Totally get that --- guess I usually ascribe airbag deployment and/or frame damage, flood damage, with cars declared a total loss -- not rear quarter panels/trunk lids ( "fender benders")
How much you want to bet the offending car isn't totaled?
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Model 3 Rear Ended
- Thread starter silentsnow31802
- Start date
Totally get that --- guess I usually ascribe airbag deployment and/or frame damage, flood damage, with cars declared a total loss -- not rear quarter panels/trunk lids ( "fender benders")
How much you want to bet the offending car isn't totaled?
K-MTG
Sunshade Captain of TMC
He did smash the brakes just before he hit me. Was total lock up so it probably didnt help much. If I had to guess the marks he left were maybe 15ft long.
Not sure if it is totaled yet. Waiting to get things worked out with insurance/body shop. I will definitely keep everyone updated.
There was a hole in the floor pan. It is a part that can be replaced. Like you I had a hole in the bumper and you could see damage to the floor pan/trunk (same as your picture) and I could see the ground through the trunk. Like I said, there was nothing back in that area that impacts the car. I was able to still drive it without an issue. But I did have damage to the same area as you.
The only difference is that my HV did not cut out and I was able to still drive it. My only point is that structurally I think it will be cheaper to repair than for the insurance to call it a total. The only unknown is the electronics if your HV cut out. Not sure how much damage that portends to the battery system. No matter what, good luck.
Probably not true. AP has a hard time reacting to stopped or stationary objects from high speed as has been evident from recent noteable crashes being reported (read recent tesla/fire truck crash). That is apparently how the system was designed or it would never work to begin with (at least in today’sIteration of the software). AP can read objects that are changing pace in front and adjust accordingly but does not expect or understand a stationary object to be positioned on a highway right in front, that is where the manual monitoring comes in to take back control and make a decision for the vehicle.
Really glad you are okay, thus far anyway. It makes me mad that someone else’s inattention causes harm to another.
My Tesla sales guy mentioned that about AP...but isn’t that where the anti collision system comes into play? I’ve had a car pull in front of me, brake , and my non Tesla car slammed the brakes on. The car was in adaptive cruise control. If the idea is to maintain a distance of 25 feet from the object in front of you it doesn’t seem like it should matter whether the object is moving or stationary. Radar signal bounces back a target whether it or you are moving (on ships anyway). I’d love to understand the engineering a bit better if anyone knows why the tech functions as it does.
My Tesla sales guy mentioned that about AP...but isn’t that where the anti collision system comes into play? I’ve had a car pull in front of me, brake , and my non Tesla car slammed the brakes on. The car was in adaptive cruise control. If the idea is to maintain a distance of 25 feet from the object in front of you it doesn’t seem like it should matter whether the object is moving or stationary. Radar signal bounces back a target whether it or you are moving (on ships anyway). I’d love to understand the engineering a bit better if anyone knows why the tech functions as it does.
It’s not a Tesla that hit him. The white Tesla he was referring to was the one in Seattle that was involved in a pretty significant accident on the highway a few days ago. This one looks like a white Ford Fusion or similar.
firelegend
Member
I don't think most people have been taught proper emergency breaking skills. Particularly for cars with no ABS, you can't just slam on the brakes! But not surprised that bad driver is bad driver!
It's not the braking in response to an object slowing part that's hard.
The part that makes stationary cars problematic is the defining of the objects.
Tesla is using chirping continuous wave radar to do adaptive cruise and emergency braking, with limited sensor fusion with the AP camera's neural networks.
Continuous wave radar is constantly putting out a signal. The computers analyze the frequency shift to determine the relative velocity of anything it bounces off of, and direction finding on the return for azimuth (and ascension if they measure that.)
To get distances, the radar chirps - twenty times per second, it does a frequency hop and then it listens for how long it takes the reflected signal to hop.
So in this scheme (very common in automotive radar,) objects are recognized by their Doppler shift (relative speed to the car,) and then assigned a direction and distance by further analysis.
But there are a whole lot of things in the world that don't move but do reflect radar. Enough that even if the car wanted to track them all, it's doubtful that the direction finding part could build an accurate picture. What's more, the strength of a radar return doesn't necessarily have much correlation with an object's size - geometry and materials make a huge difference.
So the solution for first generation systems was to just throw out all the stationary returns. That's why those systems can't work all the way to a stop or start again from a stop.
Second generation systems use memory as well - objects that were identified by Doppler shift which then come to a stop are remembered and it tracks them as they get closer through the chirp timing. This lets the car do full stop and go in adaptive cruise, but it still can't see a stationary car unless the car was moving earlier.
Tesla went a step further. The neural networks analyze the camera image and identify things that look like cars. The car then does some sort of sensor fusion negotiation to mark them as objects even though they were always stationary - azimuth matching on the chirps, maybe?
This usually allows the Tesla to see and correctly respond to stopped cars in the lane that it never saw moving, but it depends on the network seeing the car's image. Which may be why most of the cases we see in the news have been odd angles and unusual paint jobs (bright red fire truck at a thrity degree angle to the road with flashing lights that change its profile) - they are harder for the neural network to see as cars.
One additional path forward Tesla said they were starting implementation on a couple years ago but I've never seen evidence actually happened is the radar whitelist. The theory was that the cars would collect a list of things they saw that looked like cars but don't cause the driver to react, geotagged and categorized for strength. At some point in the future, Tesla would declare the list mature and the cars would download tiles for the areas they are driving in - and start braking for large stationary returns that aren't on the list until drivers override it. I have seen the car brake for no apparent reason near things that could confound it, but they haven't been new things, so they should have been on the list if Tesla has deployed a list.
One possible brute force solution to the problem with firetrucks and police cars would be to push a red hands takeover immediately when the car sees flashing red lights.
davidc18
Active Member
Oh good to know! Thank you for sharing that info with me. Makes me thing it might not get written off after all. Time will tell.
My HV cut out because safety systems were activated. I actually have the logs from the car and every impact sensor in the car went off and its showing battery pack voltage mismatch, pyro fuse faults, and charge port faults.
His car was new enough that it should have had ABS. Maybe it didnt have time to activate or there was something wrong with the system that disabled it? Who knows...
Got the repair quote a few days ago. $13,248 for the repair but no time frame has been given.
I am hoping that the accident does not go on the cars record. If it does ill have to go through the trouble of filing for a diminished value claim.
I did get a chance to check out the facility that is doing the repair and I have no doubt that it will be done correctly and in high quality. They were doing some impressive work there.
I am hoping that the accident does not go on the cars record. If it does ill have to go through the trouble of filing for a diminished value claim.
I did get a chance to check out the facility that is doing the repair and I have no doubt that it will be done correctly and in high quality. They were doing some impressive work there.
I noticed in your footage that you were not at a complete stop when the car hit you, or were you coming to a stop? Or were you rolling/starting to drive at a slow speed? One of the things I feel might confuse non-Tesla owners is the one-pedal driving. Were you on the brakes- indicating to the driver behind you that you were in fact stopping or slowing, or were you letting the car slow down itself with re-gen braking- so that the driver thought you were moving but then realized at the last second that you were approaching way to suddenly because you were slowing down without any brake light indication?
I guess my concern is, if you are slowing down because of the re-gen braking when letting off the accelerator, does it indicate to the driver behind you that you are braking? I have placed my order but this is my main concern with driving with 'one-pedal'.
I guess my concern is, if you are slowing down because of the re-gen braking when letting off the accelerator, does it indicate to the driver behind you that you are braking? I have placed my order but this is my main concern with driving with 'one-pedal'.
Coming to a stop. I was on the brakes very lightly. The car was to the point where regen was not able to slow down any further. There was a stopped car in front of me waiting for cross traffic to turn into the parking lot. The car that hit me was very far behind me when I got to a slow enough speed that they should have noticed me if they were paying attention. The driver was obviously not looking ahead.
The brake lights function during regen the same as if you were using the pedal. Regen will not bring the car to a complete stop so once your doing about 8 mph the car will stop decelerating (except rolling friction from coasting) and turn off the brake lights. The brake lights function perfectly fine during regen as to not cause accidents. There should be no worry about it at all.
artsci
Sponsor
Glad you're ok but I would be cautious about the injuries you suffered. It may take time for the full impact to be felt in various symptoms.
I had a similar rear-ender with my S. Driver on a phone slammed into me at a red light. Said she was distracted by my license plate.
There's more and more of this every day. There should be a severe penalty for this kind of thing. Distracted driving is irresponsible and life threatening. Another reason why FSD on all cars will improve safety.
I had a similar rear-ender with my S. Driver on a phone slammed into me at a red light. Said she was distracted by my license plate.
There's more and more of this every day. There should be a severe penalty for this kind of thing. Distracted driving is irresponsible and life threatening. Another reason why FSD on all cars will improve safety.
