Nuclear power

[nwdiver]

About once a year I head over to see how ITER is doing. First ignition coming in 2025...

I'm not necessarily opposed to ITER as a science project but it has more in common with the Apollo Program than a practical solution to climate change. We might get a proof of concept by ~2025. The hurdles after that are too numerous to count. I wouldn't take 10:1 odds on commercial operation before 2050. Add to that the fact that thermal fusion is DOA. To be economically viable in todays market generators cannot use heat as an intermediate step. It's gotta be fusion => electricity or it simply isn't viable. Economics matters.

For historical context it took fission ~15 years to go from 'proof of concept' at Chicago Pile-1 in 1942 to the shippingport reactor in 1957.

It's too late in the game for fusion to save us from our addiction to fossil fuels. Solar, Wind, Demand Response and Storage are the only players left on the field...

*Correction* Proof of concept NET 2035

 

[RubberToe]

NRC issues FPL a construction and operating license for two new AP1000 reactors (Turkey Point 6 and 7):

Regulator approves licences for new Florida units

Some interesting quotes from the article:

"In a June 2017 filing to the Florida PSC, FPL said that upon receipt of the COLs it "intends to pause the project to observe and understand the challenges faced by the first wave of AP1000 projects currently under way". This pause is estimated to be at least four years, the company said, which will push the commissioning and start-up dates for Turkey Point 6 and 7 from 2027 and 2028 to at least 2031 and 2032, respectively"

"According to FPL, maintenance activities also include continuing compliance with the Conditions of Certification or other permit conditions and collecting lessons learned from the first wave of AP1000 projects."

I can save these ratepayers a lot of money here. Lesson #1: Do not under any circumstances start constructing a new nuclear power plant.

It looks like they may see the writing on the wall, since they go on to say this:

"FPL also plans to monitor economic factors that could affect the decision to proceed with construction"

RT

 

[nwdiver]

It looks like they may see the writing on the wall, since they go on to say this:

"FPL also plans to monitor economic factors that could affect the decision to proceed with construction"

RT

This was quoted on March 13th.

“The economics don’t support us moving forward with the new units in the foreseeable future,” said Steven Scroggs, FPL senior director

I thought it was amusing that NRC approval of the Turkey Point units made headlines a month AFTER FPL said it no longer had any interest in proceeding.

Florida also burned ~$1.5B on the Levy Nuclear Power plant before that project was canceled.

Not sure what's a better way to lose $$$. Putting Trump in charge of a casino or building a nuclear power plant...

If any more $$$ is spent on building nuclear in the next ~20-30 years it's gonna have to be from private capital. Which probably means the US won't see construction start on another nuclear plant in the next ~20-30 years...

 

[ReddyLeaf]

There may never be another nuclear plant built in the US ever again

 

[nwdiver]

There may never be another nuclear plant built in the US ever again

I don't think the nuclear industry should get any more toys until they finish building the ones they have...

This is Bellefonte Nuclear Power Plant. It was never finished... ~$6B spent. 0kWh produced...

 

[mspohr]

America's nuclear headache: old plutonium with nowhere to go
Ongoing boondoggle with plutonium. The idiots built 37,000 nuclear warheads and now need to get rid of them. Pork barrel project in SC to make MOX won't be finished until 2048 (i.e. never) and nobody wants it even if they could make it.

 

[mspohr]

The latest state to get serious about climate change is ... New Jersey?
New Jersey just passed a trio of bills to drastically increase renewable energy standards to 50% by 2030, improve solar access and pricing... And, subsidize existing nuclear by $300 m a year ($0.004 kWh customer charge).
Kind of a devil's bargain to avoid natural gas taking up the slack as nuclear plants are closed.

 

[EVCollies]

I don't think the nuclear industry should get any more toys until they finish building the ones they have...

This is Bellefonte Nuclear Power Plant. It was never finished... ~$6B spent. 0kWh produced...

View attachment 294955

Are those solar panels on the roof in the lower left of the image?

 

[nwdiver]

Are those solar panels on the roof in the lower left of the image?

No. Skylights. I've yet to meet anyone in a managerial position in the industry with anything more than contempt for solar. I suspect that they wouldn't install them even if they were free. The industry is irredeemably corrupt and rotten.

 

[RubberToe]

Fuel loading underway at first AP1000 reactor in China:

Fuel loading under way at Chinese AP1000

 

[mspohr]

New UK nuclear power plants 'hinge on deal between Hitachi and government'
UK nuclear plans 'risk collapse if Hitachi talks fail'

Looks like the UK is going to give Hitachi 13 billion pounds plus guaranteed price for power twice current renewables cost for new nuclear plant.
A new level of stupidity.

 

[nwdiver]

New UK nuclear power plants 'hinge on deal between Hitachi and government'
UK nuclear plans 'risk collapse if Hitachi talks fail'

Looks like the UK is going to give Hitachi 13 billion pounds plus guaranteed price for power twice current renewables cost for new nuclear plant.
A new level of stupidity.

Has the UK not seen this map?

 

[mspohr]

Has the UK not seen this map?

View attachment 303681

It does not appear that the UK government uses "facts" in their decision making process.

 

[Lloyd]

In parts pf Europe there are lots of people that are against the wind generation. They do make some noise and they consider it a blight on the landscape.

 

[mspohr]

In parts pf Europe there are lots of people that are against the wind generation. They do make some noise and they consider it a blight on the landscape.

In most of the world, everyone is against fossil fuel extraction (mining, drilling), shipping and refining. However, corporations and government (same thing in many places) find profit in it.

 

[Lloyd]

In most of the world, everyone is against fossil fuel extraction (mining, drilling), shipping and refining. However, corporations and government (same thing in many places) find profit in it.

Understood. I'm just saying that it is not universally accepted everywhere.

 

[nwdiver]

In parts pf Europe there are lots of people that are against the wind generation. They do make some noise and they consider it a blight on the landscape.

That's why I posted an offshore map. If it's >12 miles offshore you'd only notice it from a boat or a plane...

 

[Brando]

And nobody wants to start talking about all those chemicals that go up through the chimney. According to B. L. Cohen the number of premature deaths due to air pollution from coal is around 50 000 per year for the US alone. Another example is that Norwegian freshwater fish contains so much mercury primarily from UK coal emissions that we can scarcely eat it anymore.

It now turns out that Japanese radiation hysteria has killed 573 people so far due to the much larger than needed evacuation. A suggestion to how this could have been handled more rationally can be found here.

So far the Fukushima clean up will cost more than the original ~50 atomic reactors cost. doubled electric power generation costs overnight

 

[derekt75]

It does not appear that the UK government uses "facts" in their decision making process.

It does appear that the USA government uses "alternative facts" in its decision making process.

 

[S'toon]

The government has confirmed it is considering putting taxpayers' money into a project to build a new nuclear power station at Wylfa in North Wales.

It's a decision that, if taken (and it almost certainly will be), will mark a significant U-turn in the government's approach to procuring new nuclear power.

In 2010, the government was adamant that the UK public should never have to run the risk of lengthy and costly overruns that have become a hallmark of nuclear plant construction.

In the case of Hinkley Point C in Somerset, the government made much of the fact that come what may, the UK taxpayer would be insulated from the skyrocketing costs that the contractor, EDF, had incurred on a similar plant in France.

But there was a price to pay for that taxpayer protection: very expensive electricity.

In return for shouldering all the risk, EDF demanded a price for the electricity that Hinkley will (one day) produce that is double the current going rate.

<snip>

Full article at:
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-44363366