Taycan impact on Model S - a theory I hope is not true

[Tes La Ferrari]

Taycan impact on Model S - a theory I hope is not true.

I was thinking today.

While it lacks Autopilot, Supercharging station access, and the Tesla software know how - the Taycan looks quite compelling from a design and sportswear like performance standpoint (from what Ive read). Porsche has built compelling sports cars in the past.

Given Elon's mission to accelerate the development of sustainable transportation - could he be thinking "mission accomplished" in the Model S segment, and let it just coast along, then eventually kill it ?

Sure, we will be seeing a new interior shortly, and some aero and outside improvements in a few months as has been forecast here, but could the above be true ?

I hope this is not true, and would love to see major developments to keep Model S as the king of this segment.

 

[HX_Guy]

Link is broken.

If the Taycan had Autopilot, Id be all over it.

 

[ucmndd]

I think the Taycan will peel off a lot of performance model buyers from Tesla. I'll be honest though, I don't see a ton of cross shopping at the lower end of the model S spectrum where Tesla has the volume, features, and charging network that these buyers place a higher value on.

 

[VQTRVA]

Taycan impact on Model S - a theory I hope is not true.

I was thinking today.

While it lacks Autopilot, Supercharging station access, and the Tesla software know how - the Taycan looks quite compelling from a design and sportswear like performance standpoint (from what Ive read). Porsche has built compelling sports cars in the past.

Given Elon's mission to accelerate the development of sustainable transportation - could he be thinking "mission accomplished" in the Model S segment, and let it just coast along, then eventually kill it ?

Sure, we will be seeing a new interior shortly, and some aero and outside improvements in a few months as has been forecast here, but could the above be true ?

I hope this is not true, and would love to see major developments to keep Model S as the king of this segment.

Don't cry.

Next-gen Tesla Model S/X rumored to have 3 electric motors, 400+ mile range

 

[Tes La Ferrari]

I think the Taycan will peel off a lot of performance model buyers from Tesla. I'll be honest though, I don't see a ton of cross shopping at the lower end of the model S spectrum where Tesla has the volume, features, and charging network that these buyers place a higher value on.

Although the model S is running late into it's development cycle shape and interior wise - perhaps the free ludicrous and performance price drops are a bit of foreshadowing on this front.

 

[OBX John]

I think it will largely end up electrifying previous Porsche drivers more than stealing buyers from the Model S, but without a charging network in the US, I just don't see it as competitive with Tesla.

It should do quite well in Europe though.

It's a nice looking sports car, but not nearly the all around vehicle the Model S is with all the space in back.

I kind of hope Tesla keeps the basic Model S look and just continually refines it like Porsche has done with the 911.

 

[BBryson]

The announcement that may give some weight to the future of S/X is the announcement by Elon that Model Y production will be in Fremont.

Some estimates are that Y will outsell the current volume of S/X/3 combined. Fremont is big, but something is going to have to give up some space there.

 

[Triplett]

We are at the point where we will start to see serious performance EV's not only from Porsche but BMW, Benz, Audi, etc.

Tesla enjoyed the competitive advantage for a good run but, sooner or later, everybody catches up.

Where Tesla has the advantage, due to it's head start, is in autopilot, with its billions of miles collected, and its supercharger network. The other companies will have a very difficult time catching up to those benchmarks.

 

[cduzz]

I know several people in that demographic.

They will buy a tesla if the tesla has 400 miles of range and ability to spend 2 weeks at the airport without a hickup and can add 150 miles in 5 minutes at a SC station (without waiting for the plebs in their econo Y SUVs to get out of the way)

They will likely not buy any other electric car unless it can do the same *and* has an extensive charger network.

 

[Tes La Ferrari]

\

I kind of hope Tesla keeps the basic Model S look and just continually refines it like Porsche has done with the 911.

I agree that the 911 approach Porsche has taken over the years with the recognizable sillhouette was a good one. How ever if you look at the various series of body style changes they are very dramatic.

Take the 993 to 996 to 997 to 991 to 992 transitions -- all 911's but virtually no body panels shared in virtually all of these cases. Each car was completely different than the one before it, but the shape remained classically recognizable as a Porsche 911

 

[Tes La Ferrari]

Don't cry.

Next-gen Tesla Model S/X rumored to have 3 electric motors, 400+ mile range

Hope this is true -- they are calling for September to be the release time for this. Hopefully it takes a more aggressive take on the existing styling in the spirit of what the video alludes to.

 

[mtndrew1]

The Taycan is a little car and the Model S is... not. I’m sure there will be a bit of cross shopping but the S is a fundamentally different product on the cusp of a refresh.

They can both live together in the market in harmony without stepping on each other’s toes.

Here’s a pic of a Taycan between a BMW i3 and a Chevy Bolt.

 

[GOVA]

The Taycan is a little car and the Model S is... not. I’m sure there will be a bit of cross shopping but the S is a fundamentally different product on the cusp of a refresh.

They can both live together in the market in harmony without stepping on each other’s toes.

Here’s a pic of a Taycan between a BMW i3 and a Chevy Bolt.

View attachment 416268

Wow, I am shocked. This thing is so small. I think the Model S is going to be fine.

 

[Spalding]

There will surely be some people buying a Taycan who would have otherwise bought an S. The Taycan will probably be a very good, well-made car, even if its batteries and electrics won't be as advanced as Tesla's. It will also probably be more expensive than advertised. Porsche's long-standing practice is that the base price for a car is usually increased by 30, 50 or even 75 % once all the options you really want to have are added. Does anyone really think they'll resist the temptation to add pricey options to the Taycan to make it more profitable? (But ok, Tesla should too - I'd pay good money for, say, a functioning sunroof. Why leave money on the table?)

But I think a larger percentage of Taycan buyers will be dyed-in-the-wool Porsche fans, of which there are plenty. They will buy it because of the Porsche badge, and probably wouldn't have considered a Tesla for any number of reasons - just like they also wouldn't have considered a Benz, a BMW, or many other ICE cars. And they will love the car - as Porsche owners usually do.

Regardless, over time, the increasing number and Porsche fans' fawning reviews of the Taycan will have the effect of "normalizing" BEVs in the eyes of consumers in general. Future BEV sales growth will come more from ICE cars rather than cannibalizing each other.

 

[VQTRVA]

Hope this is true -- they are calling for September to be the release time for this. Hopefully it takes a more aggressive take on the existing styling in the spirit of what the video alludes to.

I wouldn't be worried with timelines esp. when it comes to Tesla.

I rather they just build the best Model S they can & bring it to market.
Superficial changes are fleeting due to taste.
But the underneath hardware & software improvements are where it counts for me esp. vs. legacy car & newbie competitors.

7 years is not too long a time frame between redesign esp. if the cars are build to last 500K+ miles & keep getting those updates.

 

[VQTRVA]

The Taycan is a little car and the Model S is... not. I’m sure there will be a bit of cross shopping but the S is a fundamentally different product on the cusp of a refresh.

They can both live together in the market in harmony without stepping on each other’s toes.

Here’s a pic of a Taycan between a BMW i3 and a Chevy Bolt.

View attachment 416268

Could be Model 3 sized.

 

[mtndrew1]

There will surely be some people buying a Taycan who would have otherwise bought an S. The Taycan will probably be a very good, well-made car, even if its batteries and electrics won't be as advanced as Tesla's. It will also probably be more expensive than advertised. Porsche's long-standing practice is that the base price for a car is usually increased by 30, 50 or even 75 % once all the options you really want to have are added. Does anyone really think they'll resist the temptation to add pricey options to the Taycan to make it more profitable? (But ok, Tesla should too - I'd pay good money for, say, a functioning sunroof. Why leave money on the table?)

But I think a larger percentage of Taycan buyers will be dyed-in-the-wool Porsche fans, of which there are plenty. They will buy it because of the Porsche badge, and probably wouldn't have considered a Tesla for any number of reasons - just like they also wouldn't have considered a Benz, a BMW, or many other ICE cars. And they will love the car - as Porsche owners usually do.

Regardless, over time, the increasing number and Porsche fans' fawning reviews of the Taycan will have the effect of "normalizing" BEVs in the eyes of consumers in general. Future BEV sales growth will come more from ICE cars rather than cannibalizing each other.

I agree with you. The Porsche is guaranteed to be immaculately assembled down the last millimeter with flawless paint and an opulent (if traditional) interior. It will handle brilliantly. It will occupy a garage with three other Porsches and an SUV or two.

But if you want something to stuff three kids and a spouse into and hit the road the Taycan probably won’t be the right product. The Model S and the Taycan are shaping up to be quite different products and that’s okay. It also means there won’t be a lot of cross shopping or defection in either direction.

Should be a neat car though. Can’t wait to see it.

 

[mtndrew1]

Could be Model 3 sized.

Yeah maybe. I’d love to see a comparison test between a $60k M3P and a $100k Taycan.

The Porsche will certainly sweep on interior quality and fit/finish but I bet the M3P will give it a good run for its money. Then after the track the Tesla can take a random road trip across the country ;-)

 

[CarlK]

The top "Turbo" version is said to be costing $140,000 before options which, in the traditional Porsche fashion, likely will add a lot to the cost. On the other hand the $60,000 Model 3 performance can beat most 911 models on the track not to mention techs in the car Porsche will never have. Will there be enough suckers, err customers, to pay that kind of money for one only because of the Porsche name remains to be seen. I serious doubt there will be that many of them though. Even well to do people are not complete fools.

 

[AirKuhl]

I'm probably in the target demographic. I replaced a 911 with a Model S partially because my kids outgrew the rear seats. Now I have a Taycan reserved to replace the MS.

In the 3 years I've owned my MS, I rarely used the superchargers. Having it topped off every morning has met my needs 99.9% of the time. I did do a 1200 mile road trip, partly through quite desolate areas, which was nicely uneventful with the usual planning involved to avoid range anxiety.

Porsche will have their own super-fast superchargers at their US dealerships and along the usual highways, about 500 locations to start. Since Porsche VW and Audi are all the same parent company, the Taycan will also be chargeable on VW's $2B Electrify America charging network, as well as the usual existing open standard charging stations. Certainly not up to Tesla's current (heh) standards, but enough to avoid range anxiety in most of the country.

I think the Taycan is a very reasonable alternative to either the MS or M3, depending on how you rank feature importance and what trim level Taycan you price out. At MS P100D pricing, that's a fully loaded top performance tier Cross Turismo, which will have excellent storage, far better fit and finish, a better dynamic experience, and (sadly) a much better service than recent Tesla standards. That's my impartial take, I loved my MS, 911's, Cayenne Hybrid, etc. I just buy the best one for my needs or wants at the time. If Tesla manages itself out of this weird rut it's in now, perhaps I'll replace the Taycan with a Tesla Roadster in 2023.