Not sure how they calculate it though!
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New Assisted Driver Grading
- Thread starter UrbanSplash
- Start date
Not sure how they calculate it though!
BistroMath as expounded by the late great Douglas Adams, a man of infinate wit
MrBadger
Badger out
I think the bits the Model 3 got marked down on are very valid. Just not so sure on the weightings being correct. Model 3 tops two categories, including what on paper is the most important one. What needs to be clearer is if 'driver engagement' affects overall safety - marketing obviously no, but to what degree for say the pothole test? Its almost as if a further column is required, ie overall safety. Along with dubious marketing, the many youtube videos of using autopilot in inappropriate circumstances has not helped manage drivers expectations. I think Tesla have something to learn from the detail of thus all.
hingus2000
Member
I agree with the article in so far as I find taking over the steering from Autopilot requires way too much of a jerk. I appreciate this needs to be balanced with the steering not accounting for unintended inputs, but you basically can't take over from Autopilot without all your passengers wondering what the hell is going on. It would be much better if you could give it a correction while it remains engaged.
phil4
Member
I do wonder about the jerkiness to deactivate AP.... I wonder if it's caused mostly by the way Tesla have implemented the EU requirements. Ie. by insisting you keep your hands on the wheel, and using torque sensing to do that, they -have- to set a threshold over which you need to push the car, hence the jerkiness.
If they want to remove that, they'd need to either reduce the threshold, giving more danger of you overriding it while trying to indicate you've got your hands on the wheel, or find another way.
They could help with the system disengaging... but I think that's minor gains compared to the above.
If they want to remove that, they'd need to either reduce the threshold, giving more danger of you overriding it while trying to indicate you've got your hands on the wheel, or find another way.
They could help with the system disengaging... but I think that's minor gains compared to the above.
I was listening to what they said until
"The other reason why Tesla’s system isn’t up with the highest graded is in the marketing itself. “The use of the term Autopilot, and the descriptions surrounding it, we think are misleading,” Avery said. "
At which point they lost all credibility. This is just the sort of industry prejudice against Tesla we've seen from Thatcham before. They are grading something on the marketing. It's amazing how these experts all have the same incorrect understanding of what a planes autopilot does, and would be surprised it's not really the jolly blow up figure from the Airplane movies.
"The other reason why Tesla’s system isn’t up with the highest graded is in the marketing itself. “The use of the term Autopilot, and the descriptions surrounding it, we think are misleading,” Avery said. "
At which point they lost all credibility. This is just the sort of industry prejudice against Tesla we've seen from Thatcham before. They are grading something on the marketing. It's amazing how these experts all have the same incorrect understanding of what a planes autopilot does, and would be surprised it's not really the jolly blow up figure from the Airplane movies.
They had me until
"
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Tesla doesent advertise....
Edit... No I don't love Autocar as much as Autocar loves itself, what an obsurd question to ask...
But to the average person the terms Tesla use are misleading. Most people would think that “Full Self Driving” meant exactly that, while the reality is that it’s beta software that may or may not achieve its aim in several years time.
MrBadger
Badger out
But clearly many do, which is the whole point. Made worse by hype and many online videos.
How dangerous this makes things who knows? But I suspect there is some peril in its incorrect deployment and it is this that is being marked down in the driver engagement column even if it is not being explicitly stated in the chart.
If AutoPilot confuses the car mag readers and tyre kickers, there is no danger except ill-advised column inches in advertising-dependent publications wasting time and ink.
Get behind the wheel? Still no danger because if you enable AutoPilot or TACC you get explicit language about the limitaions of beta software.
Idiots abound. Serious Tesla pilots have RTFMed before they collect the car.
Glan gluaisne
Active Member
For anyone with an aviation background, the meaning Tesla give to the word "autopilot" is completely alien. If I engage autopilot, even on a 50 year old aeroplane, I don't have to have my hands or feet on any of the controls. What Tesla mean by autopilot is a bit like the pretty crude stability augmentation systems fitted to some aircraft, like the heading hold feature on some helicopters, where if your feet are off the yaw pedals the heading remains fixed.
I'd guess that even those who don't fly may well associate autopilot with the sort of complete flight management system (FMS) that is often shown in films. Aircraft have had systems that will fly the aeroplane through a fairly complex set of course and altitude changes, with no manual input during the flight, for decades now. The vast majority of commercial flights are flown this way, and have been for a long time. It's not uncommon for the handling pilot to do no hands-on flying from brakes off to brakes on for some routes.
I'd guess that even those who don't fly may well associate autopilot with the sort of complete flight management system (FMS) that is often shown in films. Aircraft have had systems that will fly the aeroplane through a fairly complex set of course and altitude changes, with no manual input during the flight, for decades now. The vast majority of commercial flights are flown this way, and have been for a long time. It's not uncommon for the handling pilot to do no hands-on flying from brakes off to brakes on for some routes.
MrBadger
Badger out
With autopilot its a global setting, so the notification only comes up the once. Once enabled, other drivers will not see disclaimer. Navigate on Autopilot is profile specific so each profile will get the disclaimer.
I bet many cannot remember what either disclaimer says and just go on what they see and hear others doing. Its very clear from other restrictions in life that many people cannot even follow simple ones, like space, so no chance of many following more complex ones.
The distribution of IQs (whatever that measures) follows the normal curve. 50pc of the world is on the left side of the mean which is taken to be a score of 100.
Gigabytes of YouTube driver idiot videos attest to the fact that many left-siders have the wit to get a license (often) and find their keys and remember where they parked it last. Some may even buy Teslas.
I've been a private pilot for over 30 years and flown aircraft with all sorts of "pilot assist" features. Before I get in an aircraft or a car I familiarise myself with its salient features. Anyone who doesn't may be left-sider or they are fools.
I bought a Tesla with FSD. Read the manual twice before collection. Enabled the "driver assist" features on empty roads initially to check the reality. Tesla could call Autopilot "Elon's Hand of God" and it wouldn't make a blind bit of to me or many right-siders.
drivingmrte5la
Member
I’ve had my Model 3 since Aug ‘19 and I only realised last month that you can push the right stalk up to deactivate AP.
Glan gluaisne
Active Member
I’ve had my Model 3 since Aug ‘19 and I only realised last month that you can push the right stalk up to deactivate AP.
I only realised last week that the counter intuitive action of pushing the indicator stalk in the same direction cancels them. Finding that out has reduced my frustration level at the indicators switching to the wrong direction just because I've been trying to cancel them.
Not sure why you would need to explain the benefits of trafic aware cruise control...
Watching Linus Tech Tips a while back he was talking about a use case - from a safety standpoint - of enabling TACC in a school zone because it is safer to hover over the brake pedal. I personally prefer regen braking for emergency stop reaction time, rather than adopting some kind of CC/braking in certain regions, but that's just me...
I very rarely use TACC, too fast on streets, easier to regulate speed with regen, doesent keep lane on motorways. Even in stop start traffic, starts moving too late, stops too early - which is OK on motorways where gaps are bigger, not so much on streets.
Glan gluaisne
Active Member
One of the most useful use cases for TACC seems to be when driving through long sections of motorway roadworks, where there's a 50mph average speed restriction. Might be just me, but I find 50mph an awkward speed to adhere to for any length of time. Having the speed set to 50mph and letting TACC take care of the inevitable slowing down and speeding up from vehicles in front seems a useful benefit.
I remember reading something years ago that showed that 50mph was a speed that tended to create bunching, with groups of cars driving quite close together, with larger gaps between each bunch. Maybe that's what seems to make it a bit of a frustrating speed limit. The long section of roadworks on the M27, between junctions 4 and 11 seems particularly frustrating, and I gather they are looking at raising the limit on that stretch from 50mph to 60mph, partly because of some issues with that much traffic driving at 50mph.
I remember reading something years ago that showed that 50mph was a speed that tended to create bunching, with groups of cars driving quite close together, with larger gaps between each bunch. Maybe that's what seems to make it a bit of a frustrating speed limit. The long section of roadworks on the M27, between junctions 4 and 11 seems particularly frustrating, and I gather they are looking at raising the limit on that stretch from 50mph to 60mph, partly because of some issues with that much traffic driving at 50mph.
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