problems in the European delivery hell

[nervus]

The delivery of the M3 in Europe is currently somewhat chaotic. That is not a big problem, but a bit irritating.
The route to delivery is much more difficult: Tesla asks for the final payment to be made at the latest 7 days before delivery.
Of course I understand that it is easier and faster for the delivery process if the final sum is already credited. But the banking procedures (especially in the Netherlands, where I live) are fully automated and fast (fast as in: when I order to transfer 64,000 euros to the account of Tesla via the website of my bank, this amount is less than 15 minutes later in the bank account of Tesla).
Why do I have to hand over money so early, without the goods being transferred? Especially since I have now received a final bill with VIN but WITHOUT delivery date.
Because of the aforementioned chaos, telephone consultation with the delivery team is almost impossible (phone waiting times of more than 1 hour are not unusual at the moment).
Tesla has to do something about the following:

1. improved telephone accessibility
   
2. final account with VIN and fixed date for delivery
3. better take into account the peculiarities of the local payment methods

If they don't, it will bite them in the end

 

[355rockit]

Same issues you described occurred for US December deliveries. Impossible to get reply from delivery specialist and final MVPA ~2-3 days prior to delivery. I paid via ACH online, but some brought a cashier's/Bank check or personal check on day of delivery. Not sure if this can be done in your region.

 

[nervus]

Same issues you described occurred for US December deliveries. Impossible to get reply from delivery specialist and final MVPA ~2-3 days prior to delivery. I paid via ACH online, but some brought a cashier's/Bank check or personal check on day of delivery. Not sure if this can be done in your region.

... checks are not a thing over here (since the sixties, if memory serves ).
I already have prepared the payment, so I can pay within 5 minutes by direct bank transfer.
I am not too worried for an intervention by Tesla going bankrupt , BUT what IS a problem is the indifference (or perhaps ignorance?) regarding the customs in the financial field in Europe.
My dear wife just made me clear that I would be a fool for paying without the goods already being delivered

 

[ewoodrick]

...
My dear wife just made me clear that I would be a fool for paying without the goods already being delivered

Yea, but she thinks that you are a fool for getting the car in the first place

Sure, the requirements sound a little more stringent than the US, not sure what other S and X deliveries in EU required.
But I'm sure that if you don't want the car, Tesla will be happy to put you at the back of the line.

I paid before I got the car with an electronic transfer. I don't regret it.

Your Choice

 

[nervus]

Yea, but she thinks that you are a fool for getting the car in the first place

Most certainly not, she is driving a small EV herself (see my Sig). She is however a prudent dutch housewife I just kicked out my trusty smoking Diesel (Renault CC) last week.

Sure, the requirements sound a little more stringent than the US, not sure what other S and X deliveries in EU required.
But I'm sure that if you don't want the car, Tesla will be happy to put you at the back of the line.

Never said I do not want the car: I reserved early 2016.

I paid before I got the car with an electronic transfer.

Well, I will do the same. However, my point is: if you want to sell cars in a somewhat different region you should be in line with the local habits. The model S and X were almost exclusively sold to people who bought "for business"; the 3 goes to private individuals, mostly. That is a totally different market and has totally different rules.

 

[StellarRat]

In the US I didn't pay until I picked up the car. I had a cashiers check for the amount they told me I still owed and I gave it to them at the delivery "ceremony". So, I did in fact see my car in the delivery bay waiting for me on the very same day I paid for it.

 

[Needsdecaf]

I feel your pain. Taking delivery here in the US this past December was an absolute nightmare. Because of our stupid dealer laws, here in TX you must pay before they will release the car from California. And they will not take wire transfer, only check. Or they would take wire transfer, but they said it would be "longer" and that meant I would not meet end of year cutoff.

Getting people on phone was next to impossible. They wouldn't follow through, and then they acted like I needed to get my act together and act fast when they were the ones causing the delay.

I really hope Tesla sorts this out. It's a joke.

 

[AustinPowers]

It indeed is a joke. Over here you pay for goods when they are delivered, not before.
Otherwise what would be Tesla's incentive to deliver the vehicle at all, or at least in an adequate state?

Once you give them the money without having the car, you are at their mercy.
Not a pleasant thought, especially considering the chaos Tesla is in right now.

And about checks: like in the Netherlands, over here no one pays by check either, and not for many years.
When I was an apprentice at the bank I was one of the last ones to even learn how to handle checks, and most of those were Amex Travellers' cheques.
By the way, that was over twenty years ago!

 

[TeeEmCee]

I feel your pain. Taking delivery here in the US this past December was an absolute nightmare. Because of our stupid dealer laws, here in TX you must pay before they will release the car from California. And they will not take wire transfer, only check. Or they would take wire transfer, but they said it would be "longer" and that meant I would not meet end of year cutoff.

Getting people on phone was next to impossible. They wouldn't follow through, and then they acted like I needed to get my act together and act fast when they were the ones causing the delay.

I really hope Tesla sorts this out. It's a joke.

Tesla will not sort anything out under the current leadership, not until they are subject to some serious competition.
I too paid in full for a car that I had not seen beforehand, and which turned out to be a complete turd quality-wise. I would not do that again and I would certainly not encourage anyone to do so.

 

[WileyTheMan]

Is this a different paying process than with the S or X over in the EU?

 

[Knightshade]

It indeed is a joke. Over here you pay for goods when they are delivered, not before.
Otherwise what would be Tesla's incentive to deliver the vehicle at all, or at least in an adequate state?

As noted in the US there's a number of states where it's not even legal to take delivery of a Tesla prior to payment (because it's not legal to sell the car in that state- so you have to "buy" it out of state, and then they can deliver it to you in your state).


The company can't recognize the net revenue from the sale until they have delivered the product...so taking your money without delivering a car puts a liability on Teslas books in the amount of your payment for the undelivered car- so they still have significant incentive to deliver (and really none NOT to)

You also have the right to reject the car on delivery if it's not satisfactory- causing even further cost/churn/problems for Tesla (so again they have incentive).

 

[jjrandorin]

It indeed is a joke. Over here you pay for goods when they are delivered, not before.
Otherwise what would be Tesla's incentive to deliver the vehicle at all, or at least in an adequate state?

Once you give them the money without having the car, you are at their mercy.
Not a pleasant thought, especially considering the chaos Tesla is in right now.

And about checks: like in the Netherlands, over here no one pays by check either, and not for many years.
When I was an apprentice at the bank I was one of the last ones to even learn how to handle checks, and most of those were Amex Travellers' cheques.
By the way, that was over twenty years ago!

There is a difference in "check" and "Cashiers check" here in the US. I suspect that there is a difference internationally too, but I dont know.

"Check" usually means "personal check" which is basically out of use here except for specific circumstances (I pay my gardener with a personal check for example.. only check I write).

"Cashiers check" = a check issued by a BANK that is guaranteed by the bank. This is a check the specific bank guarantees will cash, so is basically like paying cash, without walking around with it. Do they not have cashier's checks in the Netherlands? Its uncommon here in the US to pay by cashiers check, except for large purchases like cars etc when you dont want to wire the money BEFORE you take possession of a good.

 

[nervus]

There is a difference in "check" and "Cashiers check" here in the US. I suspect that there is a difference internationally too, but I dont know.
<snipped>
Do they not have cashier's checks in the Netherlands? Its uncommon here in the US to pay by cashiers check, except for large purchases like cars etc when you dont want to wire the money BEFORE you take possession of a good.

That type of check does not exist here for private banking. I know from the past that companies did make use of it (my father once had a business transaction from guilders to D-mark, using such a check in the 70's; he told me because it was the first time in his life he had more than a million guilders in his hand ). This type of transaction now goes via Internet banking: you pay on the spot using an internet connection and the seller checks with his bank whether the amount has been transferred. As noted earlier: this whole process is a matter of minutes here.

 

[nervus]

Is this a different paying process than with the S or X over in the EU?

I would not know, but even if it is the same procedure, the category of customers is different. Personally I belong to the better situated dutch citizens, the car will not be registered for business use but is strictly for private use. This leads to a big difference concerning taxes to be paid annually (and you guessed it probably already: that is a heavy burden).

 

[Thomas_K]

Owning a Model S and a Model X, I have had to deal with Tesla in Norway for coming up on five years. They have had their issues, but the state of things have never been as bad as they are now. They are running around like headless chickens, and not one customer Model 3 has been delivered yet. Not ONE!

Regarding my Model 3 Performance order I have now recived two final invoices and three credit notes on my Tesla account. I have recieved two SMS (despite the fact that I have de-selected the SMS option in my contact info) about paying for my Model 3. I called Tesla to ask what payment info to use and sat 43 minutes in a phone queue before I gave up. Called again, left message. No one called me back. (going on five days now)
I then got an e-mail saying just to pay my final invoice or they could not schedule delivery.
I replied, "Which of the final invoices?", and then silence...

So, maybe despite better judgement, I paid to the account number that I used when paying for my Model X and used the tag from Final Invoice 2. Sent Tesla an e-mail with a reciept and have since heard nothing. No delivery info. Nothing.

All the while people ordering LRs in january of this year with no reservation and not being previous owners are getting their cars as soon as this coming saturday...

 

[ssdshirt]

I read somewhere the delivery team is happy with a proof of transaction the moment you pick up the car. I understand your impatience (I am impatient as well), but I would give them (Tesla) some credit.

If you'd ordered another brand of car, there's no way you'd be tracking it over land and sea like we are all doing right now. We'd just wait for the call or e-mail of the dealership when we can pick up our vehicle.

And if we'd be more patient, the waiting time on the phone would be a lot less as well.

 

[Alfred]

There is a difference in "check" and "Cashiers check" here in the US. I suspect that there is a difference internationally too, but I dont know.

"Check" usually means "personal check" which is basically out of use here except for specific circumstances (I pay my gardener with a personal check for example.. only check I write).

"Cashiers check" = a check issued by a BANK that is guaranteed by the bank. This is a check the specific bank guarantees will cash, so is basically like paying cash, without walking around with it. Do they not have cashier's checks in the Netherlands? Its uncommon here in the US to pay by cashiers check, except for large purchases like cars etc when you dont want to wire the money BEFORE you take possession of a good.

In Switzerland this is similar. "Bank checks" (Cashiers Checks) are used for large transfers (buying houses e.g.) where the payment has to be handed over in front of some contract management authority, such as a "Notariat" (office handling property transfers, testaments) or a lawyer in similar capacity. In some cases the bank will be even present in person for the handover.

Cars I bought recently were all bought by bank transfer before pick-up. How far ahead that has to be done, depends on the bank and the receivers accounts office - they have to be able to find the money on time in their accounts... The choice of timing was left to me.
Normal transfers would go out in my case next day, if posted after 1100 a.m. and not on a weekend. Businesses can have of course other conditions.

According to my invoice Tesla asks for payment 7 days ahead of pickup.So that seems reasonable and is no different from what I had to do in practice with other car purchases - considering weekends, sleeping accountants etc. in between.

 

[Thomas_K]

I read somewhere the delivery team is happy with a proof of transaction the moment you pick up the car. I understand your impatience (I am impatient as well), but I would give them (Tesla) some credit.

Not correct. Funds need to be in Tesla account and verified by Tesla before they will release the car. Unless you are borrowing with a Tesla affiliate, in which case you can sign papers at delivery.
And credit for what?

If you'd ordered another brand of car, there's no way you'd be tracking it over land and sea like we are all doing right now. We'd just wait for the call or e-mail of the dealership when we can pick up our vehicle.

We can´t track squat. We can guess.
Ordered BMW. Got e-mails every step of the way. Production start. Production end. Ready for shipment. Shipped. Arrived in Norway. Customs done. Shipped to dealer. Then phonecall to schedule delivery.

And if we'd be more patient, the waiting time on the phone would be a lot less as well.

Patience has nothing to do with this.
If Tesla had any control each customer would recive one invoice, one e-mail/phonecall scheduling delivery. Thats it.
And if, when they screwed this up, they had sent e-mail/SMS to inform customers of errors in the system, they would not have a 43+ minute queue on their phones.

 

[Toumal]

If you'd ordered another brand of car, there's no way you'd be tracking it over land and sea like we are all doing right now. We'd just wait for the call or e-mail of the dealership when we can pick up our vehicle.

This.
I want my M3 today like everyone else, but that's just not how this works, and not only at Tesla.

I had to wait 5 months (!) for my Zoe. This wasn't a new car or anything, and it shipped from France and not the US. My initial wait time was said to be 4-6 weeks. Then it was 8 weeks and they said that the car would be produced soon. Then nothing for over a month. Then success, the car is being produced! Oh wait no, not yet. Or maybe yes? Conflicting information time and time again. Then I got told I'd be able to get the car in 2 weeks time. I called on the day before to check and lo and behold, no car. It turned out the car hadn't even been built yet. Then another month of wait time during which another delivery date came and went.

Finally after 5 months it arrived. "Here's your car, have a nice drive." No explanation, nothing.

This is Renault, an "established" car manufacturer. They didn't know where the car was, gave me multiple delivery dates which didn't happen.

 

[Knightshade]

We can´t track squat. We can guess.
Ordered BMW. Got e-mails every step of the way. Production start. Production end. Ready for shipment. Shipped. Arrived in Norway. Customs done. Shipped to dealer. Then phonecall to schedule delivery.

Patience has nothing to do with this.
If Tesla had any control each customer would recive one invoice, one e-mail/phonecall scheduling delivery. Thats it.
And if, when they screwed this up, they had sent e-mail/SMS to inform customers of errors in the system, they would not have a 43+ minute queue on their phones.

Yup.

Similar experience having custom ordered from Lexus BTW- emails at each step with specifics, details, and dates, and always correct.


Sadly neither Lexus nor BMW make any new vehicle I want anymore, hence I had to put up with the utter crap non-accountability of the Tesla delivery mess.