They may not have inflated prices to the degree noted here, but Tesla did increase the MSRP of Model S by $2,500 early on. Anyone who hadn't reserved by the end of 2012 and configured within 30 days was subject to the price increase. Aside from changes to options and bundling, base prices have remained essentially stable since, so I doubt we'll see a similar early price jump with Model X.
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They may not have inflated prices to the degree noted here, but Tesla did increase the MSRP of Model S by $2,500 early on. Anyone who hadn't reserved by the end of 2012 and configured within 30 days was subject to the price increase. Aside from changes to options and bundling, base prices have remained essentially stable since, so I doubt we'll see a similar early price jump with Model X.
bobbykansara
Member
I find ticket scalping extremely distasteful as well. But that's because it is a finite resource. If you can't afford the tix from a scalper, then you don't have have a chance to see the event. Period.
This is different. If you can't afford the inflated price of the X for sale today, you can still pay regular price and get the car anyway a few months later. It's different from the scalper situation because the X for us regular folks isn't going to disappear if we refuse to pay this inflated price.
Nothing wrong with this. Like others have said if someone willing to pay the price on their own volition then all is good. It is like buying and selling stocks at the right time. If this person wait, their sale value will go down. It is good timing on their part IMO. If this should be outlawed, or controlled then that is tentamount to stock manipulation so let the free market determine the price of his car.
I don't think this is greed. Sure it might stem from greed, but another way to look at it is someone is trying to make money. Like everything in society. How do you think a company makes money? They charge for higher price than what it cost them. Do you think that is greed? If so, then everyone should sell at manufacture cost. Then everything will be much cheaper. The Model X would not cost as much because I am sure tesla is making some money on this. It's the way the world works people.
I don't think this is greed. Sure it might stem from greed, but another way to look at it is someone is trying to make money. Like everything in society. How do you think a company makes money? They charge for higher price than what it cost them. Do you think that is greed? If so, then everyone should sell at manufacture cost. Then everything will be much cheaper. The Model X would not cost as much because I am sure tesla is making some money on this. It's the way the world works people.
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I'm pretty sure that Tesla Motors is okay with customers selling cars. I don't think they expect us to ask their permission when any of us decide to sell a vehicle that we legally own.(To clarify, we are not talking about selling a Founders reservation or placing an order for resale. This is about selling a vehicle that you already own, for a profit.)
In my case, I'd already configured & confirmed my order. Locked in. I highly doubt TM expected me to put two Model X into my garage. Other people might sell because personal circumstances have changed. Or maybe they just don't want a new vehicle. None of us owe an explanation as to why we sell.
Look, I get this premium is high. Very high. And I'm sure some people are shocked. I just don't get all the outrage. He might get it, he probably won't - but it seems like people are reacting very emotionally & I'm honestly curious as to why. It's not going to cause TM to raise their prices, it's unlikely going to result in a negative media piece (to the contrary, it would likely be 'so desirable, people paid this much over list') - and even if it did, TM has had much worse to deal with on an almost-daily basis.
It's like being upset that someone is selling their house for so much more than they paid for it ... if that's what the market thinks it is worth, then that is the price they'll be paid. And if the market disagrees, they'll either drop the price or take the house off the market.
I'm really impressed with Tesla's vehicles because it's a complete re-design of the automobile from the ground up to be an electric vehicle. From a technology perspective, it's some thing to be impressed with. Therefore, I used to talk about the virtues of Tesla all the time, including my long-held reservations (first with the Model-S and then with the Model-X).
However, these vehicles are priced really high (I won't get into a discussion whether it's warranted or not) and the fact is that most people can't afford these vehicles. Most people will consider it an elitist vehicle and like it or not, the Tesla name has a certain "elitist" stigma about it.
Furthermore, when someone tries to make an $80k profit from such an elitist vehicle, you enter a "greed" territory that really offends people. I think we can lose a connection to the rest of society when they live in these forums for so long.
Personally, I have consciously decided to refrain from discussing anything Tesla (in public) since having a group conversation last year where someone thought I was joking about having a Model-X reservation, because I don't want people to think I'm elitist. Also, there were a bunch of jerks in the Tesla forums (not TMC) that I definitely don't want to be associated with. At one point I even thought about cancelling my reservation because I didn't want people to automatically think of me as an a$$ whole because I'm driving a Tesla. Thankfully, people like Bonnie, AIMc, MrBoylan, goneskiian, ohmman, etc. (to name a few) are intelligent and level headed and it should help break that stigma (and I'm keeping my reservation).
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sub
Active Member
All that worrying about what other people think must be exhausting. I think it's laughable this person is trying to get 215k for their model X, but I'm reserving my laughter for the person willing to cough up the money. Good luck to the seller I say.
MrBoylan
Member
I got my first reaction like that lately when I started waxing poetic about Tesla and someone said, "Oh no, you're one of those people."
Um... what? One of those people who cares about the environment, but also enjoys awesome technology and appreciates a fine driving experience? Yes, I guess I am one of those people.
Glad you're sticking around and thanks for the kind words.
But I'm not sure about level-headed... have you seen the stock market lately? Zoinks! :crying:
goneskiian
Active Member
Wow. Thanks. I'm honored that you lump me in with those esteemed contributors. I always appreciate seeing your comments on a subject as well.
I think you've also touched on one of the biggest issues holding my wife and I back from clicking the order button. That is, the perception of others. I know there are others threads for this, but this is a very large purchase no matter how you look at it. In the end though, as many have already said, life is too short to worry about what others think of us.
Cheers!
I share the same thoughts and feelings.
I have many hobbies but the one I enjoy the most and can compare with the "elitist" stigma you mentioned is road cycling. I used to ride with a large group most of them riding on >$5K (I'm guilty of that) and some even $10K+ bicycles. Some of the guys were all right but there were a few that look down on others riding sub <$1K bicycles.
I fully understand the technology Tesla has and the premium you have to pay, but for bicycles, it's simply the brand name you are paying for. Even with all the carbon fiber frames, components, electronic and now wireless shifting technologies, you still have to pedal the darn bike with your legs. It's funny especially since the stronger riders are normally the ones with the more affordable bikes but a few with the real expensive bikes still thought they were better then everyone else and could just purchase more speed! I no longer wanted to be associated with the group anymore so I just ride alone now although I know there are a lot of riders who are down to earth and just enjoy the ride.
Going back on topic, so why are there even $10K+ bikes? It's purely because there are people who are willing to pay that much for whatever reason! The seller did fully disclose the original purchase price so it's not like he/she is trying to hide anything. If the buyer considers not having to wait vs. $90K premium (I also included the $7.5Ktax credit they won't get) worth it, then all is good. But if he/she thinks they are a better Tesla owner because they paid more for it, that's another story;-)
goneskiian
Active Member
I can relate to the cycling analogy for sure. Although, I don't know many of these "elitist" cyclists. Likely because the groups I ride with are mostly local racers and the only thing that matters is "can you keep up".
Zybane
Member
I'm pretty sure that Tesla Motors is okay with customers selling cars. I don't think they expect us to ask their permission when any of us decide to sell a vehicle that we legally own.
In my case, I'd already configured & confirmed my order. Locked in. I highly doubt TM expected me to put two Model X into my garage. Other people might sell because personal circumstances have changed. Or maybe they just don't want a new vehicle. None of us owe an explanation as to why we sell.
Look, I get this premium is high. Very high. And I'm sure some people are shocked. I just don't get all the outrage. He might get it, he probably won't - but it seems like people are reacting very emotionally & I'm honestly curious as to why. It's not going to cause TM to raise their prices, it's unlikely going to result in a negative media piece (to the contrary, it would likely be 'so desirable, people paid this much over list') - and even if it did, TM has had much worse to deal with on an almost-daily basis.
It's like being upset that someone is selling their house for so much more than they paid for it ... if that's what the market thinks it is worth, then that is the price they'll be paid. And if the market disagrees, they'll either drop the price or take the house off the market.
Just like the individual can put the car up for sale for whatever price they want, people can comment on the price however they want.
Saying you don't need an SUV after ordering an SUV is one thing, but then to tack on a $90K profit after stating the previous comment is dubious at best.
Two P90DL Model X's sold a week ago for $170,000 and $175,000 on Ebay. Doubt anyone will pay $215,000 for a non-ludicrous Model X. Anyone willing to pay well over manufacturer cost is going to be a guy who has no care about money and simply wants the latest greatest thing NOW. It not having Ludicrous option does not fit that bill. If it had it, probably could get some sucker to pay close to $190,000 for it.
Grey market cars. Looks like there is already an X headed to China:
People exporting it could probably get close to double the MSRP.
That's quite the imagination. Look at the hashtags, they are air freighting it to China. Probably removed the logo to avoid customs duties. Air freight would probably cost over 20k.
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