Staggering amount of issues found at/after delivery. Considering returning the car.

[MXWing]

When you put it that way, it all makes perfect sense!

Your comment reminded me of this:

What I was referring to. A mandatory education for both my son and daughter. Daughter has to know her position on the line to know what she can get away with.

 

[SoCalGuy]

@fnce_prof sorry that this didn't turn out better for you. I'm sure if Elon reads this thread he'd be embarrassed for Tesla.

I'm also embarrassed for all the fanboys (or fanpeople since I'm sure there are some women out there who are drinking the Tesla koolaid). They really damage the brand just as much as the terrible salesperson who you dealt with at the SC.

I'm awaiting my delivery for the M3 in the next few days. I still have no VIN and my third DA in two weeks who promised to call yesterday with VIN has yet to reach out. I'm giving him an extra day before I call Tesla. Their delivery and customer service operation lacks polish and consistency. It really is luck of the draw at the moment. I do hope Jerome rights this ship before Tesla does irreparable damage to its rep.

Anyway, take a day or two off TMC and see how you feel about Tesla. Then if you're still willing to give them a chance, reach out to the regional manager (ask your customer service line to escalate) and share with him/her your experience (always useful to have a written chronology with names and dates/times). See how they treat you. If they fail, then Tesla doesn't deserve your business. Don't let anyone else convince you otherwise.

 

[Icer]

R/
Finance professor

I had my doubts from the top
Who would be this clueless?
Well, most likely Not a Finance Professor
College kid spending Dad's money, maybe.
But not even.

Then through the thread, everyone here stood up for
The Finance Professor, evidently very hard first day out in the world.

Neroden told him how to proceed, to fine detail, he got sympathy
and positive words for him, nobody said this is just okey dokey because Tesla.

First little bit of pushback he responds with the below
General Third Person Observer Anti-Tesla rant.
For a company the Finance professor was just willing to
give 60K?

Now the Finance Professor gonna buy a Chrysler Mini van?

That is when I laughed.
Heh. Classic Troll
Finance professor
Well done, kid.

This type of fanboyism is what turns people away from this brand.

First of all, any reputable car brand won't let this crap happen in the first place---all cars purchased from manufacturers will be meticulously examined and bad apples won't be delivered to customers. Delivering a crappy/damaged car to customers then taking it back isn't good customer service. It's crappy service because the customer is not supposed to get that crappy product in the first place.

Second, the sheer amount of incompetence, unprofessionalism and lack of communication is shocking for ANY COMPANY, not to mention an aspiring premium auto maker. I seriously doubt many of their target customers would tolerate this crap, having been accustomed to the stellar service from their competitors. Again, if we are paying premium dollars for a product, we expect the quality and service to match.

Tesla is currently lacking in both and yet in order to survive, they have to successfully steal large enough market share from premium auto makers. They have a lot to learn from them on both quality control and proper delivery experience. I doubt they will be able to get it right before 2019, so my money is solidly with their competitors. I'm not a Tesla fanboy or EV enthusiast. I just want a fun, premium car that drives well. For that I have a lot of choices, and with competing EVs coming out, my choice set is expanding every day.

They already successfully turned away one customer and I doubt I'll be the only one.

 

[jeffro01]

I'm also embarrassed for all the fanboys (or fanpeople since I'm sure there are some women out there who are drinking the Tesla koolaid). They really damage the brand just as much as the terrible salesperson who you dealt with at the SC..

What a load of crap... First of all, supporting Tesla doesn't need to come with a negative label and second, how are "fanboys" damaging the brand? If it weren't for enthusiasts there wouldn't be a brand to begin with...

Jeff

 

[MXWing]

R/
Finance professor

I had my doubts from the top
Who would be this clueless?
Well, most likely Not a Finance Professor
College kid spending Dad's money, maybe.
But not even.

Then through the thread, everyone here stood up for
The Finance Professor, evidently very hard first day out in the world.

Neroden told him how to proceed, to fine detail, he got sympathy
and positive words for him, nobody said this is just okey dokey because Tesla.

First little bit of pushback he responds with the below
General Third Person Observer Anti-Tesla rant.
For a company the Finance professor was just willing to
give 60K?

Now the Finance Professor gonna buy a Chrysler Mini van?

That is when I laughed.
Heh. Classic Troll
Finance professor
Well done, kid.

LOL

I DO NOT LIKE THEM IN A HOUSE.
I DO NOT LIKE THEM WITH A MOUSE.
I DO NOT LIKE THEM HERE OR THERE.
I DO NOT LIKE THEM ANYWHERE.
I DO NOT LIKE TESLA.
I DO NOT LIKE THEM, SAM-I-AM.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Get off your high horse for two freaking seconds... You are not entitled anything and never were in the first place. Should Tesla have delivered that car to you? No, absolutely not. Are you milking this for everything you possibly can? Absolutely.

Tesla took the car back, offered to build you a new one. What more did you want? A personal call from Elon?

Tesla isn't a perfect company, I'm quite frustrated myself trying to get ANYONE from Tesla to respond to a single email about my supposed Model X delivery coming up on Friday. That being said, my Model S is amazing and I couldn't ever see myself owning another car from another car brand ever again... Just the thought of having to navigate the BS that stealerships throw at you is nauseating enough.

The beauty here is everyone is free to make their own choices, no doubt. Enjoy your Audi that you can't take anywhere because there's no place to charge it...

Jeff

I can't really say much to the first part of your message as I didn't see the OP as being on his high horse. He made it perfectly clear he was a buyer with no allegiance to Tesla/EV's.

So he's basically a perfect text book case on what happens when a company ignores their customer after they get a bad product or have a bad experience.

A few days ago the CEO of the company I work for visited our site. He's a very "customer is always right" kind of CEO which is a bit different than me. Quite frankly I think some customers should be fired.

But, what rang true for me is he talked about the importance of customer communication. That as long as you don't ignore your customer they'll have a pretty good tolerance for mistakes. Now he didn't say this to excuse any mistakes, but just that inevitably mistakes do happen especially with large companies. But, what was beyond excusable is ignoring a customer. You never want them to feel isolate/forgotten/alone/etc.

Tesla to me up until recently has always been a mistake prone, but always extremely responsive. Where things were just so much easier than traditional dealers/manufactures.

Things like doing a recall check at the supercharger, and coming to my place of work to fix something on the car.

When I look at the Tesla customer satisfaction ranking I don't see that as a result of perfect cars. It's a result of their customer service especially at the SC's. Like you I was ignored before I took delivery so I emailed the service manager where I was taking delivery. In the past this person has always been extremely responsive, and she was again. I emailed at around 8pm at night, and she immediately forwarded the email to delivery specialist at the service center. This was extremely important to me as the answer dictated whether I would come back as planned or if I was extend my trip. I hadn't gotten confirmation from my delivery advisor for 3-4 days, and felt completely forgotten about.

When I picked up my new car it had a glaring defect.

So I had the choice of
1.) Walk away and keep my Model S
2.) Reject it and do the VIN lottery thing again, and hope I get a perfect car
3.) Do the due bill like they wanted and have it repaired

I picked #3.

I think it really came down to the customer service at the SC as the deciding factor.

It wasn't Elon as he's lost credability as far as I'm concerned.
It wasn't really the car as I really liked the Model S I had, and felt like I was betraying it. It was kinda difficult to walk away from it.

Sure I had reasons for the model 3, but not enough to jump through hoops for it.

If I had kept the Model S I probably would have traded it in on a Porsche Taycan.

You are correct in that the downside to a Porsche/Audi is the lack of superchargers, but that won't be for long. I would say an Audi/Porsche is really the only viable option to Tesla because the VW group (VW/Audi/Porsche) is the only one other than Tesla really committed to EV's.

 

[SoCalGuy]

What a load of crap... First of all, supporting Tesla doesn't need to come with a negative label and second, how are "fanboys" damaging the brand? If it weren't for enthusiasts there wouldn't be a brand to begin with...

Jeff

I think we disagree on what "supporting" means. I think you take it to mean "Tesla is always right, and those who have bad experiences must be at fault" (ie blame the victim) whereas I believe that support means not only acting as evangelist and biggest cheerleader for all the great things that the company has done/is doing but also recognizing blind spots and deficiencies in the business/organization and providing critical feedback even when it might result in short-term pain (e.g. negative press).

But what do I know - I'm just a customer (who's also built and sold two reasonably successful businesses).

 

[voip-ninja]

This type of fanboyism is what turns people away from this brand.

First of all, any reputable car brand won't let this crap happen in the first place---all cars purchased from manufacturers will be meticulously examined and bad apples won't be delivered to customers. Delivering a crappy/damaged car to customers then taking it back isn't good customer service. It's crappy service because the customer is not supposed to get that crappy product in the first place.

Second, the sheer amount of incompetence, unprofessionalism and lack of communication is shocking for ANY COMPANY, not to mention an aspiring premium auto maker. I seriously doubt many of their target customers would tolerate this crap, having been accustomed to the stellar service from their competitors. Again, if we are paying premium dollars for a product, we expect the quality and service to match.

Tesla is currently lacking in both and yet in order to survive, they have to successfully steal large enough market share from premium auto makers. They have a lot to learn from them on both quality control and proper delivery experience. I doubt they will be able to get it right before 2019, so my money is solidly with their competitors. I'm not a Tesla fanboy or EV enthusiast. I just want a fun, premium car that drives well. For that I have a lot of choices, and with competing EVs coming out, my choice set is expanding every day.

They already successfully turned away one customer and I doubt I'll be the only one.

Tesla needs this kind of feedback in order to do better.

I would not however be getting an e-tron. The most interesting EV to come out this year that is not made by Tesla is the Jaguar i-pace.

 

[N54TT]

First of all, any reputable car brand won't let this crap happen in the first place---all cars purchased from manufacturers will be meticulously examined and bad apples won't be delivered to customers. Delivering a crappy/damaged car to customers then taking it back isn't good customer service. It's crappy service because the customer is not supposed to get that crappy product in the first place.

Second, the sheer amount of incompetence, unprofessionalism and lack of communication is shocking for ANY COMPANY, not to mention an aspiring premium auto maker. I seriously doubt many of their target customers would tolerate this crap, having been accustomed to the stellar service from their competitors. Again, if we are paying premium dollars for a product, we expect the quality and service to match.

Tesla is currently lacking in both and yet in order to survive, they have to successfully steal large enough market share from premium auto makers. They have a lot to learn from them on both quality control and proper delivery experience. I doubt they will be able to get it right before 2019, so my money is solidly with their competitors. I'm not a Tesla fanboy or EV enthusiast. I just want a fun, premium car that drives well. For that I have a lot of choices, and with competing EVs coming out, my choice set is expanding every day.

They already successfully turned away one customer and I doubt I'll be the only one.

I get where you’re coming from...this is my first Tesla purchase too.

My last two car purchases were my BMW and my wife’s Lexus. Both of them premium experiences as I would expect...from walking into the dealership and picking up a vehicle on time, with ZERO paint defects, perfect panel gaps and ZERO QA issues. Lexus took a week to be transported from another dealer and BMW was a custom order, built in Germany and shipped to the states, that I waited only ~6 weeks for. With the BMW I was able to track when it got into production, as it went through production and then as it was shipped.

I ordered my P3D+ knowing I’m an early adaptor, buying from a company that in all intensive purposes is still in its infancy. With the amount of cars they’re producing and now trying to ship/sell....through a small amount of showrooms/service centers....they’re going through MAJOR growing pains....and I fully expect it won’t be as smooth as my other experiences. Should I accept that when I’m paying almost 80K?

I’m not a Tesla fanboy or EV enthusiast either.....(yet at least lol). I just want an AWD car that I can daily, is fast and can perform on weekend auto-x or HPDE events should I choose to. Sure I can get a c63, m3 or atsv for about the same price I’m paying now. (The p3d is actually better priced after the $9500 i get back from fed/state). BUT IMO they don’t compare in the package of daily usable power band, handling and comfort that the P3D gives. Throw in the savings of gas, convenience of charging at home and having a full charge (tank) every morning. There really isn’t anything out there right now that can compete. The other companies also won’t have the expansive charging network that Tesla currently has. In a few years....I’m sure there will be many options...but not right now.

It’s becuase of that I’m willing to give them almost 80K and tolerate some of the sub-premium experience. I’m willing to accept panel gaps...that can easily be fixed. I’m even willing to accept some paint issues....knowing I’m gonna fully polish/detail it anyway. No brand new car BTW comes without any swirl marks...dealers just don’t really know how to fully prep a car. If my car has issues that will need to be re-painted...that’s were I might have to draw the line and will have a tough time deciding if I’m just going to refuse the car.
I don’t expect everyone to be willing to compromise.....and it sucks you had such a bad experience. In the end they took the car back, gave you a full refund and have the option of placing a new order. I’m not sure any other company would be so willing to do that.

 

[jeffro01]

I think we disagree on what "supporting" means. I think you take it to mean "Tesla is always right, and those who have bad experiences must be at fault" (ie blame the victim) whereas I believe that support means not only acting as evangelist and biggest cheerleader for all the great things that the company has done/is doing but also recognizing blind spots and deficiencies in the business/organization and providing critical feedback even when it might result in short-term pain (e.g. negative press).

But what do I know - I'm just a customer (who's also built and sold two reasonably successful businesses).

Only I have NEVER said Tesla is always right... Quite the contrary actually...

Jeff

 

[MXWing]

I don't get why there has to be two extremes:

1 - Tesla can do nothing wrong.
2 - Tesla is complete wreck.

There is far more people who seem to think #2 over #1.

We know #1 is not true.

While #2 appears to be the case, I wish people would spend more time understanding the circumstances of what is causing the perception of #2 instead of just declaring Tesla a *sugar* company.

 

[fnce_prof]

This is what Tesla needs, specialized prep centers in key strategic locations where the cars are inspected and prepped before being shipped to dealerships. Tesla's local service centers can't inspect for s**t. This is why cars delivered by MB, BMW, etc. are pristine and we don't need to worry about the crappy quality issues---each car spends a week in these centers before going to dealerships so the bad apples would be eliminated and won't be delivered to pissed-off customers. Simple strategy. Mercedes cars spend 10 days in those.

Maybe I should tweet this to Musk.

 

[MXWing]

This is what Tesla needs, specialized prep centers in key strategic locations where the cars are inspected and prepped before being shipped to dealerships. Tesla's local service centers can't inspect for s**t. This is why cars delivered by MB, BMW, etc. are pristine and we don't need to worry about the crappy quality issues---each car spends a week in these centers before going to dealerships so the bad apples would be eliminated and won't be delivered to pissed-off customers. Simple strategy. Mercedes cars spend 10 days in those.

Maybe I should tweet this to Musk.

I agree. If Tesla would just quit trying to deliver so many cars, they could spend more time on each individual car. I wonder if Tesla can pull off a Spirit of Halloween and rent a former Sears lot in Fremont through 2018? All they need is a building and lot that can revolve 8,000 cars through in a 10 day window.

I think Tesla needs to hire a finance professor and fire the other 29,999 people over there that have no idea at all on what they are doing.

 

[Jedi2155]

The right attitude for the people that decided to cancel their order should something along the lines of:

"Sorry that Tesla could not earn your business with their current product and business practices. We hope that they will earn your business later on."

Tesla treated fnce_prof poorly at the most critical step of first impressions. He is not going to forget that experience, but at least Tesla owned up to it and refunded his vehicle purchase fixing it enough that it didn't completely ruin the experience where might consider it again in a few years when the dirt is settled.

Tesla has enough orders on its plates at the moment to deal with (but not enough RWD orders but that's a different story), as they ramp up, so the car is definitely not for everyone who might have different expectations. This is clearly the type of problems that I'm so concerned (my experience) about for Tesla as a company is that not everyone will accept the crap that they're currently doing. I'm a relatively early adopter, as is everyone who is buying the Model 3 in 2017 to 2019, but the general population will not stand this type of behavior.

They need to work on it, and work on it fast. There is a balance between providing enough deliveries to the cash-flow to avoid default and reducing quality which Tesla is clearly doing. I hope it isn't near so bad that they poison people's perception permanently.

That said, they still have my vote in terms of an amazing product that no one else can offer.

 

[omgwtfbyobbq]

View attachment 336197

I agree. If Tesla would just quit trying to deliver so many cars, they could spend more time on each individual car. I wonder if Tesla can pull off a Spirit of Halloween and rent a former Sears lot in Fremont through 2018? All they need is a building and lot that can revolve 8,000 cars through in a 10 day window.

I think Tesla needs to hire a finance professor and fire the other 29,999 people over there that have no idea at all on what they are doing.

I can see your POV, but I think Tesla should prioritize deliveries over quality issues that can be fixed by the service centers to maximize the number of customers who get the full $7,500 tax credit, and to hit their Q3 estimates.

 

[Tozz]

First of all, any reputable car brand won't let this crap happen in the first place---all cars purchased from manufacturers will be meticulously examined and bad apples won't be delivered to customers.

Well, I'm sorry but that is simply not true. There are lots of documented delivery dramas with German brands (see the Audi Q5 movie a few posts up for example). Leaking doors, rattles, horrible paint issues, panel misalignment.. While I agree that the car they delivered to you is horrible, not all cars from other manufacturers are perfect. The term "lemon car" wasn't designed for Tesla, it existed prior to Tesla.

None of this is an excuse for Tesla in regard to your car, but people seem to forget that other brands make mistakes as well. There are plenty of documented horrible deliveries for any brand.

Again, this is not an excuse, but let's not pretend others dont make mistakes.

 

[X Fan]

This is what Tesla needs, specialized prep centers in key strategic locations where the cars are inspected and prepped before being shipped to dealerships. Tesla's local service centers can't inspect for s**t. This is why cars delivered by MB, BMW, etc. are pristine and we don't need to worry about the crappy quality issues---each car spends a week in these centers before going to dealerships so the bad apples would be eliminated and won't be delivered to pissed-off customers. Simple strategy. Mercedes cars spend 10 days in those.

Maybe I should tweet this to Musk.

Sorry, your spiel re: the pristine wonderfulness of BMW & MB is just nonsense.

I’ve owned both brands, S, E class; X5 (4), x3 (2), 5, 2, 1.

Each and every one has had some issue that needed adjustment, repair etc due to failure. Let see, moonroof leaks, uncontrolled window failures, electronics module failures among others.

Fact is many of them use the same part supplier so it’s a common thread when there is an issue.

Moreover, uncontrolled fires seems to be a big issue for BMW right now.

 

[N54TT]

Sorry, your spiel re: the pristine wonderfulness of BMW & MB is just nonsense.

I’ve owned both brands, S, E class; X5 (4), x3 (2), 5, 2, 1.

Each and every one has had some issue that needed adjustment, repair etc due to failure. Let see, moonroof leaks, uncontrolled window failures, electronics module failures among others.

Fact is many of them use the same part supplier so it’s a common thread when there is an issue.

Moreover, uncontrolled fires seems to be a big issue for BMW right now.

I’ve had module failures with my bmw...that can and will happen to any car. The problem here is sloppiness of the actual production and build of the model 3 as well as poor QA. There was reportedly a car that was even delivered with different color door panels....how does that even happen? No one handling the car from factory to delivery center noticed one side was black and the other white? A prep center or appropriate Inspection at the end of the factory line should prevent these issues. Have you had to ask for any of your BMW’s or MB’s to go straight to the body shop for any body work, repairs and repainting when you took delivery of them?

 

[MXWing]

There was reportedly a car that was even delivered with different color door panels....how does that even happen?

How do parents leave their children in hot cars and forget about them?

How do surgeons amputate the wrong limb?

How do doctors prescribe the wrong medication?

I doubt the "check both doors to see if the trim matches" is on anyones checklist. It probably is now but things happen. You fix it and life goes on.

 

[Jedi2155]

I’ve had module failures with my bmw...that can and will happen to any car. The problem here is sloppiness of the actual production and build of the model 3 as well as poor QA. There was reportedly a car that was even delivered with different color door panels....how does that even happen? No one handling the car from factory to delivery center noticed one side was black and the other white?

This has happened to BMW before as well.

https://jalopnik.com/bmw-has-at-least-one-quality-control-inspector-who-play-1793020065