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NHTSA compels Tesla to recall FSD feature
- Thread starter thedaysbetween
- Start date
Mine is set to average and it never comes to a full stop at a stop sign IF there are no other cars around.
The weirdest thing about this is that "rolling stops" is certainly not amongst the most dangerous quirks/issues that FSD Beta has. I mean, you want to issue a safety recall, I would think the phantom braking issue or the inability to stay in its lane on a curvy road would be among the top safety issues of FSD Beta right now. I guess the one difference is that "rolling stops" is programmed in where those other issues are "just not there yet" sort of issues.
Barklikeadog
Active Member
Are we really arguing about the meaning of the term recall?
Not knowing about this feature, I guess I would ask... if your goal is to perform 1000 safer than the average human driver,
why would you program a car that could roll through stop signs or exceeds the speed limits?
Not knowing about this feature, I guess I would ask... if your goal is to perform 1000 safer than the average human driver,
why would you program a car that could roll through stop signs or exceeds the speed limits?
I believe the idea is that if it behaves more like humans, its behavior is more predictable by other drivers.
_Redshift_
Member
What a great decision it was to deploy this useless feature or ‘fearure‘!
Saves a whopping two seconds!
It was also illegal.
Saves a whopping two seconds!
It was also illegal.
It seems like if NHTSA is going to require autonomous systems to follow the letter of the law, we humans are going to need to accept that the AV system is likely not going to drive like ourselves. Like going a bit over the speed limit, rolling stops are super common around here. We look left and right and make sure no one is coming. I don't think it's a dangerous maneuver unless you're barely slowing at all. But as far as AVs sharing the road with humans during this transitional period, there's going to be a lot of people annoyed at how AVs drive. It's going to drive like it's going for a 100 safety score.
If we ever get to a point where all cars are autonomous, and they can communicate and convoy, we won't need stop signs or traffic lights.
If we ever get to a point where all cars are autonomous, and they can communicate and convoy, we won't need stop signs or traffic lights.
Tesla recalls all 53,822 vehicles with its 'full self-driving' feature
Tesla will recall all 53,822 vehicles with its "full self-driving" driver-assist feature after it was intentionally programmed to slowly roll through stop signs in some scenarios.
Will this only be for US cars?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
It only affects FSD beta cars. So yes.Tesla recalls all 53,822 vehicles with its 'full self-driving' feature
Tesla will recall all 53,822 vehicles with its "full self-driving" driver-assist feature after it was intentionally programmed to slowly roll through stop signs in some scenarios.edition.cnn.com
Will this only be for US cars?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
It's not a gray area in California, the cops can write you a ticket for going 1 mph over the limit, California has a strict speed limit, yet few people follow it. The mechanism allowing this behavior is the same as for rolling stops: enforcement is lax because of so many people doing the same thing.
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You could certainly be right but by the time 10.2 came out the faster California role at 5+mph was already included in FSD so the damage was done especially with all the Youtube videos highlighting the fast rolling stops. One wonders if the same attention would have happened if the rolling stops had been initially been at 1-2mph.Ive been on every version since 10.2 and since they added the aggressive setting, I’ve never seen it roll at more than 1-2mph.
I really wish they didn’t advertise the rolling stops. Once the media outlets picked it up, it was just a matter of time before NHTSA came knocking. They should at least leave it for us Californians. California Rolls are basically the unspoken law here
What about U-turns (which I don't think FSD does yet) but is illegal in many places, legal in some, people often do them anyway.
Cutting the corner by using the gas station is illegal (or so I was told at driving school).
Some people reverse up a one-way street like they've figured out a loophole, or reverse up the on-ramp when they've missed the exit.
There's lots of illegal what-ifs, but many people do them. Even "assertive" (aggressive), or "Mad Max" modes might start to be looked at. When does assertive cross the line?
Some of Mobileye's New York driving is pretty assertive, maybe the argument is it needs to be, but is there an excessive limit?
Tam
Well-Known Member
Has anyone asked who is responsible for tickets that would be given because the car is doing rolling stops or doing things that can result in a ticket? If the car is programmed to do that, would it actually be responsibility of Tesla to pay for the ticket if they are knowingly implementing an illegal maneuver?
if you don’t know if you have beta, you don’t have beta.
Tam
Well-Known Member
Good question but I am not sure there's an answer.
NHTSA does hold Tesla responsible for the "Passenger Play" feature and made Tesla take that off.
NHTSA does hold Tesla responsible for the "Rolling Stop" feature and made Tesla take that off.
But NHTSA is not your local cop or traffic court, so how do you translate that to avoid tickets is another unanswered question.
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