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PG&E Rate Plan question

getakey

Active Member
Jan 28, 2020
1,309
428
95762
I'm on EVA-1. I have 2.5 years left on Plan before they switch me to EVA-2. I have 11.8 kW Solar plus 3 PWs
Turning in my EV tomorrow from lease. We will probably replace with another EV, but with all this lock down, not anxious to get one soon.

Is there an advantage to going off of EV Plan? I know the Peak Rates are higher with EV, but I have PWs to make it through most Peak periods. However, when I do replace EV, I will be put on EVA-2
 

Ampster

Active Member
Oct 5, 2012
1,779
477
Kenwood, California
I have not looked at the specifics lately but to me it is about the rate differentials. With an EV you can charge at rates around
$0.15 per kiloWatt and get credited for solar production at rates two to three times that. A battery means you do not have to pay the high peak rates so the shoulder rates are the break even rates. I am 45 days from my True Up and still have a dollar credit and my total consumption in kWhrs is positive. In eight years I have never seen a better plan than the EV rates. Your mileage may vary.

I used to put my hypotheticals into spreadsheets and compare all the rate plans but the simplest rank order listing of all the choices always concluded that the EV plan was the best. I still log the critical data monthly from my bills but have not seen a better alternative.
 

Ampster

Active Member
Oct 5, 2012
1,779
477
Kenwood, California
right, but without EV, I'm not charging at those low rates. I think both partial and peak are higher on EV plans
I totally missed the point that you were turning in your EV lease. I don't know enough about the other plans or your total consumption to make a recommendation.
 
Last edited:

ucmndd

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2016
6,656
12,510
California
Stay on EV-A as long as you possibly can. The Part-Peak generation credits are like gold compared to EV2-A. The Powerwalls will keep you from paying for Peak power if you set them that way.
Agree. EV-A plus Solar and powerwalls set to load shift during peak periods will be the best deal for you by far, even if you don’t have a lot of overnight off-peak consumption. Keep this plan as long as you possibly can.
 

holeydonut

Supporting Member
Jun 27, 2020
1,819
1,187
East Bay NorCal
Just bogarting this random thread to point out that PG&E is submitting a proposal to raise electricity rates up to 25% from 2023 to 2026. And gas rates up 45% in the same span.


And as we've seen in their previous rate hikes, the non-CARE folks with EVs on EV2-A and with solar on E-TOU-C are seeing the most increases compared to the "average" ratepayer who was on E1 or some CARE plan. So if you don't already have solar and batteries, get on that bandwagon fast! And if you can convert your heating to electric that's even better.

But I guess cooking with gas tastes so much better... so maybe you'll just need to keep gas there for the yum yums.
 

MJ_CA_2019

Member
Aug 19, 2020
147
35
Central CA
Just bogarting this random thread to point out that PG&E is submitting a proposal to raise electricity rates up to 25% from 2023 to 2026. And gas rates up 45% in the same span.


And as we've seen in their previous rate hikes, the non-CARE folks with EVs on EV2-A and with solar on E-TOU-C are seeing the most increases compared to the "average" ratepayer who was on E1 or some CARE plan. So if you don't already have solar and batteries, get on that bandwagon fast! And if you can convert your heating to electric that's even better.

But I guess cooking with gas tastes so much better... so maybe you'll just need to keep gas there for the yum yums.
+1 and also agree with the OP staying on the EV rate schedule.

I don't have an EV and have gas heating (with SoCal Gas, not PG&E) but am considering going to heat pumps when I replace my AC, replacing my gas water heater with an electric hybrid and voluntarily moving to EV2-A (am currently on TOU-B). No plans to add an EV.
Evaluate my level of crazy please. :)
 

holeydonut

Supporting Member
Jun 27, 2020
1,819
1,187
East Bay NorCal
+1 and also agree with the OP staying on the EV rate schedule.

I don't have an EV and have gas heating (with SoCal Gas, not PG&E) but am considering going to heat pumps when I replace my AC, replacing my gas water heater with an electric hybrid and voluntarily moving to EV2-A (am currently on TOU-B). No plans to add an EV.
Evaluate my level of crazy please. :)

There's another thread about this... posted my thoughts here:

For now, I think it comes down to whether or not you think you'll be able to get enough solar to be a net producer on the year. And whether you'll have enough batteries to let you ride through the 3pm to midnight shoulder+peak time under EV2A (or similar TOU plans where the peak and off-peak have a huge differential).

What's tougher to predict is how being exposed to IOUs will evolve. It seems every 3 years PG&E takes repeated shots at "wealthy" homeowners with solar and batteries. You're basically investing your money now with Tesla (or whoever your PV+ESS seller is) to delay the inevitable since you know PG&E is coming for your $. The only way around this is to be like that one dude who spent like $300k to get a 300 kWh Tesla Powerpack and monster solar installed on his property. Probably has propane for backup as well. Need to completely go off grid to get away from PG&E... and most people don't have enough land or money to pull this off.

PG&E's endgame is putting a meter on you your house that measures all energy you use regardless of where it comes from or what form it's in (gas or electric). Then charging you for that energy at the rates they deem necessary to offset their ridiculous cost structure. Any excess juice you may send back to them will be punished, so you end up just taking energy from them and generating as little as possible. This endgame may not happen for 20+ years, but it'll happen one of these days.
 

gpez

Member
Apr 25, 2019
684
558
USA
What's tougher to predict is how being exposed to IOUs will evolve. It seems every 3 years PG&E takes repeated shots at "wealthy" homeowners with solar and batteries. You're basically investing your money now with Tesla (or whoever your PV+ESS seller is) to delay the inevitable since you know PG&E is coming for your $. The only way around this is to be like that one dude who spent like $300k to get a 300 kWh Tesla Powerpack and monster solar installed on his property. Probably has propane for backup as well. Need to completely go off grid to get away from PG&E... and most people don't have enough land or money to pull this off.

"How the Rich Can Escape America's Unreliable Power Grid"
 

MJ_CA_2019

Member
Aug 19, 2020
147
35
Central CA
There's another thread about this... posted my thoughts here:

For now, I think it comes down to whether or not you think you'll be able to get enough solar to be a net producer on the year. And whether you'll have enough batteries to let you ride through the 3pm to midnight shoulder+peak time under EV2A (or similar TOU plans where the peak and off-peak have a huge differential).

What's tougher to predict is how being exposed to IOUs will evolve. It seems every 3 years PG&E takes repeated shots at "wealthy" homeowners with solar and batteries. You're basically investing your money now with Tesla (or whoever your PV+ESS seller is) to delay the inevitable since you know PG&E is coming for your $. The only way around this is to be like that one dude who spent like $300k to get a 300 kWh Tesla Powerpack and monster solar installed on his property. Probably has propane for backup as well. Need to completely go off grid to get away from PG&E... and most people don't have enough land or money to pull this off.

PG&E's endgame is putting a meter on you your house that measures all energy you use regardless of where it comes from or what form it's in (gas or electric). Then charging you for that energy at the rates they deem necessary to offset their ridiculous cost structure. Any excess juice you may send back to them will be punished, so you end up just taking energy from them and generating as little as possible. This endgame may not happen for 20+ years, but it'll happen one of these days.
I won't be a net producer with my current home usage. I could speculate but I think my annual usage will go down when I a) get a variable speed pool pump b) replace my old AC units with efficient heat pumps. Will that be enough savings to offset also doing c) Hybrid electric water heater and d) the extra winter electric use from the heat pumps (vs the current NG furnace)?

Right now I have zero issues getting through my TOU-B peak period (4-9 pm); for example yesterday we used 20.7 kWh during the 4-9 peak period. PWs were at roughly 45% at that point and I keep a 10% reserve. This was a 76.8 kWh usage day. Off peak PV production was 43.9 out of the 59.4 daily total.
Algorithm is doing its job pretty well... Off peak PV export was 1.9 kWh and all 15.6 kWh of peak production was exported.
 

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