 has 35K now. And yeah, the Prime was about half the cost of the 3 after incentives. A lot of car for the money.

13?

Wow. I’ve had 2 in going on 5 years and 56k miles in my S. Both very minor and fixed by mobile service.

 

[David_Cary]

That is the problem with the Tesla experience. No one is happy with 13 service appointments and everyone is happy with 2 - say in the first 3 years.

Inconsistency.

 

[Tigers]

Take some sales, sure. All? Not hardly. More likely the market will continue to expand enough for quite some time that Tesla will still not lose overall sales.

Tesla is at least on par with Ford and GM quality of today. And I don’t count panel gaps as “concerns” since they are often addressed within a day.

It's not just panel gaps. Trim falling off, poor part reliability, terrible paint quality, software issues, lack of real blind spot monitoring/auto-wipers/auto-beams/self parking... There's way more than just a few mm here and there that don't line up.

Not to mention - who knows what the reliability of battery and drivetrain components will be on the 3/Y. Though the 3 was initially released in 2017, really sales didn't take off until 2018 and 2019. So, we are viewing the reliability, which was already rated as 3rd worst in the industry, of cars that average 1-2 years old. Do you think in 5 years these cars are still going to be sitting solid? It's doubtful.

If any one of these manufacturers can put out a fun to drive, less than $100k car that is made with a premium feel, Tesla is going to be in trouble that segment. Seems like Rivian is on track to put out their truck in June. I don't expect it to be perfect or error-free, but it will be interesting to hear reviews.

All that said, I think the refreshed Model S will tell us all we need to know about what they have learned over the past 10 years or so. Given it's an all new interior, there has been significant changes to the battery pack, and likely other unannounced changes....Have they fixed the door handle issues, are the parts on the interior durable and rattle-free? Software is software and it'll never be perfect. We will find out in a couple of weeks.

 

[SabrToothSqrl]

As for me, after four Teslas and a couple hundred thousand miles on them I wonder what "service" we're talking about. Personally I just adjust my own windshield wiper blades, so I don't need to go to the dealer. Maybe you folk are so used to taking your gas cars in for "service" that you just keep taking in your Teslas. Beats me.

lol. i had more "service" on my S, than any other car in my life. Door handles would fail so often, it was a monthly event. at least 1 primary battery, 2 drive motors. wiper motor. sunroof motor. and a dozen other things I don't even recall. Now interacting with "service" is so infurating I'd rather light the car on fire, go to jail for 6-12 months than reply to any more passive agressive texts telling me that even though they have a "8 hour" repair on my car, they "have no loaners". when my friend gets a loaner for her Jeep's inspection! Don't beat yourself too hard with those wipers.

 

[Tigers]

lol. i had more "service" on my S, than any other car in my life. Door handles would fail so often, it was a monthly event. at least 1 primary battery, 2 drive motors. wiper motor. sunroof motor. and a dozen other things I don't even recall. Now interacting with "service" is so infurating I'd rather light the car on fire, go to jail for 6-12 months than reply to any more passive agressive texts telling me that even though they have a "8 hour" repair on my car, they "have no loaners". when my friend gets a loaner for her Jeep's inspection! Don't beat yourself too hard with those wipers.

What year was your S and how does your X/3 compare in terms of part failure?

 

[skiwhmts]

Its ironic that Tesla does the hard things right and the easy mechanical stuff wrong when building cars. Its like their engineering dept is top shelf and their production dept is too stressed to worry about all the little details.

 

[Missile Toad]

It's not a political statement or a declaration of war. Even in my Tesla, I can go a whole month or two without some yahoo rolling coal on me.

I've put on about 75,000 miles on my Teslas in Houston. Never seen any rolling coal. Maybe I drive differently than you?

 

[SO16]

It's not just panel gaps. Trim falling off, poor part reliability, terrible paint quality, software issues, lack of real blind spot monitoring/auto-wipers/auto-beams/self parking... There's way more than just a few mm here and there that don't line up.

Not to mention - who knows what the reliability of battery and drivetrain components will be on the 3/Y. Though the 3 was initially released in 2017, really sales didn't take off until 2018 and 2019. So, we are viewing the reliability, which was already rated as 3rd worst in the industry, of cars that average 1-2 years old. Do you think in 5 years these cars are still going to be sitting solid? It's doubtful.

If any one of these manufacturers can put out a fun to drive, less than $100k car that is made with a premium feel, Tesla is going to be in trouble that segment. Seems like Rivian is on track to put out their truck in June. I don't expect it to be perfect or error-free, but it will be interesting to hear reviews.

All that said, I think the refreshed Model S will tell us all we need to know about what they have learned over the past 10 years or so. Given it's an all new interior, there has been significant changes to the battery pack, and likely other unannounced changes....Have they fixed the door handle issues, are the parts on the interior durable and rattle-free? Software is software and it'll never be perfect. We will find out in a couple of weeks.

I think you will be disappointed with how robust Tesla sales will remain. Do you or have you owned a Tesla?

trim falling off? What....3 cases? Good grief. You sound like this hysterical media. Have you looked at any other manufacturers and their recalls?

Other manufacturers’ software is better? Uh hello...VW can’t even get their ID3 and 4 to work properly. Jaiguar IPace, slow and clunky.

Im rooting for Rivian too. More than one manufacturer can succeed. But one cannot judge based on early sales. Need to wait a few years to see how well those other vehicles do too.

 

[AjrUleZ]

I got my MS 2017 for 72K and now I post in Craigslist no ones buying for 40K so these cars are long time cars. Not buy and sell ones. I love my MS...!!

 

[SO16]

That is the problem with the Tesla experience. No one is happy with 13 service appointments and everyone is happy with 2 - say in the first 3 years.

Inconsistency.

Isn’t that true with anything? There will always be disgruntled people. Especially if they had a poor experience. Forums tend to skew negative.

 

[Tigers]

I think you will be disappointed with how robust Tesla sales will remain. Do you or have you owned a Tesla?

trim falling off? What....3 cases? Good grief. You sound like this hysterical media. Have you looked at any other manufacturers and their recalls?

Other manufacturers’ software is better? Uh hello...VW can’t even get their ID3 and 4 to work properly. Jaiguar IPace, slow and clunky.

Im rooting for Rivian too. More than one manufacturer can succeed. But one cannot judge based on early sales. Need to wait a few years to see how well those other vehicles do too.

No, I'm not going to be "disappointed" if Tesla continues to do well. What are you talking about?

"Trim falling off" - yes, off of my car specifically, twice.

"have you looked at other manufacturers?" - Well, I've only purchased two brand new cars - a Mazda 3 in 2015 that was totaled and a Tesla Model 3. My Mazda 3 had over 125,000 miles on it, zero maintenance other than oil changes and tires. Nothing ever broke on it. The interior was in fantastic shape as well.

For my Model 3? Well, again had to replace the trim (twice), had to replace a couple of sensors, a speaker (twice), it came with scratches down the front of the hood which I didnt see until i got home (rainy day on delivery). The backup camera would work 7/10 times. The bluetooth calling would work then break again. Didn't even have blind spot monitoring like my Mazda.

Did it drive/ride a of lot better than my Mazda? Absolutely. Is it a perfect car? Not even close. Is it an average car from a quality perspective? Not really. Right now, to buy a Tesla you are sacrificing a ton on quality and features, purely for an incredible drivetrain. And it is incredible, but there are sacrifices.

 

[SO16]

No, I'm not going to be "disappointed" if Tesla continues to do well. What are you talking about?

"Trim falling off" - yes, off of my car specifically, twice.

"have you looked at other manufacturers?" - Well, I've only purchased two brand new cars - a Mazda 3 in 2015 that was totaled and a Tesla Model 3. My Mazda 3 had over 125,000 miles on it, zero maintenance other than oil changes and tires. Nothing ever broke on it. The interior was in fantastic shape as well.

For my Model 3? Well, again had to replace the trim (twice), had to replace a couple of sensors, a speaker (twice), it came with scratches down the front of the hood which I didnt see until i got home (rainy day on delivery). The backup camera would work 7/10 times. The bluetooth calling would work then break again. Didn't even the blind spot monitoring my Mazda had.

Did it drive/ride a of lot better than my Mazda? Absolutely. Is it a perfect car? Not even close. Is it an average car from a quality perspective? Not really.

Well that’s too bad you had such a poor experience. Doesn’t appear to be the norm. If the problems you experienced were found by the majority of people, I doubt the ratings would be as high.

The Cars People Love Most - Consumer Reports

Consumer Reports' latest owner satisfaction survey reveals the cars people love most. Most and least satisfying cars are listed.

www.consumerreports.org

I don’t know of any “perfect” cars.

 

[Tigers]

Well that’s too bad you had such a poor experience. Doesn’t appear to be the norm.

The Cars People Love Most - Consumer Reports

Consumer Reports' latest owner satisfaction survey reveals the cars people love most. Most and least satisfying cars are listed.

www.consumerreports.org

Uhm, you're posting customer satisfaction scores, but we are talking about quality of the build. Pretty sure the data backs up my claims:

Tesla ranks last on influential JD Power quality survey

Tesla cars suffered 250 problems per 100 vehicles, well above industry average of 166.

www.theverge.com

JD Power says Lexus is most dependable auto brand, ranks Tesla 30th out of 33

J.D. Power studies serve as an industry benchmark, and its results can drive sales and impact insurance premiums for owners.

www.cnbc.com

Don't think my experience with build quality or dependability is rare at all. It's actually the norm.