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Letter To Elon Musk Regarding P85D Horsepower – Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Andyw2100
- Start date
Krugerrand
Meow
The P85D takes 3.7 seconds 0-62 without a 1 ft rollout. The same logged run shows 3.1 seconds 0-60 with the 1 ft rollout.
There is no way Merc SLS Electric can put out 750 hp at the motor shafts. The 750hp is the rating of the 4-motor drivetrain similar to Tesla's rating of the two-motor drivetrain in P85D. The 60kWh battery will not be able to put out enough kW to support 750 hp at the motor shafts at the point in time at which motors can use it. It is exactly the same "problem" as with Tesla P85D. You would be all over MB if you'd purchased MB SLS electric.
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stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I have always questioned the SLS E-cell numbers. There is very little instrumented magazine testing of the car. Does anyone know the 1/4 mile and 0-100mph of this car? It was easy to find for the P85D but no luck to the SLS E-cell. The 0-60 is not impressive for the car of such a power spec.
Also it doesn't appear anyone has done a dyno run with the car. It would be curious to see if there will be the same dyno issues as with the P85D.
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
Come on people..... Let's not get lost in discussing discharge rates of batteries for which we have little or no insight. In MB's case, it's vaporware of which we will not be able to get our hands on meaningful data. In Tesla's case, we are relying on data logs which can be made to say absolutely anything Tesla wants.
The only thing that matters are real world performance numbers that are repeatable by anyone that buys the car. This is why I find the McLaren F1 comparison so laughable. I've got a newer Mac with launch control and it is nowhere as repeatable as my PD launch to launch. I can not fathom what an F1 launch would look like in the hands of mere owners let alone try to compare three or four launches.
The PD out performs the MB at lower speeds based on published numbers so the Tesla system is providing more energy (battery power output integrated over time) up to 60 mph? 100 mph???? The MB likely provides more power at higher speeds and absolutely provides more power over a lap of the N. loop if the times are believable/reproducible (I assume they are).
At least the Electric SLS versus PD comparison makes a lot more sense to me than trying to compare the MS to an ICE on a published HP basis.
The only thing that matters are real world performance numbers that are repeatable by anyone that buys the car. This is why I find the McLaren F1 comparison so laughable. I've got a newer Mac with launch control and it is nowhere as repeatable as my PD launch to launch. I can not fathom what an F1 launch would look like in the hands of mere owners let alone try to compare three or four launches.
The PD out performs the MB at lower speeds based on published numbers so the Tesla system is providing more energy (battery power output integrated over time) up to 60 mph? 100 mph???? The MB likely provides more power at higher speeds and absolutely provides more power over a lap of the N. loop if the times are believable/reproducible (I assume they are).
At least the Electric SLS versus PD comparison makes a lot more sense to me than trying to compare the MS to an ICE on a published HP basis.
Completely and in this regard Tesla has the market sewn up. Pretty much anyone can jump in the car mash the pedal and smoke most cars.
Maybe the 911 Turbo S (when using Launch) can get close, though I don't know, more of a GT3 man myself (If I was forced into buying a VW Group product that is
)Saying that, I also feel the angst over the owners that upgraded from the P85, I bet they too smoked every other car day to day. For them this was a car turned up to 10.5, not the 11 they were expecting
What's wrong with 10C? In the RC world we regularly use batteries that can sustain 50C or more. We don't know the chemistry of the cells Mercedes is using, they may well be able to sustain 10C.
The battery life span will be very short, it will not last stated MB design life of 10 years. For comparison, at 550 hp (410kW), Tesla 85kWh battery limited to discharge rate of approximately 4.83C.
I have two questions as well.
What do you think MB means by "electric load potential" 600kW?
MB specify 4648lbs weight, 750 motor hp, 3.9s 0 to 100km/h. Tesla P85D at introduction specified 4950lbs, 691 motor hp, 3.4s (3.7s adjusted for rollout) 0 to 100km/h. If MB specified motor hp is indeed equal to the output hp at the motor shafts, and its weight is 300lbs less than P85D how in a world is it possible that it accelerates 0.2 seconds slower, while having 59 motor hp more than P85D?
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lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
2 possibilities:
A) MB advertised the wrong HP like Tesla
B) The SLS is geared toward mid-high speed acceleration while P85D is geared toward 0-60.
Or the third one: MB advertised exactly in the same way as Tesla (so the easy answer - look, it can be done - is not a good one) *and* there is nothing wrong or misleading with the way of how EV manufacturers show their specifications. After all this is just a proof of what unhappy P85D owners were told for some time now: neither hp nor hp per lb of car weight are accurate determinants of performance (acceleration) to begin with, even when comparing EV to EV, forget about EV to ICE comparison. The only accurate measure of the performance is the acceleration time (the same point was made in JB's Blog).
So people got everything they paid for (and then some - the $140K family car beats $500K sports two seater) and there was no conspiracy whatsoever. There was misunderstanding of the specifications, which is not surprising for a new technology at all.
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A misunderstanding that Tesla anticipated, started to do something about it to prevent it, and then decided not to. That sounds like there may be some conspiracy involved after all.
Conspiracy to let the confusing information remain in place and keep confusing potential customers, to increase sales. The explanation they were working on would have prevented that.
You are grasping at straws.
If they conspired to increase sales by publishing confusing specifications, the last thing they want is to blow the cover by telling David Nolan one week after reveal, before any cars even started being made, exactly what these specifications mean.
This just does not make any sense.
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