Both the UMC and HPWC (Gen 3) now include DC fault protection internally, so don't need an external type B RCD.
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Ideal or Cost Effective Home Charging
- Thread starter joells101
- Start date
but there are parts of AS/NZ 3000 that only apply to New Zealand.Thanks I did post on nz forum too!You might be better off posting in the New Zealand forum for this type of question! But plenty of people here will say 15A socket plus UMC is plenty for overnight charging if you don’t do a lot of k’s every day. I think the need (or not) for Type B RCD depends on the appliance that is connected not the Amperage. Also NZ wiring rules might be subtly different to AUS.
Just thought AU NZ might share the same standard so checking here too.
NZ worksafe ev home charging recommendation did say under 20A with wall socket like 15A is ok but I got an electrician saying apart from 10A socket anything else needs a type B rcd... which I don't agree so checking with both Au and Nz peeps here.
Thanks
Section 7.9 of AS/NZS3000, which applies to New Zealand only, does seem to say that the only options for a residential installation of a facility for electric vehicle charging are:
- A final subcircuit of minimum 20A, supplying a single socket only, that must be protected by a Type B RCD, installed at least 80cm off the ground and to be used with a proper EVSE with a control pilot signal and Type 1 or Type 2 connector to the car.
- A final subcircuit of minimum 32A if single phase, supplying a single direct-connected EVSE only (as before with control pilot signal and standard connector) at least 80cm off the ground, with a minimum 32A isolating switch.
Hi cafz:
Thanks for the info but from ev charger use for residential standards
It says with an UMC you could connect to existing socket as long as its under 20AMPs and because the umc will stop power draw once charged plus there is no fixed charger installed there is no need for type b rccd.
This above understanding is also echoed by members on nz forum.
To be honest this is ridiculous that different people now having different reads of all these standards.....
The odd thing is that the SNZ PAS 6011:2021 document references superseded version AS/NZS 3000:2007 of the Wiring Rules - the requirements I mentioned above come from the updated AS/NZS 3000:2018. The EV charging rules were part of the 2018 update.
I'm not sure they're really in conflict anyway. The wiring rules talk about the requirements if a new installation is being added for charging - ie. if you ask for a new outlet for charging a car - whereas the 6011 document talks about using an existing outlet.
I'm not sure they're really in conflict anyway. The wiring rules talk about the requirements if a new installation is being added for charging - ie. if you ask for a new outlet for charging a car - whereas the 6011 document talks about using an existing outlet.
to actually know the rules and be able to interpret them!The other point ppl made is about tesla UMC has rcd in built and kind of like gen 3 wall connector which has rcd plus 6ma protection which doesn't need a type b rccd. Many nz retailers are selling wall chargers with the same setup also advertising as no type b rcd required.
I've just checked the updates to AS/NSZ3000:2018 and lo and behold, Amendment 1 issued in 2020 substantially updates section 7.9 (the New Zealand-specific EV charging section).
In the amended version, sockets installed for charging with a portable EVSE don't need a type B RCD anymore. This goes all the way up to a 3-phase 32A socket, if you want. Wired-in chargers still need the type B RCD or equivalent.
Amendment 1 is actually available for free because it's an amendment - you just need to register for a free account. It replaces the entire section 7.9, so you can actually read that whole section for free (it does of course rely on definitions and other sections within the larger standard, though).
thanks cafz for looking it up, wondering if then we could just put in a commando blue socket thats single phase 32A? obviously you need to pay for that blue adaptor as well for your tesla UMC.
although a 2nd thought would be single phase 32A would be really pushing your household single phase power supply limit, I think someone mentioned about 64A, and its over what recommend in the other document SNZ PAS 6011, about 20A limit.... all this means really if just single phase supply at best you could do with a 16A commando socket, plus the adaptor cost so I think 15A socket is the best way to go really if you are ok with about 100km per night charging speed at home.
I have single phase and 32A circuit which I use for charging (and a few other things like TIG welder).
I had my lead-in beefed up to 16mm2 recently.
I have a 64A CB main switch and a 80A fuse.
To test it, I ran 32A into my Zoe, plus two 6kW aircons and a couple of hot plates.
Total was around 58A while the Level 2 electrician monitored the meter box.
All cool and good and we were losing about 1volt pulling that load.
So, if you have a decent lead-in from the street and things are designed properly, I see no problem with a 32A outlet on its own circuit (C/B and RCD).
I've had the 32A for 4 years now without problem even though the old lead-in was 10mm2 so I took a bit more care then about how much load at the one time.
I had my lead-in beefed up to 16mm2 recently.
I have a 64A CB main switch and a 80A fuse.
To test it, I ran 32A into my Zoe, plus two 6kW aircons and a couple of hot plates.
Total was around 58A while the Level 2 electrician monitored the meter box.
All cool and good and we were losing about 1volt pulling that load.
So, if you have a decent lead-in from the street and things are designed properly, I see no problem with a 32A outlet on its own circuit (C/B and RCD).
I've had the 32A for 4 years now without problem even though the old lead-in was 10mm2 so I took a bit more care then about how much load at the one time.
Zoltrix77
Member
Just out of interest on the voltage drop of only 1v. Was the voltage measurement at the switchboard or at the end of each circuit?
Zoltrix77
Member
I've just had a good read of that section, talk about about several reads to get your head around it. I am an Australian electrician, so I don't have to worry about it, but the whole section seems weird to me.
7.9.3.1 REQUIRES! every new installation with garage a has to have a facility for vehicle charging? Seems like a weird thing to include in the wiring rules. I have always thought the standard in regards to electrical safety. I guess they are trying to stop bodgie EV charger connections, but I would have though this would be in a building requirements code. Sounds like having to provide electrical facilities for a pool or welder just in case. Perhaps it was a way of sneaking it through parliament?
7.9.3.2 (c) The socket outlet must be 800mm off the floor? Why? Is it that hard to plug it in below that? I can't see anything that calls for specifically labling it as for the purpose of EV charging, can't people bend over? Its like saying power points have to be 800mm off the ground/floor.
On this clause, in an existing installation, I don't see how it stops you installing a 10A or 15A socket that ends up being used for EV charging. I mean if you install a socket, and don't specifiy anywhere what its for, it doesn't have to be 20A right? Afterall, its a just a socket that you can plug anything into.
7.9.3.3 Requires a minimum current carrying capacity of 32A for Mode 3/4 (Hard wired) EVSE! But I read that the charger can be less than that, just that the cabling must be upto 32A. Seems again like a bit of green vehicle policy somehow being put into a electrical safety standard.
7.9.4 (Non domestic installations) Type B RCD required for everything except EVSE with a RDC-DD, I guess that includes sockets? As mentioned earlier could be mistaken for sockets for any old purpose, so unless you are somehow specifically identifying the sockets for EV usage, you can install them without a Type B RCD and say its for a merri-go-round.
Anyway, all seems a little strange. It would be a lot easier to just require EVSE's both portable and hard wired to include the RDC-DD in the first place in type approval going forward (Which appears to be becoming the case by default, if not by law).
Just my opinion!
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Nickdp
Member
EVchargers is "almost" same price as the overseas one for TOCA members when using the TOCA members discount - and you'd get shipping next day and that warm fuzzy feeling of supporting an Aussie business. (shameless plug for TOCA) 
But yeah - I suppose it depends on how quickly you want it....
But yeah - I suppose it depends on how quickly you want it....
Maximillan
Member
I do it manually by leaving the car plugged in and charging turned off in the Tesla app. If it looks sunny outside and I'm producing excess electricity on my solar, I start charging the car at around 14A by regulating it via the Tesla app.
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