Phantom braking so bad I want to return my car

[tm1v2]

Tesla: We will be pushing an OTA update in the next 10 days.
Honda: Bring your car into the dealer for an update sometime in the next 6 months, which should take less than 5 hours while you drink bad coffee and watch Fox News.

@drtimhill Seriously good point there. With the deep software complexity of all cars these days, OTA update support feels like an essential feature. Thinking back on our recent car shopping, OTA update support was a criteria we cared about, and it did factor into a Tesla being our top choice (again). And our #2 choice is probably the #2 automaker at doing OTA updates currently...I'm seeing a pattern there.

I'm also fearing the day when we learn of cars with deeply embedded virus/attacker infections via their OTA mechanisms. Still, I think the benefits of OTA in modern cars are too great to be scared of them. Automakers need to take software security seriously. Which surely they do...surely...

 

[sleepydoc]

OTA update support feels like an essential feature.

It's the kind of feature that you appreciate even more when you have to take your other car into the dealer and wait for 3 hours while they update the software.

 

[SFNM Jack]

ACB (Ass Clenching Braking)?

I’m the guy that always says, “I’m one of the lucky ones…my car doesn’t do this”. Well, after an update last night to 2022.4.5.3 I had an “ACB” today…. Effin NUTS!…. 75 - 40 in a second before I could jam the accelerator to the floor and GTF out of the way. This happened in the fast lane on I25 with a very large truck on my a$$… Not funny Mr. Musk. Fix it!!!

I just filed with the NHTSA…. Wife and pups in car…. Could have been a disaster For my family.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Ummm, that is exactly what it is says.

IF you read what you quoted yourself it says "If you accelerate hard while AEB is applying the brakes". It does not say "if you are accelerating hard BEFORE AEB applies the brakes AEB will not activate"

As much as I bitch and moan about PB, I think Tesla has some top notch safety systems... I just want them to perfect them before releasing them to the public.

Not sure how this can be misinterpreted. AEB works a lot better than you think it does.

Keith

Well, all I know is that before Tesla introduced the Obstacle Aware Acceleration (read the manual on it), people were crashing their cars into walls by mistaking the accelerator pedal with the brake pedal. AEB did nothing about it (contrary to what you are saying).
Tesla V9 Has New Feature To Prevent Unintended Acceleration

 

[Electroman]

I’m the guy that always says, “I’m one of the lucky ones…my car doesn’t do this”. Well, after an update last night to 2022.4.5.3 I had an “ACB” today…. Effin NUTS!…. 75 - 40 in a second before I could jam the accelerator to the floor and GTF out of the way. This happened in the fast lane on I25 with a very large truck on my a$$… Not funny Mr. Musk. Fix it!!!

I just filed with the NHTSA…. Wife and pups in car…. Could have been a disaster For my family.

I am confused, is this happening only when in Autopilot or even when driven manually.

If it is happening in AP, then don't use AP. Then you are on par with all other manufacturers, as very few people use the intelligent cruise in other cars.

 

[GenralSpecific]

I am confused, is this happening only when in Autopilot or even when driven manually.

If it is happening in AP, then don't use AP. Then you are on par with all other manufacturers, as very few people use the intelligent cruise in other cars.

This is nuts. “Don’t use autopilot”… “very few people use intelligent cruise”… it’s one of the major selling points of the car! What the heck. Also, did you read the rest of the thread? It happens in both TACC and Autopilot.
It’s a shitshow. My ‘22 MYP freaks out if there’s any large vehicle in oncoming lane on a 2-lane, even some normal sized trucks (F150) and, I *sugar* you not, even some mailboxes and intersections. Repeatable. It’ll slow down markedly each time.

 

[CyberGus]

 

[SFNM Jack]

I am confused, is this happening only when in Autopilot or even when driven manually.

If it is happening in AP, then don't use AP. Then you are on par with all other manufacturers, as very few people use the intelligent cruise in other cars.

TACC

 

[sleepydoc]

If it is happening in AP, then don't use AP. Then you are on par with all other manufacturers, as very few people use the intelligent cruise in other cars.

What are you talking about? ‘Intelligent cruise’ (i.e. adaptive cruise) is pretty much a standard feature any more and people use it all the time.

Also, Tesla considers TACC part of AP and they have no ‘dumb’ cruise option, so if you ‘don’t use AP’ then you have no cruise control at all, meaning Tesla is lacking a feature that’s been standard in every other car for 20 years. @GenralSpecific is correct - tesla advertises and markets these features. We have a right to expect them to work.

 

[SilentWarp]

Not just Tesla. From today...
(again, no one injured, just freaked out) EDIT: 6 of the 278 reported minor injuries (or whatever their lawyers told them to report ).
Honda is a radar-based system

Over 1.7M Hondas probed for unexpected automatic braking

U.S. auto safety regulators are investigating complaints that the automatic emergency braking systems on more than 1.7 million newer Hondas can stop the vehicles for no reason

abcnews.go.com

 

[MP3Mike]

Not just Tesla. From today...
(again, no one injured, just freaked out)

View attachment 773643

Actually according to NHTSA there were 6 crashes with injuries that were reported as a result of the Honda phantom braking.

 

[sleepydoc]

Actually according to NHTSA there were 6 crashes with injuries that were reported as a result of the Honda phantom braking.

Did you see what the injuries were/how they occurred?

 

[MP3Mike]

Did you see what the injuries were/how they occurred?

The NHTSA release didn't include those details, but you might be able to dig through the 238 reports on the NHTSA site and see if the complaint included details of the injuries. (vs. just indicating that there were injuries.)

 

[SilentWarp]

The NHTSA release didn't include those details, but you might be able to dig through the 238 reports on the NHTSA site and see if the complaint included details of the injuries. (vs. just indicating that there were injuries.)

Yeah, in link above.. "In six cases, owners told the agency the problem caused collisions with minor injuries."

 

[sleepydoc]

Yeah, in link above.. "In six cases, owners told the agency the problem caused collisions with minor injuries."

My guess is it lead to fender benders when they got rear-ended after stopping suddenly. I would also guess that the actual number is much higher since all we’re seeing here is the cases that people actually report.

 

[SilentWarp]

My guess is it lead to fender benders when they got rear-ended after stopping suddenly.

I think more along the lines that since a rear-ender is 100% not at-fault of the Tesla owner, he figures what the hell... pain and suffering. Cha-ching.

 

[sleepydoc]

I think more along the lines that since a rear-ender is 100% not at-fault of the Tesla owner, he figures what the hell... pain and suffering. Cha-ching.

yeah, I'm sure threre's a bit of that, too. (this was in Honda's though.)

I just looked for the actual NHTSA report/investigation and couldn't find anything. The article didn't give a link, either.

 

[Fourdoor]

Well, all I know is that before Tesla introduced the Obstacle Aware Acceleration (read the manual on it), people were crashing their cars into walls by mistaking the accelerator pedal with the brake pedal. AEB did nothing about it (contrary to what you are saying).
Tesla V9 Has New Feature To Prevent Unintended Acceleration

My example of AEB saving the day for my wife was in our Chevy Bolt, the Tesla system is undoubtedly different. It probably only engages if there is a speed differential above a certain threshold, but since detailed breakdowns of how the systems work are not available other than the short non technical blurbs in the owners manual we will probably never know how these systems actually work. I read up on Obstacle Aware Acceleration before my car was delivered... I am one of those freaks who read the entire owners manual before I received my car.

Keith

PS: Should I feel dirty for liking your post after Whitewi did?

PPS: The weirdest thing in the world to me is that I get along with WhiteWi in any thread where PB isn't mentioned... one of the reasons I don't put people on "ignore" is that outside of certain topics that trigger them, most people on these forums are reasonable.

 

[Fourdoor]

I think more along the lines that since a rear-ender is 100% not at-fault of the Tesla owner, he figures what the hell... pain and suffering. Cha-ching.

Brake checking is illegal, and in our modern time with the proliferation of dash cams it is much more likely to be judged as the car in front's fault than the car in the rear IF the car in the rear has a dash cam that shows you braking for no reason causing the collision.

If the car in the rear does not have a dash cam, you can just deny that the car aggressively braked for no reason, claiming that you hit the brakes for a squirrel in the road or some other excuse.

Keith

 

[PACEMD]

Ok, serious question, is phantom breaking just a modern high-tech version of ghostbusting? And what about all that phantom barking that gets mentioned here? How does that play in?