Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
I just learned that Mt Kisco --WILL-- be performing the Ludicrous upgrades, and that customers who are early on their list (not me) have been informed that they should be starting soon.
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Ludicrous Upgrade Scheduling?
- Thread starter tstafford
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
Are you doing the upgrade Andy?
I think I've pretty much decided not to. I'll put that $5k toward the next new one (which is not soon)
Mike
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
Are you doing the upgrade Andy?
I think I've pretty much decided not to. I'll put that $5k toward the next new one (which is not soon)
I did decide to go ahead and do it. I paid my $500 deposit on the Tesla website a couple of days before January 17, because I feared Tesla would cut off the $5000 update offer on January 17th. I'm glad they didn't, but still think they may at any time. (So in my opinion anyone on the fence may have Tesla knock them right off that fence at any moment!)
Some of the reports from those who upgraded early were pretty compelling. I was most impressed by the power increase at lower SOCs. (Take a look at some of Sorka's numbers.)
My thinking is that while I may never really notice or need the extra power the way my wife and I drive, having the better fuse and contactors is definitely worth something to me. There may be updates coming down the road that improve Ludicrous performance even more, and I know I'd regret not having upgraded if that were to happen. I don't have plans to sell the car any time soon, but I have to think that whenever I do sell the car at least some portion of the $5000 I spend now will be returned to me in the increased proceeds I receive for the car at that time.
So as much as I think I shouldn't have to pay for this, and that Tesla should be providing the Ludicrous upgrade to the earliest P85D buyers like us at no charge, I made the decision to just bite the bullet and go ahead with the upgrade.
MarcG
Active Member
I had the same thought process, with the added idea that upgrading my battery to a larger capacity at some point in the future will likely provide even further performance gains.
Just hear (read) me out for a minute or two:
1) Tesla has stated that an upgraded P85D will not perform the same as a P90D from the factory, albeit with a smaller differential than P85D vs P85D
2) Tesla has improved the insane mode in non-upgraded P85Ds in the past, and there are indications that Ludicrous is not as Ludicrous as it could be (yet)
3) Tesla has confirmed that a P85D upgraded to Ludicrous AND the 90kWh pack, effectively becoming a P90D, will perform the same as a P90D from the factory
4) Tesla has confirmed that Ludicrous upgrades will be retained if one chooses to upgrade to Ludicrous only now, but then upgrade to a larger battery pack later
5) I'm assuming that with a larger battery pack, say 95kWh, there is higher voltage at high SoC than smaller battery packs, so more power will likely be made available with larger packs
With these 5 points, my thinking is that if I decide to upgrade to a larger battery capacity later, I will be glad to have upgraded to Ludicrous now.
Even if ALL larger battery packs in the future have the better hardware capable of pushing more power to the motors (similar to the theory that all 90kWh packs have the upgraded parts, but Ludicrous is just controlled by a software setting), having the Ludicrous upgrade now guarantees that said software setting is retained in future, larger packs.
And having paid $5,000 for it instead of $10,000 makes me feel even better :biggrin:
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siucity
Button Pusher
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
I agree with most of your logic. I think in all likelihood, things will play out as you expect.
That being said, the potential problem for your plans does exist if Tesla winds up offering larger batteries that don't come standard with the improved Ludicrous hardware, for one reason or another. While it's unlikely that they would go back to the older fuses and contactors, it's not inconceivable. But another possibility would be that they come up with some new "Super Ludicrous" or "Just F-ing Ridiculous" mode, and that mode costs $15,000 instead of $10,000 to upgrade to, and all the new batteries come with that hardware, and for some reason Ludicrous mode is "not compatible" with that hardware.
One would hope in a situation like that some credit would be given for the fact that you already paid for the Ludicrous upgrade and hardware, but we're talking about Tesla, so nothing is a given.
All that said, I do think it is likely you will be able to upgrade your pack and keep your Ludicrous mode.
MarcG
Active Member
I have an email from Tesla confirming that the Ludicrous upgrade is retained when upgrading later to a larger battery pack, so I'm confident they will hold to that word and not make us pay for Ludicrous again (that would be ludicrous!)
And while it isn't 100% guaranteed that all future battery packs will retain the upgraded contractors and fuses that can handle 1500 Amps, I would be very surprised if they don't have at least a subset of the new packs beyond 90 kWh with support for at least 1500A.
Also, if you recall the language around how they came about offering Ludicrous, it was something to the effect of "as we were researching a way to improve the longevity of our drivetrain, we found a way to also increase the maximum power that the packs can deliver" (total paraphrase, I can look for the actual text later).
So my thinking is that their strategy is continue with upgraded hardware on all packs so that they can achieve longer life, while using its byproduct in power delivery improvements as a revenue generator via Ludicrous.
Perhaps, but based on what Elon stated (again paraphrasing): "there's only one speed beyond ludicrous, and that (maximum plaid) will be reserved for our next-gen roadster in 4 years", I doubt they'll want to invest too much R&D in creating a beyond-Ludicrous mode for Model S & X.
That would also contradict the statement regarding Max Plaid, which would be a bad PR move -- not that they've never done that before.
Anyway, even if there was such a thing as Hyper Ludicrous or whatever it may be called, I would be fine with keeping Ludicrous in a larger battery pack. My money is on a slight improvement to Ludicrous thanks to higher voltage and lower impedance with the next-gen packs.
Point being overall, I peronsally value the upgrade now and think it will be good for the future as well. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, of course!
Dammit, people - stop being so deliberate and thoughtful. Ludicrous is cool and you can go faster. You already spent $100k+ - what's an additional 3%-4% increase in the grand scheme of things? Nobody bought this car because it was a rational economic investment. I don't know why we'd starting thinking that way now.
Or don't do it. Fewer upgrades means added cache for the P85Ds that were.
Or don't do it. Fewer upgrades means added cache for the P85Ds that were.
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
I think now that you mention it, I do recall you or possibly someone else saying that Tesla had made that promise. So yes--my first concern about losing the upgrade because new larger packs don't contain at least the Ludicrous hardware is unfounded.
And as I said, I really think all your logic is correct. I was just throwing out the two, now down to one, possibility. And I agree that even that one isn't very likely.
Are you doing the upgrade Andy?
I think I've pretty much decided not to. I'll put that $5k toward the next new one (which is not soon)
Mike
Me too (pretty much). Looking at having this car a few years then upgrade to whatever is next (from whomever). For me, P85D to L (or even P90DL) is too little an impact per $. Might feel different if I got the "top (performance) model" status back and I believed it would persist. But I just don't do that many 50-100 mph runs ... Even fewer of these than 0-XX launches.
As for optionality ("super ludicrous"), I'm tired of paying for tesla vaporware (or even worse for speculations not from the company). As for resale, I see $5000 more in depreciation to suffer, as (IMO) the next significant performance jump will be much cheaper in a new platform than from incremental improvement/investment in a now 4 year old basic design.
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whitex
Well-Known Member
Did that email say anywhere that the higher capacity upgrade will cost the same as for vehicles without Ludicrous? It doesn't sound like your email excludes the possibility of something like "$20K for P85D upgrade to 120KWhr, $30K for P85DL upgrade to 120KWhr". Tesla has been known to pick on much smaller semantics (remember your car's 691hp spec?).
I got home this afternoon and a message from my service center in Rocklin, CA stated they had the parts for the upgrade and I needed to make an appointment by tomorrow or lose my place in line. They also said it would take the whole day and would not provide a loaner. I called and am scheduled for the update on Friday of next week. I guess I will take a book and spend my time reading. If they don't finish that day I wonder if I can spend the night?
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Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
And by "too many" I think you could safely actually substitute "any." As far as I know, there haven't been any reports of cars having the upgrade completed in a day.
So rays427--yeah, better bring the pajamas!
whitex
Well-Known Member
The one which shows up with lower SoC will get done first! ;-)
The other one will be sitting in the shop with heat set to HI (according to those who were snooping on their cars via the phone app while the car was getting the Luda upgrade).
Commasign,
I just talked to the Rocklin service center and they have not done any upgrades yet. It's possible our cars will be the first to be upgraded at this service center. Based on this and two cars being upgraded on the same day it seems likely that it will take more than one day. Since my wife want's to hit Costco we now plan on driving two cars into Rocklin and drop the Tesla off on Thursday so we won't have to get up so early on Friday. We will head back home to Penn Valley and return to pick up the care whenever it's ready.
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