Jebinc’s Plaid Vibration Experiment Results!!!

[n2mb_racing]

I scheduled a service appointment. But, after a bit of online dialog with the service center, it was clear that they did not know anything about it. I canceled and told them I would wait to see if a software update would come soon that might address it. I am convinced that there is no way it its just my vehicle. Others must be experiencing the problem, and a software change to address the rebound damping must surely be coming. Traditional car makers would laugh at how this was allowed to get into production.....but they are not moving at the speed of Tesla!

Ship first, fix it later? They really should do some testing first.

 

[lbowroom]

I scheduled a service appointment. But, after a bit of online dialog with the service center, it was clear that they did not know anything about it. I canceled and told them I would wait to see if a software update would come soon that might address it. I am convinced that there is no way it its just my vehicle. Others must be experiencing the problem, and a software change to address the rebound damping must surely be coming. Traditional car makers would laugh at how this was allowed to get into production.....but they are not moving at the speed of Tesla!

I'm sorry to say this, but the screen shot that you present from the car suspension trace doesn't indicate the ringing (lack of damping) that you describe. I don't think it has the resolution to do that or what you are experiencing isn't what you think it is. I haven't noticed any lack of damping when hitting lane dots in my car which is why I asked if you've taken it in to service for a possible faulty damper.

 

[n2mb_racing]

I'm sorry to say this, but the screen shot that you present from the car suspension trace doesn't indicate the ringing (lack of damping) that you describe. I don't think it has the resolution to do that or what you are experiencing isn't what you think it is. I haven't noticed any lack of damping when hitting lane dots in my car which is why I asked if you've taken it in to service for a possible faulty damper.

There's a separate thread on this issue. That's why I was driving a '22 LR model S. He had the same issue with no damping on his suspension. I'm not really sure what could be the cause. Either the active suspension isn't working on some cars, or the software isn't tuned right? On my car, the suspension works, though.

 

[lbowroom]

There's a separate thread on this issue. That's why I was driving a '22 LR model S. He had the same issue with no damping on his suspension. I'm not really sure what could be the cause. Either the active suspension isn't working on some cars, or the software isn't tuned right? On my car, the suspension works, though.

Right, so if it’s clear there’s no damping then service is the right approach to take. Likely a bad component. I just wouldn’t use that picture as evidence, it doesn’t show anything.

 

[Ed Hart]

There's a separate thread on this issue. That's why I was driving a '22 LR model S. He had the same issue with no damping on his suspension. I'm not really sure what could be the cause. Either the active suspension isn't working on some cars, or the software isn't tuned right? On my car, the suspension works, though.

Can you please direct me to that other thread.
I agree that there is probably not enough resolution in the display of wheel ringing motion. However, notice that three wheels show a mirror image rebound while the left front - the wheel intentionally activated - is NOT a mirror image.
Added information: The right front does exactly the same thing....which leads me to believe the problem is systemic.
Does anyone think a video of wheel motion would show this?

 

[n2mb_racing]

Can you please direct me to that other thread.
I agree that there is probably not enough resolution in the display of wheel ringing motion. However, notice that three wheels show a mirror image rebound while the left front - the wheel intentionally activated - is NOT a mirror image.
Added information: The right front does exactly the same thing....which leads me to believe the problem is systemic.
Does anyone think a video of wheel motion would show this?

There's a few threads like this:

Show of hands… Adaptive Suspension

How many new Model S owners out there can actually FEEL the difference between “Sport” and “Comfort “? I know I can’t.… even though Tesla Service says it is functioning normally. No matter what I do with the suspension controls, my ride is the same… punishingly harsh. Yet, from these forums...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[SCharged]

Gents, I don't own a plaid but It's unfortunate the plaid has vibration issues. I can relate to the frustration and added stress this causes. It reminds me of the days of owning a BMW 7 series with excessive vibration in the seats and steering wheel. Owners like myself replaced engine/transmission mounts and mounts along the driveshaft. There was a center mount on the driveshaft that was notorious for failing This worked for most cases. I know Teslas may not have the same mounts but has anyone inspected any of the mounts?

Anyway, I'll scour Bimmerfest.com to see if there is anything useful to consider.

Speaking of things that could cause some.vibration, I saw a video the other day from i1Tesla, adding a brace for the brake cylinder, probably not helpful but anything relating to vibration at this point, right? Here's the link.

Hang in there!

 

[sorka]

@sorka As I said, I have an invoice that says this. Car does not qualify for lemon law as it doesn't meet the threshold. Only two repair attempts and less than 30 days. Repair clock was stopped once they deemed the vibration as normal.

Can you post the invoice that claims the vibration is normal with whatever personal info redactions are needed?

 

[Donsla MS]

Can you post the invoice that claims the vibration is normal with whatever personal info redactions are needed?

Yes! Then mail a copy to Elon. Wonder if he even knows about it..

 

[sorka]

Yes! Then mail a copy to Elon. Wonder if he even knows about it..

And copies to teslarati and the other major EV pubs.

 

[HighPotential]

This morning heading down slight hill, hit about 35mph-38mph and could hear and feel it (very slight). I then made a wide, half turn and continued down the gentle hill and hit 35-38 mph and nothing. The only difference was the two surfaces. The second was hard, smooth "white" concrete. The first was some kind of common pea-gravel concrete (not asphalt). Just FYI.

 

[jebinc]

Can you post the invoice that claims the vibration is normal with whatever personal info redactions are needed?

Yes, will do. Invoice and email.

 

[Meltdow]

I have a slight vibration around 45. My wife happened to put the suspension in comfort mode, I usually have it in automatic, and it seems to help with the vibration. Is that just because it's compensating or could that mean something?

 

[jebinc]

Good morning, all! We need some more folks with the vibration to confirm lowering improvement and track mode hack mentioned above. Please step up and help Tesla determine root cause and fix!

I’m really surprised there are not a lot more people jumping on the vibration concern bandwagon - or interested in the testing thread. This leads me to think more and more that “in production” cars today no longer have the problem. And, many of the early complainers already sold or have already traded the car. Did Tesla just abandon us early adopters with bad DU's/Inverters/Shafts? There's just not much activity on this across all social media platforms these days. Mid/late last year, there was a lot of chatter about this. Now, not so much...

Thoughts?

@WilliamG @EndlessPlaid @lbowroom @N2itive @GroovaEV @uthatcher @impastu @n2mb_racing

Bump

 

[lbowroom]

Bump

What's your current state?

 

[jebinc]

What's your current state?

Running lowing links in the front to reduce vibration. Tolerable now, but not gone.

 

[n2mb_racing]

Running lowing links in the front to reduce vibration. Tolerable now, but not gone.

Did you take them off the rear? Mine is similar, but I think I'm going to have to remove mine before the next service because my suspension is squeaking....

 

[CLPMiami]

Good morning, all! We need some more folks with the vibration to confirm lowering improvement and track mode hack mentioned above. Please step up and help Tesla determine root cause and fix!

I’m really surprised there are not a lot more people jumping on the vibration concern bandwagon - or interested in the testing thread. This leads me to think more and more that “in production” cars today no longer have the problem. And, many of the early complainers already sold or have already traded the car. Did Tesla just abandon us early adopters with bad DU's/Inverters/Shafts? There's just not much activity on this across all social media platforms these days. Mid/late last year, there was a lot of chatter about this. Now, not so much...

Thoughts?

@WilliamG @EndlessPlaid @lbowroom @N2itive @GroovaEV @uthatcher @impastu @n2mb_racing

I tried the track mode hack, and it reduced the vibration about 80% I would estimate. I have not tried lowering links. I am not a Twitter user but that seems to be a great platform to keep poking Tesla about this ridiculous design flaw in their flagship model since Elon seems to live on Twitter. Also, it would be an interesting experiment of the "new" censorship free Twitter! "Hi @Elon can you fix your new vibrating Model S please????"

 

[jebinc]

I tried the track mode hack, and it reduced the vibration about 80% I would estimate. I have not tried lowering links. I am not a Twitter user but that seems to be a great platform to keep poking Tesla about this ridiculous design flaw in their flagship model since Elon seems to live on Twitter. Also, it would be an interesting experiment of the "new" censorship free Twitter! "Hi @Elon can you fix your new vibrating Model S please????"

Believe me, I’ve tweeted a lot on this and even got DriveTesla to publish and article in January. Nothing.

 

[WhitePlaid]

First, please refer to the thread below for detail information about this affliction, as that will not be discussed in this thread.

"Refreshed" Model S model VIBRATION tracking and information thread!!!

This thread aims to capture sub model (dual and trim motor) vibration occurrences for "refreshed" Model S cars. Please comment with as much information you can, should your car have this affliction (including VIN range). Issue Description: Vibration felt in accelerator pedal and sometime in...

teslamotorsclub.com

Second, I’m not recommending any action on your part or any products, nor am I making any pronouncements, representations or providing a definitive conclusion – Just sharing my experience; yours may be different (or it may not)…

tl;dr - As you may recall, I recently installed new 19” Signature SV104’s wheels (all stock sizes and offsets), new “road force balanced” Pirelli PZero To Elect tires (stock), Titanium lugs, and N2itive RXS-2 Plaid adjustable lowering links and my vibrating Plaid is nearly vibration free, after three days of testing!!!
Note: My Plaid is/was the poster child for vibration in the yoke, pedal, floor and console.


The Details

Prior to the first drive, using the adjustable lowering links (purchased for this experiment as a Tesla provided solution doesn’t appear on the horizon any time soon), I dropped the car a tad more than ½” all around and detailed it for good luck and karma….

After a day of driving, I noticed no vibration and decided to really look to replicate it, post mod. Ambient outdoor testing temperatures over the past three days of testing as ranged from 38 – 43 degrees, so my new summer tires were fairly “hard”.

Yesterday (Day 2), I drove it several times trying to get it to vibrate on the low setting (1/2” drop from stock low setting) and on a few occasions (only in the mid 40’s MPH range) I thought I heard/felt the slightest vibration – so I raised the suspension to medium (which results in a height slightly lower than stock low) and was able to feel it slightly more on occasions – but still way way less than prior to all of these changes.

I used to get the vibration at various speeds, including highway speeds. So far, not even a slight vibration at highway speeds. Note: Most of my testing was not on the highway, so more testing needed.


My current thinking (subject to change with more testing):

1. Some claim not to have the vibration and others do. I’m thinking those who may launched their cars numerous times on settings other than low, might have done more damage to the half shafts/CV joints than those that always launched on low and/or with Cheetah stance enabled. In Cheetah mode, the front really drops down, reducing half shaft-CV joint angles…

2. Something is not right/damaged on my car, so it might not be possible at this point to eliminate the slightest vibration 100%, 100% of the time.


A Mechanical Engineering Perspective (See my attached diagram/aid):

I think the following are facts:

1. Basic front DU placement/design is vintage ~2013 – a front DU was added to the Model S later, whereas in the subsequent models (3/Y) a front DU was “designed in” from the start…

2. Model S front half shafts are different lengths (Asymmetric design), due to DU not being “centered” and high

3. The shorter shaft (Left/Driver’s side, I think) angles are sharper than the right, resulting in more stress and binding at the CV joints and the other front shaft.

4. Lowering the car reduces these angles, and results in reduced CV joint and shaft stress.

What we don’t know is if lowing the car “X” amount will prevent or permanently eliminate this issue. Ideally, Tesla would redesign the front DU mount to it is lower, more like the rear DU placement, resulting in less binding and damage from hard acceleration.


So, what might Tesla do if this is real, save for not redesign the front chassis and DU placement?

1. Via firmware update, change the air suspension heights so the car is lower
2. Limit power, if suspension setting is anything other than Low
3. Limit dead stop launch power if not in Cheetah mode

This story is not finished, more to come!!!

Next Steps: I plan to drop the front of the car to .7” (Setting 5 on the links) and retest in the coming days. Will then return it to stock height upon conclusion of the experiement.

Your thoughts?

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@WilliamG @EndlessPlaid @lbowroom @N2itive @SignatureSales @GroovaEV @uthatcher

It can't be damage from launching. I've never launched my Plaid and I've had the vibration, or reconginition of the vibration, since just under 1000 odometer miles.