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Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 vs Pilot Super Sport - Opinions Please

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by Dreamin, Aug 31, 2013.

  1. Dreamin

    Dreamin Member

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    I'm going to dump my Goodyears and go with one of these two in a 255/45/19 (neither comes in a 245/45/19).

    Does anyone have experience with both? I've owned the PS2 and the Pilot Sport Cup (R-compound), but not the Super Sport. Is the Super Sport supposed to be a more aggressive / stickier tire?

    The Michelin marketing machine would have you believe the Super Sport is superior to the PS2 in every way - better handling, longer life, more comfortable...which would seem to defy the laws of physics!

    Thoughts?
     
  2. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    Generally what that means is that they have developed a new compound and/or construction method. It's actually common for newer tires to beat older tires in most or all categories.

    However, if I were to install these tires I would also get different wheels because the 8.0 inch rim width is the lowest possible acceptable rim width. This means that you won't damage the tires using 8.0" rim width but you likely won't get optimum performance either. I'd go for 9.0" wheels. Worst case would be that they wouldn't perform as well (on the OE wheels) as the Pilot Sport 3 in the OE size. (Note: no actual experience on either so I don't know if they will perform as a worst case, just something to consider before you spend the money.)

    Also note that the wider tire will reduce range and increase susceptibility to hydroplaning.
     
  3. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Can you elaborate on this? Thanks.
     
  4. Dreamin

    Dreamin Member

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    Great point. I always try to get tires on the higher end of the wheel width range vs. lower end. But I understand that the PS3 sacrifices dry performance for better wet performance - and being in SoCal:it's always 72deg and never rains!

    The only other summer performance tire on my list would be the Bridgestone SO4 in OE size... vs PS2/PSS 255 on an undersized wheel...
     
  5. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    Hydroplaning happens when the pressure in the wedge of water that builds up in front of the tire equals or exceeds the tire inflation pressure. The wider the tire--strictly speaking the wider the tread width of the tire--the more water will accumulate in front of the tire and the quicker tire pressure will build up. Tread depth, tread compound, and tread pattern can help but only so much.

    If your tire has a tread width of 200 mm and the water depth is 2 mm, the water displacement is 0.4 m[SUP]3[/SUP] every kilometer per tire (200*2*1000). if you're traveling 100 km/h, each tire has to displace 0.4 m[SUP]3[/SUP] per second (400 Litres or ~106 US gal). (It's convenient that 1 m[SUP]3[/SUP] of water weighs ~1000 kg and a litre of water weighs ~1 kg).
     
  6. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Thanks, jerry.
     
  7. jandkw

    jandkw Member

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    @Dreamin, take a look at the michelin pilot sport a/s 3. This came out earlier in June this year and has great reviews by the testers. Although this is an A/S tire but it beats some of the competitors' summer performance tires. Just search for the review and there are plenty of them. I plan to replace these tires when my Goodyears reach more miles.
     
  8. simplesolar

    simplesolar Member

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    I believe pilot super sport is the replacement for pilot sport 2. It is stickier, lasts longer, and cheaper. Can't go wrong.
     
  9. dennis

    dennis P85D

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    So why is Tesla delivering the P85+ with PS2's instead of Super Sports?
     
  10. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    #10 brianman, Sep 1, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2013
    Michelin Pilot Super Sport Tire Review RoadandTrack.com - Road & Track
    December 10, 2010


    http://www.motortrend.com/features/performance/1101_testing_the_michelin_pilot_super_sport/viewall.html
    February 07, 2011

    Model S Specs | Tesla Motors
    OEM tires @ TireRack for Tesla Model S Perf 2012:
    OEM tires @ TireRack for Tesla Model S Perf+ 2013 (Rear):

    http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Super+Sport
    245/45ZR19 not present
    245/35ZR21 not present
    265/35ZR21 not present

    I suspect this is your answer, dennis. Michelin doesn't offer Pilot Super Sport in Model S sizes(yet?) -- or at least not without special order or somesuch.


    Kind of sucks because after reading the gushing in the links above, I'm an interested buyer.
     
  11. Dreamin

    Dreamin Member

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    Great information. Thanks brianman.

    LOL. Michelin has a rebate on these tires right now...
     
  12. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Wound, meet salt.
     
  13. mnx

    mnx 2013 P85

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    255/40/19 have a wider tread than the 255/45/19 in the PSS according to the specs on tirerack. I think I'm going to get them in that size when my Goodyear's are finished. I would consider stock size in the bridgestone S04 but they are quite a bit heavier tire...
     
  14. gtimbers

    gtimbers Member

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    Look at the Pilot A/S 3. I just got a set (245-45x19) and they kick butt on both the Goodyears (which is easy) and they also easily take the 21" Continentals apart. It is my understanding that they can outperform the PS2's but not the newest Pilot Sports. I have never experienced an All Season that turns, handles and brakes like these tires do. Simply transforms the Tesla into a mean machine. The energy consumption is slightly worse than the Goodyears (maybe 3%) and they do make a slight whirring noise on concrete at freeway speeds - but not too bad considering everything else. They ride very smoothly. Better than the Goodyears and about on par with the continentals.
     
  15. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    I wonder how they compare for wear. There's been previous discussion about the wear ratings across brands but, for consideration:
    19" Pilot A/S 3: 500 AA A
    19" Eagle RS-A2: 440 A A
    21" ExCont DW: 340 AA A
     
  16. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    I had Michelin Pilot Super Sports on my former G37, and they're great tires. Would definitely recommend them. I am planning to switch when my Continentals wear out.
     
  17. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Is Tirerack's data incomplete? I was left with the impression that the PSS aren't available in any of the 3 Model S sizes.
     
  18. mnx

    mnx 2013 P85

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    Correct, AFAIK they are not available in any of the 3 Model S sizes.. (I'm assuming Tirerack's data is complete). However, Michelin Pilot SS are available in 255/40R19 and 255/45R19. Both will fit and have the necessary load index rating etc.

    However in the 21" size, I'm not sure PSS is an option. With a quick look all I could find that might work is 255/30/R21 but the load index is only 93...
     
  19. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Tesla told me today that the Contis are worn out. They quoted approximately $2200 for new Contis, installed, and about $3400 for Michelins. Yikes.

    I checked TireRack, but by the time shipping and installation was factored in, the Tesla price wasn't bad.

    Given that they only lasted 15,000 km (not even 10k miles) I couldn't justify the higher price for the Michelins.

    (I guess I shouldn't go drag racing on the next set...)
     
  20. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    I presume that's Canadian $. What's that in US$ if you happen to know the current exchange rate?
     

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