WOW. That is great and makes the whole solar panels a much, much better deal.
The $0.03 buyback rate is what Tesla quoted me. So I guess it is a biased number to get you to buy Powerwalls.
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PG&E customers. What do you spend/mo to charge your car?
- Thread starter jboy210
- Start date
WOW. That is great and makes the whole solar panels a much, much better deal.
The $0.03 buyback rate is what Tesla quoted me. So I guess it is a biased number to get you to buy Powerwalls.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
That sounds about right. Depending on the computer of course, an "average" desktop power draw is going to be at least 100 Watts per computer during use and probably 30 Watts or more even during sleep. Then maybe another 50 Watts or more per monitor (size and brightness affected of course) while active. NAS devices and routers aren't typically using a lot. My Western Digital NAS uses about 25 Watts while in operation and the Netgear router is roughly 15 Watts. You might know all this already. And yes, good idea to go to the hardware store any buy one of those inexpensive power meters to test a particular device.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
Yup, totally agree with that. That rate plan sure was the best one for my California home with solar.
Looks like some changes to the EV-A rate are coming.
Regardless of the level of participation, Rate A of Schedule EV will be closed to new enrollment on the later of July 1, 2019 or the date the new electric vehicle charging rate adopted by D.18-08-013 is available for enrollment.
Beginning on the later of July 1, 2019 or the date the new electric vehicle charging rate becomes available for enrollment, customers taking service on Rate A or Rate B of this rate schedule cannot exceed 800% of their annual baseline allowance, measured as the total usage for the customer over the last 12 months divided by the total annual baseline allowance using the approved baseline allowances for those months. Customers at premises with total usage in excess of 800 percent of baseline over 12 months will be moved to Schedule E-TOU-B and will be prohibited from taking service on any electric vehicle rate schedule for 12 months. Customers must have 12 months of consecutive usage on this Rate Schedule before being subject to the requirement of being moved from Schedule EV to Schedule E-TOU-B as a result of exceeding the 800 percent of baseline 12-month threshold.
Regardless of the level of participation, Rate A of Schedule EV will be closed to new enrollment on the later of July 1, 2019 or the date the new electric vehicle charging rate adopted by D.18-08-013 is available for enrollment.
Beginning on the later of July 1, 2019 or the date the new electric vehicle charging rate becomes available for enrollment, customers taking service on Rate A or Rate B of this rate schedule cannot exceed 800% of their annual baseline allowance, measured as the total usage for the customer over the last 12 months divided by the total annual baseline allowance using the approved baseline allowances for those months. Customers at premises with total usage in excess of 800 percent of baseline over 12 months will be moved to Schedule E-TOU-B and will be prohibited from taking service on any electric vehicle rate schedule for 12 months. Customers must have 12 months of consecutive usage on this Rate Schedule before being subject to the requirement of being moved from Schedule EV to Schedule E-TOU-B as a result of exceeding the 800 percent of baseline 12-month threshold.
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
Interesting. 800% does seem like a lot but at the same time we generally strive to do most of our time optioned electricity consumption during non peak hours. Be it heating/cooling, pool pumps, watering, laundry etc. we go out of our way to limit our costs. With a bit of solar to offset some consumption the EV does consume most of our energy by far though.
We have heat pumps that really draw the power but if we did not, I could think going from a non EV situation to a EV that was used daily and consumed 60-70 kWh could put you in jeopardy of the 800%, especially if you lived in a smaller home in a more temperate climate.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Definitely possible. For fun and science I did some bar napkin math to see where I'm at. I have a modest sized ~2,000 square foot home, hot climate, and we're fairly energy efficient - use evaporative cooling ~80% of the time in the summer instead of A/C. Heat in the winter is not electric. I commute about 110 miles per day, about 35kwh per weekday for the car.
Assuming I'm reading the tables correctly, my annual baseline allowance in Zone R is approximately 5,000 kwh. So 800% of that is approximately 40,000 kwh.
Last year I used ~11,000 kwh from the grid, and my 7kw solar array produced about 10,500 kwh, for a total energy footprint of ~21,500 kwh.
So even if I had no solar and was pulling every kwh from the grid, I'd still need to essentially double my consumption to get close to 800%.
My baseline allowance in Zone R is almost as high as it gets though - YMMV in more temperate climates.
mblakele
FSD Beta (99)
This seems to have similar info:
PG&E's "Final Decision" Rates, Part 1: Residential Rates
PG&E's "Final Decision" Rates, Part 1: Residential Rates
[EV-A] has an enrollment limitation which will cap this rate at 30,000 storage-only customers, with any EV + storage customers not getting counted in that cap. Customers enrolling in EV(A) cannot exceed 800% of their average annual baseline allowance. Key details of this rate include:
- “On-peak” TOU period is defined as 4-9 pm, all year round.
- Wide TOU price differentials: 21-cents in the winter, 35-cents in the summer, all 7-days of the week.
- EV(A) is one of the best residential rate schedules in the country for energy storage customers.
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
The chart did not show 21 cents so I am not sure where they are getting this from.
That shift in peak times will definitely have a negative impact on current PV owners when their grandfathered time ends.
mblakele
FSD Beta (99)
EV rate is approximately $0.13/kWh Off-Peak during Summer and Winter. Actually $0.12866/kWh Winter and $0.12559/kWh Summer.
Winter $0.13 + $0.21 = $0.34/kWh Peak. Today's rate is $0.34021/kWh
Summer $0.13 + $0.35 = $0.48/kWh Peak. Today's rate is $0.48889/kWh
Those differentials are already in today's rates. 8X Baseline is really quite a lot of power. However, if you're charging several vehicles, it adds up quickly. I am in Zone X which is 9.9kWh/day Summer and 10.7kWh/day Winter. 800% would come to an average of 2,472kWh/month. 1,000kWh/mo is relatively high for a home without an EV. You could charge about 4,400 miles/month on top of that kind of household usage and still stay within the 800%. Anybody who uses that much electricity should really have solar. Lots of solar.
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
OK. I was not following the logic. It's the differential between off peak and peak they were speaking about. I thought it was the actual price and could not figure out where it was coming from.
Does anyone have another authoritative reference for the coming changes to the EV-A TOU periods?
I read through the CPUC Decision D.18-08-013:http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Published/G000/M221/K552/221552311.PDF
It mentioned the shortened four-month summer seasonal period. But as far as the change in the TOU periods, the section on that cites "The parties to the various settlements at issue in this decision agreed to apply consistent TOU period definitions across all TOU rates offered by PG&E to its non-residential, non-agricultural customers", i.e. it's only talking about commercial, not about residential. Those TOU period revisions DO mention a 4-9 pm peak period, but also includes a Super Off-Peak period from 9a-2p a few months a year and other big changes.
So where exactly ARE the new EV-A TOU period definitions in the regulatory docs?
I read through the CPUC Decision D.18-08-013:http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Published/G000/M221/K552/221552311.PDF
It mentioned the shortened four-month summer seasonal period. But as far as the change in the TOU periods, the section on that cites "The parties to the various settlements at issue in this decision agreed to apply consistent TOU period definitions across all TOU rates offered by PG&E to its non-residential, non-agricultural customers", i.e. it's only talking about commercial, not about residential. Those TOU period revisions DO mention a 4-9 pm peak period, but also includes a Super Off-Peak period from 9a-2p a few months a year and other big changes.
So where exactly ARE the new EV-A TOU period definitions in the regulatory docs?
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
I did find another page dated early 2018, that suggests the coming TOU periods are:
Off Peak 12:00 am - 3:00 pm
Part Peak 3:00 pm - 4:00 pm & 9:00 pm- 12:00 am
Peak 4:00 pm - 9:00 pm
PG&E Home Solar and Electric Vehicle Rates Rundown
Again no reference to the source regulatory material, but I'm not disbelieving. So significant changes to Part Peak and Off-Peak as well. Off-Peak expands from 11p-7a to 12a-3p - detrimental to solar, but not necessarily bad for non-solar EV customers. Also mentions the change to 4 month summer season.
Off Peak 12:00 am - 3:00 pm
Part Peak 3:00 pm - 4:00 pm & 9:00 pm- 12:00 am
Peak 4:00 pm - 9:00 pm
PG&E Home Solar and Electric Vehicle Rates Rundown
Again no reference to the source regulatory material, but I'm not disbelieving. So significant changes to Part Peak and Off-Peak as well. Off-Peak expands from 11p-7a to 12a-3p - detrimental to solar, but not necessarily bad for non-solar EV customers. Also mentions the change to 4 month summer season.
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