Improving Supercharger Availability $0.40 idle fee

[pekap]

Folks are talking like they have no idea when the supercharger session will be over. Like the only clue you get is when the app notifies you that charging is all done. The app and the car tell you from the beginning when your charge will be finished. Plan your lunch or dinner to coincide with the end of the charge. No surprises. No one should be surprised when the app notifies them that charging is almost done - it's all according to the plan.
Quit the yapping about why you can't move the car, and go move the car

I feel you are missing the point. For example, you may be fully aware that your charge will take about 30 minutes. You walk ten minutes to grab dinner. You barely have time to order before you have to walk back to you car, which sits alone next to 7 empty stalls. This completely goes against the whole spirit of road tripping and being able to enjoy yourself while you charge. Perhaps most folks in California don't understand how very empty so many of the superchargers are across the United States at this point. This policy doesn't allow for people to use common sense and common courtesy. It's unnecessarily punitive for most and I feel this will backfire for Tesla.

 

[Az_Rael]

They need to fix their app on android so it actually sends notifications before they start this. The current version doesn't give any notifications for summon or charge start/end and multiple people have reported the same.

Yikes, can anyone else confirm this? I picked up my car today, so I haven't used the android app much, but if it's not giving notifications, that's not good. (Especially in light of this announcement)

 

[Shock-On-T]

While I support the idea, I think it could be implemented with more flexibility. For instance, the fee should only be invoked if a SC site is at least, say, 50% occupied. This will be frustrating in SC's where there are currently very rarely more than one Tesla and you're having dinner far from the chargers and have to get up half way through to move the car.

EDIT: @RK9090 - Was typing as you posted similar thoughts.

An option would be for Tesla to assign a tier to supercharger location.
So this would be the rule for a Tier 1 station, then have less punitive time restraints for Tier 2 stations.

This will also be awkward in situations where you are 60% and need to get to 90% to make your destination, and need about 30 min to charge. Too long to sit in the car but too short to go eat.

 

[Az_Rael]

Hmmm.... suddenly those slow superchargers in California might have the side bonus of letting you eat/shop/nap before your car is done. (I kid, I kid - stop throwing stuff at me!)


Overall, I am OK with this. I have seen the line at Burbank. I do feel for those in other less congested parts of the country, but CA is the precursor to what the Model 3 wave will look like. Tesla is just trying to get ahead of that wave.

 

[ElectricTundra]

An option would be for Tesla to assign a tier to supercharger location.
So this would be the rule for a Tier 1 station, then have less punitive time restraints for Tier 2 stations.

If this were 1985 then yes. It's 2016 and we have the data and technology to do this dynamically and even predictivily. Tesla can easily tell you when you stop to charge what the likelihood is that stalls will fill based on historical data and current Teslas within range and likely to need to charge.

While you are charging Tesla can tell you if the last space will be filled and you'll need to move when done charging or if you can finish your dinner first.

There is zero reason for anyone to have to get up in the middle of their dinner to go move their car when there are empty stalls. Or really even if all of the stalls are full but there are no Tesla's nearby likely needing to charge. This is the most bone-headed, ill thought out, customer unfriendly thing I've seen come out of Tesla.

 

[Shock-On-T]

I understand both the desire, and "fairness" you desire.
However, I think it will make the disincentive work less well, as well as create a headache of epic proportions.

Tesla will start hearing complaints similar to...
"But that never happened where I am from..." (for someone traveling into a SC area that is heavily used from a sparsely busy area)
'There was only one other car when I plugged in!"
"I never used to get charged at SC X..." (in events where a SC gets busier next year)

They need a straight forward rule, applied everywhere.
There is nothing worse than rules that require behavior situationally.
If you want to instill good habits, it must be consistent.

To reduce confusion you could have tiered SC locations.
ie. Supercharger "Metro" with different colour and branding with fees, and Supercharger "Standard" with no fees.
This would allow consistency to be maintained within each tier.

 

[mspohr]

It's the "I don't want to get beat up by Tesla owners" connection fee.

If you see a Tesla sitting unplugged occupying a space, you could just plug it in as a favor to the owner

 

[Shock-On-T]

Writing from Sydney Australia, my last trip stopped at the nearest SC in a country town called Goulburn, which has 8 stalls. I've never seen another Tesla there.
I had to meet a colleague there who had driven up from Canberra, and we had lunch while my car charged so I could make the return trip to Sydney. I needed to charge from 40% to about 90%.
It finished charging about 15 minutes before we finished lunch at the soldiers club 5 minutes walk away.
It would have been awkward to leave lunch when charging finished, so I hope Tesla can find a more nuanced way to implement this change.

 

[mspohr]

Yikes, can anyone else confirm this? I picked up my car today, so I haven't used the android app much, but if it's not giving notifications, that's not good. (Especially in light of this announcement)

Notifications always work on my Android phone

 

[K-MTG]

How about the app shows how many spaces are available? And why not have it only charge with all of the other spaces are full?

 

[Shock-On-T]

Can some please answer if I start climate (for example the sleeping in the car example) wouldn't you be losing charge and have to "recharge"? Or burn a lot of heat once I get the fully charged notification if my power will go down enough to give me more time?

No, it's much too small a power drain to drop the car a percent within 5 minutes.
My rough rule of thumb for air conditioning on a sunny day is about 1% per hour of battery use.

 

[Screwbal]

Notifications always work on my Android phone

Funny thing I got a charge complete notification on my phone tonight finally. Had been working then died for a week but back I guess now.

 

[Shock-On-T]

Unplug after the warnings and car still sitting there? Don't be daft, Tesla knows where the car is and if it has been moved... you get billed anyway.

Next step is any Tesla sitting in SC spot, for any length of time NOT charging, gets charged the idle fee per minute.

They don't know the location to that level of precision. Could be a nearby non-SC spot.

 

[Shock-On-T]

If this were 1985 then yes. It's 2016 and we have the data and technology to do this dynamically and even predictivily. Tesla can easily tell you when you stop to charge what the likelihood is that stalls will fill based on historical data and current Teslas within range and likely to need to charge.

While you are charging Tesla can tell you if the last space will be filled and you'll need to move when done charging or if you can finish your dinner first.

There is zero reason for anyone to have to get up in the middle of their dinner to go move their car when there are empty stalls. Or really even if all of the stalls are full but there are no Tesla's nearby likely needing to charge. This is the most bone-headed, ill thought out, customer unfriendly thing I've seen come out of Tesla.

my 20 year coding experience would take offence if I didn't largely agree with your point.
The reason I like a fixed tier of SC locations is that the user knows where they stand as soon as they arrive, rather than get a rude shock if a previously desolated SC suddenly fills up while they're in the middle of something (or someone, to quote the great Kinky Friedman).

 

[jbcarioca]

I really don't understand why you would only get 5 minutes grace period to get to your car. I've charged on road trips a bunch of times and always try to time those stops with a meal. Most superchargers (in the southeast at least) aren't in very convient areas so you usually need to walk 5-15 minutes to get anywhere decent. That harldy leaves time to walk to a restaurant and back never mind actually eating and paying. One of their big selling points was that you could grab a meal or shop or something while your car charged, but you can't even do that with this system. Seems to me that fees should only rack up after an hour and even then only when the charger is full.

Many of the ones around here are also located at hotels and this is presumably on purpose yet if you get in late you can't plug in there because you will definitely get hit with a fee if you go to sleep. This seems dumb as there aren't going to be more cars showing up in the middle of the night. Fees should probably just be in place for certain hours like between 9a and 11p or something like that.

Also, I've never been to a charger that had more than 2 other cars and I'm almost always the only car there. I've seen just as many spots ICE'd as other Teslas and of course this won't help that at all.

The whole comparison to a gas station seems absurd, how can you compare less than a minute to 45 minutes / over an hour. Seems like Tesla wants you to just sit in your car and wait around? Or maybe take a walk, but not more than 5 minutes away. Get something to eat if you want but it has to be fast food. Or just add another hour for every couple hundred miles you drive where you just sit in the car.

I left my car overnight in Santee, SC once. Nobody was there when I arrived and nobody else was there when I left. Today there are places like that all over the world, ones that are very busy at peak times and nearly abondoned at other times. Somehow I think it is better for Tesla and Tesla drivers to have a simple plan, just as they have decided, so that they will not have endless arguments about whether some peak pricing or another is fair. The minor inconvenience for some of us is far less onerous than facing a Supercharger Teslaed with a non-charger.

 

[James Anders]

5 minutes is just too short of time. Should be 15 minutes.

 

[zambono]

Great idea!

Of course, there is going to be at least one person who will claim to have "not seen this news" and will make a big fuss when they get a $150 bill from Tesla that they did not know about. Cue masses of mainstream news articles.

On the upside. Approx every 1000 cars left "parked" overnight equals enough revenue for the build cost of a new supercharger site!

Fixed with an update to vehicle that only allows supercharging if you agree to new terms

 

[mspohr]

5 minutes is just too short of time. Should be 15 minutes.

You do get a "charging almost complete" message 10 or 15 minutes before charging is finished. Another 5 minutes grace period should be plenty of warning.
It's not a parking spot.

 

[robby]

How about the app shows how many spaces are available? And why not have it only charge with all of the other spaces are full?

Because by then it's too late, and a single ICEd spot would break that whole system.

 

[K-MTG]

Because by then it's too late, and a single ICEd spot would break that whole system.

Maybe a metal detector to see if the spot is ICED