Software Update 2018.24.1 12dd099

[ZoomFPV]

Understand. My point was, I wonder if the Insurance company would see it that way? Heaven forbid someone bypassing a safety feature like in this case and actually got into an accident (and still paying just as much attention as without it) and the device (water bottle in this case) was still attached to the steering wheel so with out a question was bypassing a safety feature. Would the insurance company (maybe looking at $100's of thousands in liability damage) find a good reason to deny the claim?

(disclaimer, I do NOT use water bottles for my AP) There is no way they can prove a bottle was used, no internal camera, bottle will not be on the wheel anymore after the accident as it easily comes off. especially if you use the AP friendly smaller bottles LOL

 

[Asterix187]

(disclaimer, I do NOT use water bottles for my AP) There is no way they can prove a bottle was used, no internal camera, bottle will not be on the wheel anymore after the accident as it easily comes off. especially if you use the AP friendly smaller bottles LOLView attachment 315725

Thats assuming you haven't just told the whole world via a public forum you use a water bottle to counteract a safety feature which will invalidate any AP related (in not any) insurance claim you may have.

 

[tktktk]

After this update, has anyone driven behind a motorcycle? Last Friday, I was driving 2-3 car lengths behind one at approx 30mph (not on AP) and there was a glitch where it looked as if I was crashing into the motorcycle repeatedly over the course of following it for a mile. I think it happened 3x. Each time it happened the vehicle turned red on the display, looked as if it was nearing my car, sounded the 'crash alert' noise.....
Reported it to Tesla so they have it....

 

[ZoomFPV]

Thats assuming you haven't just told the whole world via a public forum you use a water bottle to counteract a safety feature which will invalidate any AP related (in not any) insurance claim you may have.

He needs to learn how to use a disclaimer like my post

 

[ZoomFPV]

After this update, has anyone driven behind a motorcycle? Last Friday, I was driving 2-3 car lengths behind one at approx 30mph (not on AP) and there was a glitch where it looked as if I was crashing into the motorcycle repeatedly over the course of following it for a mile. I think it happened 3x. Each time it happened the vehicle turned red on the display, looked as if it was nearing my car, sounded the 'crash alert' noise.....
Reported it to Tesla so they have it....

I am on 21.9 and the car now freaks out when motorcycle passes between traffic . The car slams the brakes when this happens. It does not "rubber band" like it used to.

 

[S100D]

Just because folks disable the nags does not mean they aren't holding the wheel and paying attention. Some just get tired of the nags for not holding the wheel Tesla's way.

The only reason to disable the nags is to drive hands free. When I got my S85D with AP1, you did not need to hold the steering wheel until an idiot got in the back seat and did a YouTube video of the car driving itself with no one in the driver's seat. The idiot woman that was texting and slammed into the back of a fire truck doing 60 mph was not keeping her hands on the week and had her head up her A$$.

Needing to apply a little torque on the wheel as the AP makes slight steering changes takes little to no effort. I have driven over 3,000 miles on autopilot and had very few if any nags on my AP2 S90D. If you have a nag elimination device on your steering wheel, you are not paying as much attention and you do not have to keep your hands on the wheel. When the insurance company denies your claim for your 100+ thousand dollar Tesla and you are responsible for millions of dollars in personal liability, that driver will blame the autopilot and Tesla will look in the logs and say, you had a nag elimination device on your steering wheel. At that point, it will not matter if your hands were on the wheel or not, you are the Driver In Command and are totally responsible.

Hopefully in 2 years we will have FSD and this will eliminate the requirement to have your hands on the steering wheel. Until then, I will keep my hands on the wheel and not use nag elimination devices.

 

[NewTMSMan]

Well I am going to guess many who are posting about insurance claims are not attorneys. The area this would generally fall into is comparative negligence and the insurance company would likely try to reduce your claim if you did have a device employed to reduce or eliminate the nags, and that can be proven. As the device does not defeat any active safety device, but simply reduces or eliminates a warning, this becomes even less of an issue from an insurance perspective.

In the end you are responsible to operate the vehicle in a safe manner regardless of nags, devices, etc. That responsibility does not change if you use a water bottle or not and the associated liability changes only if you are found to have been negligent.


DISCLAIMER: I am also not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
FURTHER DISCLAIMER: I lied about the hotel stay

 

[S100D]

(disclaimer, I do NOT use water bottles for my AP) There is no way they can prove a bottle was used, no internal camera, bottle will not be on the wheel anymore after the accident as it easily comes off. especially if you use the AP friendly smaller bottles LOLView attachment 315725

Telsa can tell you had a nag elimination device on your steering wheel because of the constant torque in one direction. Taking it off if you have an accident will not fool the data that Tesla downloads from your car.

 

[MelaniainLA]

(disclaimer, I do NOT use water bottles for my AP) There is no way they can prove a bottle was used, no internal camera, bottle will not be on the wheel anymore after the accident as it easily comes off. especially if you use the AP friendly smaller bottles LOLView attachment 315725

Bad accident = airbag deployment = water bottle turned into high-velocity projectile aimed point blank at your heart = instant death

I’ve done a ton of trauma surgery and transplant surgery — high velocity blunt trauma to center of chest is an easy way to go.

 

[NewTMSMan]

Telsa can tell you had a nag elimination device on your steering wheel because of the constant torque in one direction. Taking it off if you have an accident will not fool the data that Tesla downloads from your car.

As opposed to having my hand hanging on the wheel in the same position for miles on end (which is how I use AP)? Doubtful.

Bad accident = airbag deployment = water bottle turned into high-velocity projectile aimed point blank at your heart = instant death

I’ve done a ton of trauma surgery and transplant surgery — high velocity blunt trauma to center of chest is an easy way to go.

Where exactly do you think people are putting the water bottle? If anything the water bottle will be launched away from you and possibly toward you legs with an airbag deployment.

 

[ChrML]

I think it's strange people think holding little torque on the wheel is so very exhausting that it's less effort to write a long post on dumb Tesla implemented it. Yet a 0.5kg water bottle seems to do the job.

 

[rnortman]

I think it's strange people think holding little torque on the wheel is so very exhausting that it's less effort to write a long post on dumb Tesla implemented it. Yet a 0.5kg water bottle seems to do the job.

My complaint is that while you can easily hook one thumb over the wheel at 7 o'clock to convince Autopilot that you're awake, if you have two hands at 9 and 3 they balance each other out and you get nags. Furthermore, the visual nags cannot be seen if your eyes are on the road where they belong, so then you get the beeps. After 3 beeps, you're locked out of autopilot.

In short, the nag system discourages the safest practice, which is two hands on the wheel and two eyes on the road, and virtually forces you into driving with only one hand on the wheel or else staring at the screen so you see the visual nags.

 

[SeBsZ]

I wonder if the 2018.24.7 d133af3 that's now on Teslafi is just for the Model 3 or has anything new.

 

[brkaus]

Bad accident = airbag deployment = water bottle turned into high-velocity projectile aimed point blank at your heart = instant death

I’ve done a ton of trauma surgery and transplant surgery — high velocity blunt trauma to center of chest is an easy way to go.

So, an orange would be healthier. Fresh squeezed


(yes, I know a high velocity projectile is still a high velocity projectile, even if softer like an orange... I would not personally use any of these methods).

 

[milleron]

Well I am going to guess many who are posting about insurance claims are not attorneys. The area this would generally fall into is comparative negligence and the insurance company would likely try to reduce your claim

Might you be talking about contributory negligence?

 

[dwploc]

Every time I read about someone who jury rigs a mechanism so they don't have to keep hands on the wheel I think about Darwin Awards. Chlorinating The Gene Pool. Folks get what they deserve. At least we will chlorinate the gene pool ;-)

 

[conman]

Reported it to Tesla so they have it....

Meaning you contributed another bugreport to the void. Tesla haven't been able to manage feedback in years thanks to the size of their fleet now so they stopped listening ages ago I'm afraid.

 

[ahkahn]

Every time I read about someone who jury rigs a mechanism so they don't have to keep hands on the wheel I think about Darwin Awards. Chlorinating The Gene Pool. Folks get what they deserve. At least we will chlorinate the gene pool ;-)

You guys all crack me up!! Equating using a bottle of water to negligence. I find them to be mutually exclusive. You see, one can still be an aware, defensive, and cautious driver and STILL be hands off! There has been several years and millions of miles of Tesla Autopilot data proving that being completely hands-off is safe driving (not to mention my personal 30k+ miles on Autopilot).

Now, I agree that any idiot who decides to enable Autopilot and then jump into the back seat, take a nap, watch a movie, or whatever else the handful of morons have done deserve to win Darwin awards... but let's not conflate the two. Please!

 

[Joe F]

Those who seem compelled to keep both hands on the wheel at highway speeds, thinking it’s somehow “safer,” have to explain what, at speed, they need to turn the wheel more than a few degrees for to avoid hitting. A maneuver that can be done with one hand. On highways, you know, where AP is supposed to be used per Tesla.

I doubt anyone here has ever had to crank their steering wheel with two hands at speed and lived to tell about it. IMHO.

 

[bmah]

This is the thread for discussing the 2018.24.1 software update. Let’s not derail this thread with talk of nags and nag defeating strategies.

Thanks,

Bruce.