Vendor Model 3 Öhlins DFV Coilovers - Engineered by Redwood Motorsports ™

[beastmode13]

What I'm trying to understand is how does bumps feels to you compared to stock suspension. Both low speed potholes and high speed freeway cracks and lines. Do you see increased NVH?

Both MPP Sports and Redwood Sports coilovers at the softer end of the setting will have a more comfortable ride than stock P3D with PUP suspension. On my test drive, when Redwood is set at 10 from full hard, it is rougher/firmer than stock. When its set at 20, its more comfortable than stock, soaking up the bumps better than stock while maintaining good composure of not floaty with stock.

 

[dfwatt]

What I'm trying to understand is how does bumps feels to you compared to stock suspension. Both low speed potholes and high speed freeway cracks and lines. Do you see increased NVH?

These kind of kits don't really affect NVH. You get increases in that when you start replacing rubber bushings or when you shorten your sidewalls dramatically or other things that affect transduction of road noise into the cabin. But coilover kits are pretty neutral on all those points. They neither help it nor hurt it significantly.

 

[P3D-R]

I stopped by and saw your car on the rack. Congrats on the purchase. When I asked them where the dampers were set they replied it was set 10 back from stiff which is where they had their test vehicle setup when Beastmode and I test drove. This means you were 2/3 of the way to the stiffest setting. They might have softened it up for you since then but am not sure. I'm hoping to get my set on next week and I'll work out my optimal damper settings for the street and share them. We had them make the suspension softer so it was set at 20 from stiff or 10 up from soft. I think that I'll end up around the 20 back from stiff in the rear and around 15-17 back from stiff up front. In my experience on ICE FR cars this has worked best. Since the Model 3 is a totally different animal I might have to start from ground zero.

I would imagine there will always be an increase in NVH, even with MPP, in comparison to stock. The question is how these various aftermarket companies compare to each other and what the pros/cons are. As long as this is well detailed the information will be the most helpful when making an educated decision.

 

[markli]

I stopped by and saw your car on the rack. Congrats on the purchase. When I asked them where the dampers were set they replied it was set 10 back from stiff which is where they had their test vehicle setup when Beastmode and I test drove. This means you were 2/3 of the way to the stiffest setting. They might have softened it up for you since then but am not sure. I'm hoping to get my set on next week and I'll work out my optimal damper settings for the street and share them. We had them make the suspension softer so it was set at 20 from stiff or 10 up from soft. I think that I'll end up around the 20 back from stiff in the rear and around 15-17 back from stiff up front. In my experience on ICE FR cars this has worked best. Since the Model 3 is a totally different animal I might have to start from ground zero.

I would imagine there will always be an increase in NVH, even with MPP, in comparison to stock. The question is how these various aftermarket companies compare to each other and what the pros/cons are. As long as this is well detailed the information will be the most helpful when making an educated decision.

Right now I think I have mine set to front 17 and back 20 or front 20 back 24, I can't recall the exact setting they told me to try it out, but it handles great for daily driving in town

 

[beastmode13]

I stopped by and saw your car on the rack. Congrats on the purchase. When I asked them where the dampers were set they replied it was set 10 back from stiff which is where they had their test vehicle setup when Beastmode and I test drove. This means you were 2/3 of the way to the stiffest setting. They might have softened it up for you since then but am not sure. I'm hoping to get my set on next week and I'll work out my optimal damper settings for the street and share them. We had them make the suspension softer so it was set at 20 from stiff or 10 up from soft. I think that I'll end up around the 20 back from stiff in the rear and around 15-17 back from stiff up front. In my experience on ICE FR cars this has worked best. Since the Model 3 is a totally different animal I might have to start from ground zero.

I would imagine there will always be an increase in NVH, even with MPP, in comparison to stock. The question is how these various aftermarket companies compare to each other and what the pros/cons are. As long as this is well detailed the information will be the most helpful when making an educated decision.

We had two driving sessions when I was there. Initial one was at 10/10, the ride was stiffer/rougher than stock and my MPP at 14c/13r for both f/r, my street setting. MPP has 16 adjustments, 1 stiff, 16 soft. After the initial drive we asked the adjustment made for softer setting. That is when Redwood changed it to 20 f/r. At 20 is where I said “wow”, because it transform the ride completely, better than stock and comparable to my MPP setup. People looking for street comfort would be happier with settings on the softer side. What’s important to note is how simple click of adjusters can transform the car. 0-10 would be ideal for HPDE or track day. 15+ for street. One thing worth repeating from your conversation with Redwood, Ohlins valve is fully open at 20. There is little difference between 20 to 30. MPP/KW adjustment is similar in this respect, at 16 valve is fully open, yet you can click way pass 16.

Mr. Redwood, making the adjustment to 20 for us before the second test session.

 

[Dangerous Fish]

So what's the point in the adjusters going higher? Is it just that they only have one range?

 

[beastmode13]

So what's the point in the adjusters going higher? Is it just that they only have one range?

Marketing? More adjustments the better. Just kidding.

Just to be clear, KW/MPP is the same as well with Variant3. At 16, the valve is fully open, but you can continue to click it away until end of the travel. It is just the way the internal design and constructed of a valve. Much like the bleeder valve on the brake caliper. When you open it by x amount, the passage created by the opening is the same flow capacity as the passages before and after that point. You can open it by 1.5x, it will not change the flow rate as it is constrained by other points in the system.

 

[RedwoodMotors]

UPDATE: Coronavirus - Day 8? 10? (Who even knows at this point)

Thank you to everyone for your patience here... just as we were gearing up to ship everyones Performance kits we received an order from the governor of California to close for all non-essential operations. We're a block from the Tesla factory... it's a GHOST TOWN! Really eerie. We've been trying to restructure operations here to figure out how to work with limited staff to prevent potential issues. We have implemented some new policies, including drop-off and pick-up only for local install customers (no waiting room, bills are sent remotely for payment, and keys and steering wheels will be wiped down before receiving and returning customer cars). This has definitely been disruptive, but we are ironing out ways to keep things rolling during this unprecedented time, while maintaining the safety of our customers and staff!

That said, this is our first day back following our new internal protocols, and ultra-limited staff. We *are* assembling suspension kits now, with the goal of shipping early to mid next week. Unfortunately, our custom boxes are made using materials from Georgia Pacific - who are now basically making nothing but toilet paper. Our packaging manufacturer has also now re-jigged their factory to make medical garments and N95 masks for healthcare professionals. The custom boxes and packaging are simply not going to happen in time, so we are improvising with brown boxes and packing foam to get the first batch out... please excuse the home-brew presentation for the first batch of suspension. We are including free windshield banners and would like to offer a coupon code for a free hat or T-shirt (please email [email protected] with your order number for a free code, and your desired color/size). Thank you for everyone's extended patience!

The silver lining here is that our Tesla Model 3 Ohlins Front and Rear Floating Top Hats, and front Remote Adjusters are finished and will be available for all customers that have placed a pre-order. To extend our gratitude for everyone's patience we are offering a 25% discount to all pre-order customers on any accessories you wish to purchase before your suspension ships out! If you'd like more info, please email [email protected] and we can help you out!

Tesla Model 3 - Floating Top Hats

Tesla Model 3 - Remote Adjusters

 

[RedTARDIS]

The silver lining here is that our Tesla Model 3 Ohlins Front and Rear Floating Top Hats, and front Remote Adjusters are finished and will be available for all customers that have placed a pre-order. To extend our gratitude for everyone's patience we are offering a 25% discount to all pre-order customers on any accessories you wish to purchase before your suspension ships out! If you'd like more info, please email [email protected] and we can help you out!

Can you elaborate on the pros and cons of the top hats?

 

[P3D-R]

Can you elaborate on the pros and cons of the top hats?

I also posed the same question since the damper isn't load bearing like a traditional macpherson strut suspension design. The biggest appeal to me is that the unit can be fully assembled, I think, so that I don't have to disassemble the factory dampers. For that reason, Mr. Redwood if you're reading, I'll take a set please and happily put them through testing. This should speed up install as well.

 

[dsgerbc]

Floating top-hats will make the whole shock rotate a bit as it compresses/extends so that the shaft stays straight, instead of the shaft bending a little. That in principle extends the life of a shock and lowers friction a bit. At the cost of some NVH increase.
I've never seen dyno results to quantify the effect but I imagine it's real.

 

[N54TT]

Sorry if this has been asked and answered already. But comparing these to the MPP in regards to adjustability of spring perch and body length....where MPP adjusts using the spring perch and Redwood looks like it has both spring perch and body length. Pro’s vs Con’s?

 

[rotus8]

Adjusting the spring perch adjusts the spring preload. Adjusting the body length adjusts the ride height. If you adjust the ride height with the spring length, you move the resting point of the suspension away from the center of the shock travel, inviting bottoming (or topping) out of the shock. Independent adjustability of height and preload is the correct way do design a coilover.

 

[N54TT]

Adjusting the spring perch adjusts the spring preload. Adjusting the body length adjusts the ride height. If you adjust the ride height with the spring length, you move the resting point of the suspension away from the center of the shock travel, inviting bottoming (or topping) out of the shock. Independent adjustability of height and preload is the correct way do design a coilover.

that’s what I would have thought but then saw this post by MPP in another thread. Seems like setting up this kind of coilover properly is a bit more complicated. When comparing MPP vs Redwood...this is one of the differences but haven’t seen much if any discussion on it.

Adding spacer at the top and lowering the spring perch at the bottom to offset it has zero effect on the characteristics of the suspension, and the preload of the spring doesn't change (if it did, as the damper body length doesn't change, the ride height of the car would change!)

The body length/preload adjustment is a common misconception that has started with JDM type coilovers with body length and spring height adjustment (I used to also only adjust suspension with the body length 10+ years ago so I know where you're coming from!). You'll notice that on any real top tier racecars that there isn't anybody length adjustment - just spring perch offset. Why?

The reason is that the body length is set for the parameters of the car. You know the travel range you want (i.e. the car should not be able to hit the ground, no suspension arms should hit the chassis), and so the damper length is set so that at full compression, with the bump rubber nearly fully compressed, the body of the car is close to but not hitting the ground after taking into consideration tire deflection.

Once that is set, there is no reason to ever adjust it unless you're changing something major (like tire diameter or drop spindles for example). At that point, all height adjustment is done with the spring perch offset.

How much "preload" is on the spring at full droop is really an inconsequential value. In fact, if the damper has enough travel (as our AWD sports coilovers do) you can have so much droop that you have almost no preload when the suspension is fully extended. This gives the best ride quality over large pot-holes and drops in the road, as there is little to no chance that the suspension will ever max out on droop.

If you've ridden in cars that have only 1" of droop or so, you'll know that they ride horribly, even with soft springs. Why? Because as soon as a wheel encounters a dip in the road greater than the amount of droop available, the suspension effectively goes solid and the car falls into the hole!

For future suspension installs with those types of coilovers my advice is to set the body length so that the damper has 40% droop travel and 60% compression travel, assuming the car won't hit the ground when fully compressed. Then do the rest with the spring perch adjustment. If there is no tender spring, that will likely mean having almost zero preload on the spring to get the most droop possible.

Unfortunately, some of these kits just don't have much available suspension travel, so you're stuck in that case with not being able to do much!

 

[Performance]

Redwood - I sent you and email.

 

[t00shay]

Any authorized dealer/installer in SoCal? I’m thinking of getting these but don’t know any places to install it.

 

[Murattukaalai]

I pre-ordered GT but I would like to cancel the order and get full refund.

I contacted redwood and they are adding 25% cancellation fee which isn't fair. Should I report through PayPal to get my refund?

 

[dfwatt]

I pre-ordered GT but I would like to cancel the order and get full refund.

I contacted redwood and they are adding 25% cancellation fee which isn't fair. Should I report through PayPal to get my refund?

Unfortunately PayPal has worst-in-Industry consumer ratings for protecting the customer at the end of the transaction. I wouldn't hold out a lot of hope for getting a good result from them. It is outrageous that someone is asking for a 25% cancellation fee on a coilover set that has not been shipped and where there are plenty of customers in the queue so to speak to re-capture that particular item. I'd like to see other members of the Forum weigh in on that but that strikes me as absolutely indefensible.

 

[dsgerbc]

If it's alright to panic and cancel all the plans for people, it's also alright to panic and change refund policies.
TBH, I understand both sides.

Paypal sucks for everyone. I've had terrible experiences with them as a buyer and as a seller, and close my account years ago.

I did think of attempting to cancel, but decided not to. I hope these arrive in the next few weeks so I get to enjoy them before the society disintegrates..

 

[Murattukaalai]

If it's alright to panic and cancel all the plans for people, it's also alright to panic and change refund policies.
TBH, I understand both sides.

Paypal sucks for everyone. I've had terrible experiences with them as a buyer and as a seller, and close my account years ago.

I did think of attempting to cancel, but decided not to. I hope these arrive in the next few weeks so I get to enjoy them before the society disintegrates..

I have no plans to cancel but things changed super fast last week as one member of the household laid off and need the money now. Wasn't expecting pre-order cancellation comes with 25% penalty. If anyone wants the pre-order price for the RWD GT model let me know.